Good news for GMC Chrysler and Ford.

[Lionheart]

We can thank the unions for the demise of the American car companies. How long did they think this could go on? Pay and benefits until you die? Do that math.

I quite agree. Their days did help people out from rough, abusive situations. But today, people need to make 'reasonable' pay salaries or the companies cannot afford to pay them. Reality check. You cannot pay a guy $50.00 an hour to go around with an oil can, oiling a big chain. Stupid...


I had 2 Chrysler Lazers and one Dodge Daytona, and they ran great! Back in 1988 though. Man I loved those things. I did need to rebuild the turbo's engine, as I spun a bearing, being at idiot to the powerful little 2.2.

......

Mike (Moe), that is horrible about your truck fleet. Isuzu make some brilliant trucks. They just keep running and running. They have (some) aircooled Diesels.

Note that DHL is desolving and selling off their used fleet of trucks. You could probably pick up some there in fine condition, used.

.......

Quote:Originally Posted by Lionheart
... Toyota is running with the ball and making cars that people want, ...

Sorry Bill, Toyota will never make a car that I want ...

Nor none of the rest of them regardless that they are now made in the states by American citizens ...

Snuffy

No worries man. Free country. :d I only like a couple of their cars myself, like the Prius.

At least they make them here, which means Americans have jobs and will have food on their plates and they will not be homeless.

.......................

Yeah, GM screwed up big time with electric car. Now, if this company can make an electric car with up to a 300 mile range and be a sports car too, why in h3ll can't the Not So Big 3 make an affordable electric car for everyone?

GT182

gm had the American electric car market 'in' their pockets, and they would have owned California. But instead, they went to war with California, destroyed all the electric cars, ruined it for public views on them in green cars and electrics, and now they are going out of business while groups like Toyota are so filled with business they need more factories.



Bill

 

[hey_moe]

Holy chet...you had a car that had 2000000 miles on it....I get rid of ours when they hit 50,000.....sometimes before then.I start to sweat at 450000...lol

when i came to canada i gave away an 87 toyota tercel that had almost 200k on the clock. it ran like a sewing machine, and never had a rebuild. i've owned many american cars, and never once have i owned one that i could say that about. frankly, i don't care how well ford makes their cars. i would never drive one if you gave it to me. they support ideas i disagree with big time. i won't support them because of it.

 

[Cazzie]

I am going to tell you something Helldiver, I would still own a Ford, if Ford in Detroit would sell the European Ford Focus wagon in the US, in lieu of the generic Mexican Ford Focus sold here in only a two-door and four-door version.

I owned a 2001 Focus Wagon, European model, build in Norfolk, VA at Ford's truck assembly plant. best darn car I ever owned until this teenage girl went out of control and T-boned it at 40 mph or thereabouts; it's hard to tell how fast a car is going when it is coming at you sideways! But I will give testimony to the safety built into a Focus then, it buckled and bent everywhere it needed to save the cockpit. In any other vehicle I have ever owned, I would guarantee you I would have had lower extremity injuries. I did not have so much as a sore foot! Unfortunately the airbag deployment broke my sturnam. But both of my boys escaped completely unscathed.

Show me anybody these days that make a decent C-body station wagon anymore (and I am not speaking of 5-door hatchbacks like my Honda Fit) and I'm a buyer. So is my wife. She is leaning toward a VW Jetta Wagon, for the simple fact that other than Subaru's Forester and Outback, there is not another car maker that makes a decent, small station wagon in the US. Focus has a beautiful wagon in Europe, why don't they bring it back here? I'd be on their buyer's list and so would my wife. The problem with American cars lies in the upper management wanting niche vehicles, copy-cat vehicles for each brand, SUVs, fully equipped pick up trucks (very hard to find a stripped P/U on a dealer's lot these days), and huge gas consuming 4-door sedans in lieu of an average Joe's car.

When Detroit begins making a cost-effective, fuel-efficient vehicle like my Focus Wagon again, I'll be in the market for an American car. As it is, I shall stick with a very thrifty, very utilitarian small Japanese car made in Ohio!

Caz

 

[cheezyflier]

Holy chet...you had a car that had 2000000 miles on it....I get rid of ours when they hit 50,000.....sometimes before then.I start to sweat at 450000...lol

heck, at 50k they aren't but barely broken in!
i had that much on my last touring bike by the time i paid it off.

 

[Wittpilot]

Nor none of the rest of them regardless that they are now made in the states by American citizens ...

Snuffy,
I work in a Honda plant here in Ohio...Honda employs tens of thousands of people here in the midwest, not only the assembly plants, but the suppliers for the parts. With regards to your quote above, I think the average line worker; though bitchy, whiny, annoying, and sometimes honestly down right ignorant, are hard workers, it is the management at such places that the ones that are the idiots. I heard someone the other day say that things were much better, i.e. quality and such, were significantly higher/better when the Japanese were in charge of everything when the plants first opened.....

-witt

 

[Helldiver]

I've always had a Corporate Car. Either a Mercury Grand Marquis or a Ford Crown Victoria. It was the last of the truly American cars, having a full frame, V-8 power and rear wheel drive. It was the last limosine. I never had a bit of trouble with any of them. They were the standard vehicle for all Police Departments, including the Moscow, Russia Police.
I gave the last one to my son-in-law. He now has better that 250,000 miles on it, commuting between Dover, New Hampshire to Boston. It doesn't burn a bit of oil. But Ford, in it's infinite wisdom, decided not to build them any more.
By the way I got 20 to 24 MPG. Not too bad for all that wonderful protective metal around you.
Now they build things so cheap that you have to resort to airbags and seat belt in hopes that it will save you from your frameless, gutless, automobiles.
I've spent most of my driving life without needing them.

 

[EasyEd]

Hey All,

So many things to comment on...

1) Why isn't a Honda Fit made in Ohio an American made car?

2) Why shouldn't companies that make pension deals not be forced to live up to them? It seems to me that had those companies simply saved the cash to pay for those pensions instead of treating future pension payouts as a bill to be dealt with with future income there would not be a problem. Yes the companies would have had to pay lower dividends and fly Cessna 172s instead of jets but wasn't that the whole idea when they made the deal? Or did they bet on the come - that the money will be there.

Maybe the whole problem is companies always trying to get the cash right here right now instead of putting the cash away to pay a future debt. In too many ways we discount the future in order to get the cash right now - it is easy one of the biggest problems on earth.

You can blame Unions but I believe there are two sides to labor/management negotiations and most likely the Unions were more honest in that they were aggressively trying to protect their future while companies used the "put off" of the pension problem to the future as a way to sidestep the consequences of the really bad deals they made. That said didn't they make the deals?

3) Who the hey is government to have a holier than thou attitude? Didn't government starting back in the 80's want to deregulate everything based on ethics and honourable competition and the market as the perfect mechanism for saving mankind? Couldn't government have required pension protection? I look at it this way - should the company who made the deal pay or should the taxpayer when the social costs start to roll in (welfare, food stamps, etc)?

4) Closing down all those dealerships thus basically downsizing the companies will have ripple effects beyond direct employment: parts makers, suppliers, stores, the local stores who depend on their business, sponsorships of community activities, hassles with respect to warranty work (drive a 100 miles not 5 mins) and on it goes. What are all these people as well as the others gonna do when unemployment runs out? Does anybody actually believe that entrepreneurship and innovation is gonna work for 100s of thousands of unemployed in a world dominated by mega-corps? If so I've got a deal for you - cash small bills please. Just how well thought out is all this by government?

5) Ford really did have a better idea. Henry believed in an inexpensive car that everyone could afford - Is this basic philosophy alive and well in car manufacturing today? Henry Ford believed in paying his workers well and in fact lost in court when he wanted to give employees a raise while stockholders said no the money is ours not the employees - it's called fiduciary responsibility. Henry was a good man. He understood what almost nobody does anymore - labor is first and foremost people - not just a resource.

6) Seems there was more to comment on but this'll do for now.

-Ed-

PS One last comment. To me the real failure here is not business and not unions but government. It is government's responsibility to grow a backbone instead of a wishbone and make the rules so that we all (now the whole world with globalization) can play nice in the sandbox we call earth. The job is even bigger now than it was in the past - can government measure up?

 

[Henry]

I have had 7 Chrysler's in the past 12 years
that includes Family members also
1 jeep, 1 dodge neon made it to 100,000
1 Plymouth Breeze daughter ran a stop sign,
4 Seabring convertibles 2 new 2 used

i love them
I looked at toyota convertibles
i still prefer Chrysler's
the latest one i have is underpowered
and the roof goes in the trunk
so no space whet the top is down
if you open the door while the top is in operation
The radio quits
but i get 30 mpg on the hwy
H

 

[Roger]

The British car industry was killed off in the 80s and it seems like the US indigenous car industry is dying off in this recession.
A jump forward was required to leap-frog all the quality and longevity offered by the Japanese but the UK car industry was so backward that nothing could save it. However in the US, GM had researched and produced some incredible specs for electric cars...wow...and then junked them all.
Whoever, at GM ordered that should be the first up against the wall, come the revolution of Common Sense.

 

[David_L6]

No problems with Chevys here......

1995 Suburban: 3 1/2 years; 50,000 miles. No problems to speak of.

1999 Silverado: 9 1/2 years; 165,000 miles. No problems to speak of.
My son is still driving it. Now has ~180,000 miles on it.

2008 Silverado: 1 year; ~16,000 miles. No problems so far.....

 

[euroastar350]

I absolutely love my 2000 KIA Sephia

 

[CrashnBurns]

Follow the money. Toyota trucks may be built in Texas, but the $$ goes home to Japan, therefore, they are Japanese trucks. GM trucks may be built in Mexico, but the money comes here. Ergo, they are American trucks. As are the trucks built in Pontiac, Flint, Fort Wayne, Arlington, and until recently, Janesville, Moraine and Oshawa, Ontario. It doesn't matter where they are assembled, the money comes here.

Would I prefer that they were all assembled in the US? Of course. Not going to happen, though, so we are forced to live with what we have. The money that comes back to the US pays the 40,000 or so people that design the next round of vehicles for GM.

Toyota is not some group of mythical supermen, take a look at their 1st quarter performance! Everyone is taking it in the shorts.

Glad some here liked the SSR, we sold everyone we made. But they were what they were. Not a work truck, a cruiser. They weren't made for hauling cement blocks ... golf clubs, maybe.

Glad as well that the Acadia seems to be a hit. Can't seem to make enought of that line of vehicles. While other GM plants are taking time off, they (Lansing, MI) are working OT!

The Volt looks to be a major change to the auto industry as well. I can't wait to see the first one come down the line (Hamtramck, MI).

Crash

 

[BurningBeard]

I'm the car companies worst nightmare, I'm driving a 1966 Ford half ton. My dad bought it when it had 7 miles on the clock. In 43 years it has had the transmission replace once, 1 rear end, and on a whim we replaced the engine (20 years ago). My other truck is a '77 Ford half ton, (1 transmission and one engine replacement). By the way I have a '60 bugeye in the garage, and my wife drive a late model Cadillac CTS.

Beard

 

[simkid22]

A lot of the cars I would buy (given I had the money ) that would say Ford or GM aren't even sold in the states. Ford dropped the Focus hatch and wagon for the sedan and coupe and the RS and ST isn't even sold in the states. The main GMs I like are badged Holden Vauxhall or Opel. They seem to be doing to right, or at least better over seas, why does Detroit not think it will work here?

 

[Willy]

I've always done very well with GM pickups. My last one was a 1997 Cheyenne pickup that I traded in a couple of months ago with 150,000 on it (pic was taken the day it rolled over 150K). Driving a '05 GMC Sierra now and love it.

Speaking of the new dealer's nightmare... last new vehicle I bought was a '89 GMC S-15 Jimmy. I prefer to buy late model used now. They don't lose as much value when you drive 'em off the lot as a new one does.

 

[crashaz]

My brother's Nissan van has been in the shop 5 times in the last 6 months.. and has had to wait weeks for parts to arrive from the Land of the Rising Sun.

Had a 70 GMC pickup as my first vehicle... it had over 300 K miles on it... needed a valve job bad... but that sucker was stoubt! Rebuilt that 350, bored .040 over ... raced in it.

A personal choice for me... I buy American cars. I own a Chevy Tahoe... Texas truck built here in Arlington.

Want to get that car from Bowling Green Ky....wonder how they manage to keep C series car fast, sleek and with MPG?!

 

[Brian_Gladden]

The only import car I've ever owned was an old late 80 vintage Volvo Station wagon. I'd probably still be driving it if it hadn't rusted out.

Keep in mind that I've never owned a new car in my life. Most I've ever spent on a vehicle is $5,000.

Other than that, I've owned 3 Chrysler products in my life, a 77 Volare, a 90 Dakota and an 84 Horizon. Only one I'd ever want back is the Volare. Horizon was a $200 beater I bought for a winter car that blew it's transmission two weeks after I bought it and the Dakota was a money pit. Paid $5,000 for it and put over $2,500 worth of repairs into it in two and a half years (Brakes every 3,000 miles and one blown up manual transmission)

Had good luck with my various GM's (mid 80's-early 90's A bodies, Celebrity, Olds Cutlass) My Celebrity probably saved my life due to it's good construction. (I got hit in the drivers door by a Jeep Grand Cherokee doing 60 mph)

That said. I have been a mostly Ford guy since My early 20's. I've owned a succession of Ranger pickups (Four) Two Thunderbirds, three Taurus/Sables, A 71 LTD a 77 Ranchero, a Windstar, A Tempo and currently, a Crown Victoria.

All but one of the Taurus' (An SHO, special case) and the Ranchero (Wrecked) made in excess of 150,000 miles and in the case of my Sable and my Windstar, broke 200,000.

Last I heard from the guy who bought it from the dealer after I traded it, my 86 T-Bird made over 400,000 miles on it's second engine and transmission. Had 90,000 when I traded it for the Dakota... I was stupid.

All cars break down. Especially when you buy used like I do. I was a Ford parts guy for nearly 8 years so I know what to look for. I tend to stick to my Blue Ovals.

If I won the lottery this week, there'd be a brand new F-250 in the front yard right next to my new Mustang GT.


Too bad GM closed Pontiac. I was looking forward to seeing one of those re-badged Holden Ute's.

Only import you could get me into would be a European car, most likely a VW or another Volvo. I'd take a Land Rover Defender 90 too.


Brian

 

[Dangerousdave26]

HD ........ they couldn't 'Top' a bottom of the range KIA!
'Ford' and 'Quality' are two words that never appear in the same sentence.

Wombat I am going to possibley rain on your parade but back in 1998 / 1999 I worked for a Ford Dealer and at that time Ford owned 40% of KIA. They provided alot of the know how to build the KIA line.

HD RGR on the Mercury Grand Marquis. I had the LS model from 1990 until 2003 and put 187,000 miles on it with no trouble. I then rebuilt the engine and transmission and drove it for another 75,000 miles before the rest of it started to fall apart...

Slowly.

Find me another Marquis in that vintage with less than 50,000 miles and I will buy it in a heart beat.

 

[redriver6]

'new' member of the family....1989 F150....with about 136K miles..

 

[Marvin Carter]

All GM has to do to get back in the black is start making the 57 chevy belair two door hard top again, best car ever made, and just plane cool looking.hehe!!!
Marvin Carter