12oclock high , movie question

[loverboy1]

dont feel off topic , on ww2 -b17, and yes ive googled ...getting alot of variations on my question ..so im hopinh someone here that has expereicvne from this study era can help me


my question :


it appears b17 was stronger in its formation flying for the defense of survival ..over germany ,,why so many where hit and taking down ....

thanks

joshua

 

[blackbaron427]

try shooting skeet and thats about what its like to try and hit a plane flying 350mph. not only that, but German fighters had 20 and 30 mm cannons that had greater range than a 50cal bullet. its the old law the side that won was the one that hit the other side the "firstest with the mostest"

 

[sandar]

The simple answer is there is no simple answer.

The theory was that if the B17's stayed in tight formation, the covering fire from all of the bombers would make for the best defensive position. Unfortunately for them, no one told the German pilots.

One good hit from a cannon shell could slow down a bomber and it would almost inevitably fall out of formation where it would be at its most vulnerable. In 1942 to 1943 the P38's P47's and Spitfires couldn't escort the bombers into Germany, they hadn't the range, so the bombers were vulnerable throughout their time over Germany. The introduction of the P51D altered that.

The German tactics varied, but one of the most effective, if dangerous, was the head on attack where fewer American guns could be brought to bear. One high speed pass, determinedly struck, could be devastating. High speed 'hit and run' attacks from above also took a heavy toll of the bombers. The 109's and 190's would attack from above, open fire when in range, get out of range as quick as possible and if they had any ammunition left,they would climb for another pass.

The Germans also used proximity rockets,which were fired at bomber formations from a 'safe' distance and exploded close to the bombers with similar results to accurate flak. Although frighteningly devastating if they were used and properly worked, it was not the most effective weapon.

Talking of flak, the German flak was superior by far to any allied anti aircraft artillery until the last year of the war. The impressive 88mm AA gun with accurate and reliable proximity fuses, especially when radar guided, made it a deadly weapon.

Once a bomber was out of formation over Germany, very few survived the predations of flak or fighters.

 

[loverboy1]

thank yhou for your input ...very informative for me . tied the l;oose ends up in my mind ....still sad , in the movie 12oclock high , he told his men condsider yourself dead already this way you wont worry as much and focus on group mission

tks

loverboy1

 

[SLIP STREAM]

L.b. thats because very few planes or men survived 25 missions.if youv'e seen the movie memphis belle.that was one of the few planes and crews that survived their 25.the plane and crew were all patched back togeather. and were sent to the U.S. and toured for war bond sales.

 

[Autothrottle]

Speaking of Proximity rockets, why are the rockets in CFS3 not adept to this feature? They are so innacurate when firing on a bomber stream.

 

[sandar]

Speaking of Proximity rockets, why are the rockets in CFS3 not adept to this feature? They are so innacurate when firing on a bomber stream.

As I said in my response earlier, "Although frighteningly devastating if they were used and properly worked, it was not the most effective weapon".

They were not reliable nor very accurate and by the time they were used there were too many inexperienced and poorly trained German combat pilots who did not know how to make best use of the assets they had.
Maybe the CFS3 rockets are accurately portraying the poor performance of the real thing.