Thoughts of Orbx PNW products (keep a civil tongue)

[OleBoy]

Comment;

Orbx could seriously better their products of the PNW. If all their scenery is done in the same lack-lustre, generic sort of placement from what I've seen while flying Orbx PNW Blue, personally, I really don't see a lot that's unique to this region short of airports, static objects and trees. It is nicer than default. What I don't understand, is they obviously have the tools to do the scenery. I just don't see it being done as good as it could be. I was to the understanding that the idea in their scenery was created more to the VFR type pilots.

Final thoughts; The more I fly the scenery, I think the Orbx PNW has an orbx-generic-visual-appearance, and really lacks for what the Pacific Northwest really is.

No disrespect intended

Just for the record, I live in the Pacific Northwest. I expect more from scenery that I have to purchase. So, I added my rating for the topic. Mainly a quality-to-region rating

I'd like to hear from others, their honest opinions, that live in the region. Don't mis-interpret my comment.
....The scenery is nice. But, could be so much better than what it is. Beyond the airport additions that seem to be the norm.
Their scenery seems to be by region. I'd like to see it created that way for where we live.

 

[mmann]

Orbx uses the cookie cutter approach to the airports they include in a regional package. Every time I fly into one, the song "Little Boxes" by Pete Seeger keeps running through my mind. It looks like they have used a satellite image and then placed a generic type building to match the size and position of the buildings shown on the image. Remember also that the regional packages are considered almost a loss leader to Orbx; their money maker is the individual airports that they sell for these regions, and those airports are extremely well done and also very accurate.

Regards, Mike Mann

 

[OleBoy]

Mike, you are correct about the cookie cutter approach, but how long, really, do we spend at airports short of landing and taking off. I don't live in an airport and sleep in my plane. If I did, I guess that would consider me a bum and a vagrant. I get into a plane to fly and see the scenery! Once in the air I see a big generic puzzle.

 

[mmann]

Once in the air I see a big generic puzzle.

You are absolutely right about that!! Flying with Orbx PNW enabled is prettier than using UTX, GEX with FSGenesis but not more realistic. When flying parts of Vancouver Island I have found that UTX Canada has a great deal more of the secondary logging roads represented than does Orbx, and UTX covers the whole country!

Regards, Mike Mann

 

[OleBoy]

You are absolutely right about that!! Flying with Orbx PNW enabled is prettier than using UTX, GEX with FSGenesis but not more realistic. When flying parts of Vancouver Island I have found that UTX Canada has a great deal more of the secondary logging roads represented than does Orbx, and UTX covers the whole country!

Regards, Mike Mann

I think we're on the same page in terms of "generic" I'll also quote a previous comment.

Remember also that the regional packages are considered almost a loss leader to Orbx; their money maker is the individual airports that they sell for these regions, and those airports are extremely well done and also very accurate

http://www.sim-outhouse.com/sohforu...-civil-tongue)&p=587340&viewfull=1#post587340

 

[DaveKDEN]

All things considered, you're getting a lot of bang for your buck with ORBx products. Having recently purchased Northern Rocky Mountains, and having owned PNW since it came out, I'm very happy. No, it's not 100% correct - and there are some problems that should be addressed, but how much do you really want to spend on an add-on scenery product? I have no doubt the team could add many more details, but it would take time and most certainly add a significant amount to the cost. ORBx has to balance those factors when building their products. Also considering MS Flight's coming release (who really knows when), how many are willing to spend a lot of cash on what will soon be an antiquated product.

Oh yea, grew up in WA state.

 

[heywooood]

I bought PNW because it looks so much better than default FSX...

I did not assume it would perfectly replicate the region to the last brick and stone because that would be a stupendous undertaking...but for color, texture, shorelines, forestation etc it is worth the money spent. I do wish I could get higher frame rates with it but isn't that always the case, and less ORBX fault than microsofts...

That said, I am not sure I will buy the Southwest when it becomes available as that is where I live, and too much familiarity would probably make me too critical as well.

 

[OleBoy]

Regarding the last two posts, come on guys, I'm not knocking the scenery at all. I'm saying, it can be better. Far better. And as for the cost, the better it looks, the better my virtual experience. Which is exactly why I am into all this flight simulator stuff to begin with. Cost is not relevant to virtual realism IMHO.

And to add, How many times do we have to keep buying what could be the best there is available. Orbx can do better. So why not push them to make it better? It's a win/win for them, and their consumers.

 

[spotlope]

Sooner or later, every dev who tries hard enough can finally be the victim of their own success, I suppose. Just the other day, I got raked over the coals by a Cushman Meadows user because he was unhappy that I used such a large photo-real area in the scenery. He preferred the generic landclass textures. What can you do but roll your eyes?

OleBoy, try turning off the Orbx stuff entirely and flying over the PNW for a while, then let me know how poorly we did it. I think you may be so used to what you're seeing that you forget how far it's come.

 

[spotlope]

Regarding the last two posts, come on guys, I'm not knocking the scenery at all. I'm saying, it can be better. Far better. And as for the cost, the better it looks, the better my virtual experience. Which is exactly why I am into all this flight simulator stuff to begin with. Cost is not relevant to virtual realism IMHO.

And to add, How many times do we have to keep buying what could be the best there is available. Orbx can do better. So why not push them to make it better? It's a win/win for them, and their consumers.

We're pushing to make things better all the time. New tech (TextureFlow, PeopleFlow, ObjectFlow), new features (3D grass, trees with leaves that actually fall the love love of Mike!). We patch, we update, we relentlessly pursue making it better. Honestly, it's hard not to get hot under the collar when I see posts like this. I'm not gonna, though, because it's not worth it.

 

[OleBoy]

I'm not meaning to get anyone flared at the collar. Not at all my intentions in my post. Which is why I added, out of respect for Orbx and the creators "keep it civil".

OleBoy, try turning off the Orbx stuff entirely and flying over the PNW for a while, then let me know how poorly we did it. I think you may be so used to what you're seeing that you forget how far it's come.

No, I know what it looks like Bill. I'm new to FSX from an autogen/density perspective. And performance. But since I got this new machine, it really enhanced my virtual reality ten fold. I have UT for the USA, Canada, etc. Along with Ground Environment. That stuff never gets activated because I fly specifically Orbx in my region because they are the best to date, visually.

I'm not complaining really. More of voicing to say, it can be a lot better. I expected it to be a lot better. And I'm voicing that to let them know now.

I'm a member of Orbx forums. But their forums are a cluster. Needs to all get flushed except for relevant information and start fresh

 

[Kiwikat]

We're pushing to make things better all the time. New tech (TextureFlow, PeopleFlow, ObjectFlow), new features (3D grass, trees with leaves that actually fall the love love of Mike!). We patch, we update, we relentlessly pursue making it better. Honestly, it's hard not to get hot under the collar when I see posts like this. I'm not gonna, though, because it's not worth it.

I am absolutely positive the ratio of people who enjoy their orbx products to those who don't is far higher than any other scenery company.

When I fly in non-orbx regions, they look flat at best. Your sceneries bring much needed life and realism to the simulator. :ernae:

 

[mmann]

That said, I am not sure I will buy the Southwest when it becomes available as that is where I live, and too much familiarity would probably make me too critical as well.

I think you hit the nail on the head! My problem is that I know (and love) Vancouver Island; I guess I too was quite disappointed that the freeware Victoria Plus (by Don Grovestine, Jon Patch and Holger Sandmann) was so much more realistic than the Orbx representation of the area.

Regards, Mike Mann

 

[OleBoy]

I am absolutely positive the ratio of people who enjoy their orbx products to those who don't is far higher than any other scenery company.

When I fly in non-orbx regions, they look flat at best. Your sceneries bring much needed life and realism to the simulator. :ernae:

I agree 100%

To add, Google Earth is a great tool.

 

[spotlope]

I'm not meaning to get anyone flared at the collar. Not at all my intentions in my post. Which is why I added, out of respect for Orbx and the creators "keep it civil".

No, I know what it looks like Bill. I'm new to FSX from an autogen/density perspective. And performance. But since I got this new machine, it really enhanced my virtual reality ten fold. I have UT for the USA, Canada, etc. Along with Ground Environment. That stuff never gets activated because I fly specifically Orbx in my region because they are the best to date, visually.

I'm not complaining really. More of voicing to say, it can be a lot better. I expected it to be a lot better. And I'm voicing that to let them know now.

I'm a member of Orbx forums. But their forums are a cluster. Needs to all get flushed except for relevant information and start fresh

How in the world did your expectations get set for the scenery in the first place? Looking at the reams of screenshots online from our staff or many satisfied customers? Watching the dozens of gorgeous videos that have been produced featuring the PNW? Reading reviews? Honestly, between ourselves and our fans, there's ample opportunity to educate yourself on exactly what you're getting with the scenery before purchase. If, once you've gotten it, you're mad that it doesn't make you coffee or simonize your car, there's not much we can do about that.

 

[DaveKDEN]

Regarding the last two posts, come on guys, I'm not knocking the scenery at all. I'm saying, it can be better. Far better. And as for the cost, the better it looks, the better my virtual experience. Which is exactly why I am into all this flight simulator stuff to begin with. Cost is not relevant to virtual realism IMHO.

And to add, How many times do we have to keep buying what could be the best there is available. Orbx can do better. So why not push them to make it better? It's a win/win for them, and their consumers.

I know you're not necessarily trying to knock ORBx. My opinion is that I feel you get quite a bit of bang for your buck - that's all.
As for cost not being relevant to virtual realism for you, that rule doesn't apply to most. ORBx has to balance that simple fact.

 

[OleBoy]

How in the world did your expectations get set for the scenery in the first place? Looking at the reams of screenshots online from our staff or many satisfied customers? Watching the dozens of gorgeous videos that have been produced featuring the PNW? Reading reviews? Honestly, between ourselves and our fans, there's ample opportunity to educate yourself on exactly what you're getting with the scenery before purchase. If, once you've gotten it, you're mad that it doesn't make you coffee or simonize your car, there's not much we can do about that.

Uh Oh. I never knew that a "making coffee add-on", or "simonizing flow add-on" was available? Kidding!!

Bill, I looked at, and watched all the videos and photos I could ever find. I also spent quite a bit of time at the Orbx forum reading before ever considering. I don't buy anything based on strictly opinions, because everyone has one in a different aspect.

Short of that, that's my best answer for my expectations.

To add to, All the pictures and videos (most) are based around airports Orbx has created as their focus. Which is all good. Great I mean. My whole subject is based on the scenery in a general aspect of generic-ness in look. Meaning more of a patch work quilt from an aerial perspective from a VFR product as they lure.

 

[spotlope]

Uh Oh. I never knew that a "making coffee add-on", or "simonizing flow add-on" was available? Kidding!!

Bill, I looked at, and watched all the videos and photos I could ever find. I also spent quite a bit of time at the Orbx forum reading before ever considering. I don't buy anything based on strictly opinions, because everyone has one in a different aspect.

Short of that, that's my best answer for my expectations.

To add to, All the pictures and videos (most) are based around airports Orbx has created as their focus. Which is all good. Great I mean. My whole subject is based on the scenery in a general aspect of generic-ness in look. Meaning more of a patch work quilt from an aerial perspective from a VFR product as they lure.

Then your complaint is with the FSX landclass system, not Orbx. We've done a lot of really great things with the toolbox we were given by MS, but there are limits.

Out of curiosity, who in your opinion does this stuff better than Orbx? That's a real question, not baiting. Knowing who your favorite scenery designers are would help me understand why you seem so frustrated with our stuff.

 

[limjack]

Once I downloaded PNW there was no going back. I was even collecting the mega scenery earth of this area and that has now sat idle. Simply put I have never had a scenery package quite like this one. I feel like I am right at home when flying in the NW scenery and almost feel as though I took a real trip to the places that I have visited all around here. Also my rig is almost 3 years old and has no issues running the scenery package as long as I go low and slow. Can it get better? O yes, I expect it will as the carrot is alway hanging ahead of us and as our rigs can handle more I bet the scenery complexity will increase. Gotta keep the carrot ahead to help drive us all and I am loving it!

Thanks Orbx for such a awesome product!!!!

Jim

 

[Bruce Thompson]

What's up Oleboy, you board again?

I think it would be wise for the Mods to lock this thread, before it becomes very uncivil.

I don't like the idea that I should be asked for my opinion under the "Keep it Civil" banner,
that implies that the product is in some way at fault, which in my and no doubt other users it is not.