A word about "cleanliness" in flight simulation.....

[Willy]

THAT is but one of the reasons I retired at exactly 20 years. Another reason was the lack of respect for authority by many of the young sailors reporting for duty. When I first came into the Navy, you didn't dare talk back to a superior. A Petty Officer First Class was considered almost God, and a Chief WAS God! By the time I retired, I had to deal with more than a few boots who not only would question my orders to them, but quite often would tell me to $%#& off. Needless to say, I took immediate corrective action. But the Navy removed a lot of the power of the Chief to discipline now.

NC

Pretty much the same here when I decided to call it a career at the 20 years and a couple of days mark. It got to where to even attempt to correct one of the "little darlings" required a paper trail several weeks long.

 

[tigisfat]

THAT is but one of the reasons I retired at exactly 20 years. Another reason was the lack of respect for authority by many of the young sailors reporting for duty. When I first came into the Navy, you didn't dare talk back to a superior. A Petty Officer First Class was considered almost God, and a Chief WAS God! By the time I retired, I had to deal with more than a few boots who not only would question my orders to them, but quite often would tell me to $%#& off. Needless to say, I took immediate corrective action. But the Navy removed a lot of the power of the Chief to discipline now.

Boss, the more I think about it, I think every generation's said that about the next. If they were all right and we were getting worse, my generation would be so clueless it'd be insane.

I'm positive that if I keep my boot in their @$$, make sure they know I'd kill for them and never sell them down the river, my suboordinates will be in better shape than I was to take my place. Being an NCO is one the greatest priveleges on the planet.

The tactical gray is much more porous. Aircraft washes take a lot longer, and the end result isn't as effective, I don't think.

I suspect you're right.

 

[Willy]

tigisfat, the problem was that if we did put our foot up their tails, we'd be up on charges. And they knew it.

 

[wombat666]

tigisfat, the problem was that if we did put our foot up their tails, we'd be up on charges. And they knew it.

Never ever have any of those problems in any of my units!!!
EVER!
Come to think of it, I still get the 'new generation' through my courses without any difficulty.

 

[wombat666]

Back before the Navy outlawed a lot of chemicals for cleaning aircraft systems, we used to clean aircond. systems ducting with methyl-ethyl-ketone, without any type of respiratory protection. I don't EVEN want to know what the long term health effects it will have on me. Probably better NOT to know!
NC

Probably a nice serving of Cancer.
That stuff is extremely nasty, been available only with a special use permit for years and years out here.
:wave:

 

[Wing_Z]

Back to the dirt...
Great to see Milton's Aero Commander again, so I dug it out for a fly.

I was reminded that I never liked this one's dirt, too uniform (and the clean one far too nice):

But This One...ahh...always would get some muck in the air intake, forcing a shutdown (and feathering the prop, a Shupe specialty!)

 

[Helldiver]

Willy sez-
"Pretty much the same here when I decided to call it a career at the 20 years and a couple of days mark. It got to where to even attempt to correct one of the "little darlings" required a paper trail several weeks long."
Both Navy Chief and Willy are more than a generation apart from me, but we all speak with the same voice.
When I saw a Seaman wearing a hard-earned Chief's hat, I knew the end was near.
This generation has no respect for authority. It comes down to the "no spanking rule" that exists today. They don't learn authority and responsibility from an early age.
A far as I'm concerned most of them are all a irresponsible bunch of hooligans with no respect for anything or anyone. <!-- / message -->

 

[tigisfat]

tigisfat, the problem was that if we did put our foot up their tails, we'd be up on charges. And they knew it.

Things have surely only been getting more 'professional' and 'civilian' since then. I've never been brought up on charges for correcting a young and impressionable troop.

--The thing about paper trails is this: It is not something for me to fear getting into, it is just another tool to help me defend military ways, customs and courtesies. A modern NCO had better know how to write at a graduate level. However, old-fashioned forms of behavior and performance correction still exist.

 

[tigisfat]

......This generation has no respect for authority.......A far as I'm concerned most of them are all a irresponsible bunch of hooligans with no respect for anything or anyone...... <!-- / message -->

I'm sorry you feel that way about us. I've managed to avoid responding before, but now I at least wish to make a few points in defense.

1. Like I said before; Every generation has said that about the next ones to come along because history and emotions repeat themselves. I have no doubt similar things were said about your generation as well.

2. You can belittle my military generation all you want, but we are dealing with things no other has had to. I reached my first duty station in August of 2001, right before the end of my life as I knew it and I'd do it all again. In fact, I haven't met anyone with regrets. There are no "do this much time at war and you get to go home" concessions either. Most of us have spent longer than the duration of major US involvement in WWII deployed to a warzone. I don't think that's clear to many people; either that or most don't grapple it. It's now 2009. That means that hundreds of thousands of my generation reenlisted or extended our active duty commission. Why? is it because we're a generation of "hooligans with no respect for anything or anyone"?. The single digits of this century have been almost entirely occupied by this war, and at least in the USAF, most of us have been here since the beginning because of downsizing. If that doesn't prove we have respect for our great country, nothing will.

Maybe we are a generation of "hooligans with no respect for anything or anyone". Or; we are a generation with more access to information than the world has ever seen, faced with problems America has never seen and tasked with cleaning up the messes (or at least attempting to deal with them) of huge post WWII mistakes. In light of this, it may be fitting after all if we've revived some of the fight in America's spirit and get called hooligans in the process.

 

[TARPSBird]

If I can get this back on topic and away from the generation war...
Here are two pics that provide a little more inspiration for weathering. Crusader AH 204 shows dirt on the wings, and along the tail section by the vertical stab. This is mainly from maintenance guys walking. Notice the outer wing panels are clean - nobody walks on 'em. The P2V is from NAS Glenview, my old reserve base. Notice some different gray shades on the nose, wingtip tanks, and under the "7V" tail code. I suspect that when this pic was shot, the a/c had recently been received from a fleet VP squadron or another reserve unit. If you're just starting to mess around with repaints, this is an easy mod to do to any plane.

 

[wombat666]

I'm sorry you feel that way about us. I've managed to avoid responding before, but now I at least wish to make a few points in defense.

1. Like I said before; Every generation has said that about the next ones to come along because history and emotions repeat themselves. I have no doubt similar things were said about your generation as well.

2. You can belittle my military generation all you want, but we are dealing with things no other has had to. I reached my first duty station in August of 2001, right before the end of my life as I knew it and I'd do it all again. In fact, I haven't met anyone with regrets. There are no "do this much time at war and you get to go home" concessions either. Most of us have spent longer than the duration of major US involvement in WWII deployed to a warzone. I don't think that's clear to many people; either that or most don't grapple it. It's now 2009. That means that hundreds of thousands of my generation reenlisted or extended our active duty commission. Why? is it because we're a generation of "hooligans with no respect for anything or anyone"?. The single digits of this century have been almost entirely occupied by this war, and at least in the USAF, most of us have been here since the beginning because of downsizing. If that doesn't prove we have respect for our great country, nothing will.

Maybe we are a generation of "hooligans with no respect for anything or anyone". Or; we are a generation with more access to information than the world has ever seen, faced with problems America has never seen and tasked with cleaning up the messes (or at least attempting to deal with them) of huge post WWII mistakes. In light of this, it may be fitting after all if we've revived some of the fight in America's spirit and get called hooligans in the process.

Right on the mark!!

 

[Navy Chief]

If I can get this back on topic and away from the generation war...
Here are two pics that provide a little more inspiration for weathering. Crusader AH 204 shows dirt on the wings, and along the tail section by the vertical stab. This is mainly from maintenance guys walking. Notice the outer wing panels are clean - nobody walks on 'em. The P2V is from NAS Glenview, my old reserve base. Notice some different gray shades on the nose, wingtip tanks, and under the "7V" tail code. I suspect that when this pic was shot, the a/c had recently been received from a fleet VP squadron or another reserve unit. If you're just starting to mess around with repaints, this is an easy mod to do to any plane.

Nice pictures, Tarps. And NAS Glenview is a base I'd like to see "revived" in FSX!!!

NC