S
Siggi
Guest
Argh...................
Weeeeowwwww...KABOOM!
Weeeeowwwww...KABOOM!
P
Polovski
Guest
Great stuff carry on posting BUGGG!! like that and I doubt we'll see P4, even though for most people are having a ball and most issues are fixed.
It's called a game running on a PC. Occasionally in many games and software out there in the world of PCs, something crops up that causes a crash. Your PC, your graphics settings, the util in the background, some combination, a corrupted file, something in memory, hardware overheat, CFS3, who knows, maybe an error in something in the trillion entries in OFF.
Now if it actually is an issue that we can do something about that many others see often, maybe we can reproduce it. But please stop screaming BUG until we can find out if it IS a bug, and if that bug actually is with CFS3 or OFF.
To do that we need details, and how to make it happen.
Any good stuff to report?
It's called a game running on a PC. Occasionally in many games and software out there in the world of PCs, something crops up that causes a crash. Your PC, your graphics settings, the util in the background, some combination, a corrupted file, something in memory, hardware overheat, CFS3, who knows, maybe an error in something in the trillion entries in OFF.
Now if it actually is an issue that we can do something about that many others see often, maybe we can reproduce it. But please stop screaming BUG until we can find out if it IS a bug, and if that bug actually is with CFS3 or OFF.
To do that we need details, and how to make it happen.
Any good stuff to report?
S
Siggi
Guest
Are you ****tin' me? Or have you been struck down by a selective-reading virus?
Here you go, here's something I posted over at SimHQ earlier today.
http://simhq.com/forum/ubbthreads.php/topics/2672826/All_you_chaps_who_love_WW1.html#Post2672826
I linked it in another thread here somewhere, but I guess it didn't catch your attention. Like all the other "good stuff" I've posted, eh? Do excuse me for being just slightly ****** *** over having 70 minutes of hard-earned kill robbed off me and feeling the need to vent over it, I guess the immersive quality of your sim has worked too well in my case and I've felt an undue amount of angst. Hell of a double-edged sword you've got there...ok for peeps to be overwhelmed by the goodness and post accordingly (as I have done, multiple times) but god forbid that cuts both ways.
But I tell you what I'll do, I'll go self-censor that sales-destroying vent and try to remember it's just a game, and not the finest damned piece of immersive and engaging entertainment I've had in years. Damn that passion for being a two-way street!
B
Bullethead
Guest
I guess you've never served in real life....
Getting screwed over is the universal common denominator of all soldiers, sailors, airmen, and Marines since Christ was a corporal. If you weren't cheated of credit on a regular basis for your hard-earned work, for which you risked your life and limb, and then told to carry on and do the same tomorrow, it wouldn't be the military. Not to mention the horrible food (when you get any), the lack of sleep, being cold and wet all the time, not having a bath in months, the absence of mail from home except those where your girl dumps you, stupid ossifers with insane plans for your future, the list goes on. And this is BEFORE you consider that just a few miles away there are thousands of guys trying their best to kill you.
There's a reason folks in the military have sayings like "You just got the Big Green Wienie", "Bend over, here it comes again", and why they have some seriously obscene lyrics to the theme from the Mickey Mouse Club show.
Seriously, the more I get screwed in OFF, the more I like it because that makes it more realistic to me. If all my claims were confirmed, if all my fights were successful, if I never wasted my time doing something unproductive and not fun, I'd uninstall the game forthwith. I don't like being screwed, but I'd hate it if I wasn't
. IMHO, OFF perfectly captures the angst of being a cog in a huge machine that's regarded by all as being expendable.Of course, because of all this, it's the universal privelege of troops to complain about their hardships. But never in the presence of the ossifers, or your life will get even worse. That's why there's an NCOs' club :friday:
War is Hell. You're a flyboy. At worst, you'll go down in flames. But until then, you've got clean-ish sheets, something resembling a roof over your head, probably a batman, and access to booze and women. Your everyday life doesn't include hanging your helment on the decaying leg of some nameless corpse that's protruding from the side of your trench before you lie to sleep fully clothed in the reeking mud while wearing your gas mask, with your hands in your pockets to keep the rats from gnawing off your fingers. So you get a claimed denied once in a while. Big deal.
F
ftgc
Guest
Speaking of computers and the military, I spent 24 years in the submarine force. I was a firecontrol technician which meant I was responsible for the operation and maintenance of the system that controlled the firing of torpedoes and later on cruise missiles. Additionally these system were used to track contacts for avoidance or engagement. Anyway when I first started out digital firecontrol systems were just being introduced to the fleet. Prior systems were analog which means they solved the firecontrol problem with gears and shafts, servos and syncros. As new systems you can imagine the computers that ran the digital systems were always crashing, nothing physically wrong just dropped a bit in a checksum somewhere and Boom Crash. I never could convince my C.O. that just because the system crashed it didn't always mean there was a bad part in the computer, he always wanted me to bring him some smoldering circuit card and say "Here's the problem Captain" When I tried to explain it to him he always looked at me like I was trying to pull the wool over his eyes. He grew up in an era where you could turn this and watch that move. Just an anecdote I thought I'd share. :ernae:
Scott
Scott
Q
Queeg
Guest
Crashes can be caused by overclocking.
O
Over50
Guest
I guess you've never served in real life....
Getting screwed over is the universal common denominator of all soldiers, sailors, airmen, and Marines since Christ was a corporal. If you weren't cheated of credit on a regular basis for your hard-earned work, for which you risked your life and limb, and then told to carry on and do the same tomorrow, it wouldn't be the military. Not to mention the horrible food (when you get any), the lack of sleep, being cold and wet all the time, not having a bath in months, the absence of mail from home except those where your girl dumps you, stupid ossifers with insane plans for your future, the list goes on. And this is BEFORE you consider that just a few miles away there are thousands of guys trying their best to kill you.
There's a reason folks in the military have sayings like "You just got the Big Green Wienie", "Bend over, here it comes again", and why they have some seriously obscene lyrics to the theme from the Mickey Mouse Club show.
Seriously, the more I get screwed in OFF, the more I like it because that makes it more realistic to me. If all my claims were confirmed, if all my fights were successful, if I never wasted my time doing something unproductive and not fun, I'd uninstall the game forthwith. I don't like being screwed, but I'd hate it if I wasn't
Of course, because of all this, it's the universal privelege of troops to complain about their hardships. But never in the presence of the ossifers, or your life will get even worse. That's why there's an NCOs' club :friday:
War is Hell. You're a flyboy. At worst, you'll go down in flames. But until then, you've got clean-ish sheets, something resembling a roof over your head, probably a batman, and access to booze and women. Your everyday life doesn't include hanging your helment on the decaying leg of some nameless corpse that's protruding from the side of your trench before you lie to sleep fully clothed in the reeking mud while wearing your gas mask, with your hands in your pockets to keep the rats from gnawing off your fingers. So you get a claimed denied once in a while. Big deal.
In keeping with the flavor your comments (with 4 1/2 years in the navy way back when) it was a common comeback when you were told "If you ain't bitchin', you ain't happy". That being the case, Siggi is one happy fella!
P
Polovski
Guest
Fair enough Siggi thanks 
. First thing I'd look at when one of my games crashes randomly is my overclocking/graphics settings/game settings etc.
No selective reading virus, just concerned with thread titles keep saying "BUG!" when it's usually not or it's minor.
Someone glancing in the forum sees a load of those they won't bother buying it.
Anyway thanks.
. First thing I'd look at when one of my games crashes randomly is my overclocking/graphics settings/game settings etc.No selective reading virus, just concerned with thread titles keep saying "BUG!" when it's usually not or it's minor.
Someone glancing in the forum sees a load of those they won't bother buying it.
Anyway thanks.
S
Siggi
Guest
W
Winder
Guest
Fair enough Siggi thanks
No selective reading virus, just concerned with thread titles keep saying "BUG!" when it's usually not or it's minor.
Someone glancing in the forum sees a load of those they won't bother buying it.
Anyway thanks.
And looking at the sales figures ..... BUGGED!!!
WM
S
Siggi
Guest
I've been burned by a couple of full-price games in the last few months, Assassin's Creed and Farcry2 to mention two of them.
I can't speak for others, but I'm very leery of putting down £30 to £35 for a game when I'm unsure of how it's actually going to play. But when I see one for a tenner my attitude becomes very much "Well, if it's rubbish it's only a tenner, so why not have a punt..."
My advice would be this...knock this out at $20 or $30, go for volume, and then put out new a/c with their inclusion into squads etc for $10 a pop (DL only).
Also remember that people are holding out for RoF, fondly imagining that it's going to run on their computers, offer a magical online experience AND have a dynamic campaign worth a wank (in 1918 only). Once they've gotten over the eye-candy of that, then discover it's got about as much dynamic-campaign soul as IL2, they'll come flocking to the one they heard so much goodness about.
OFF is going to be a creeper, not a banger. Your price-point and time-placement has seen to that I think. If you want it to fly off the shelves, right here and right now, slash the price. Otherwise just be patient and hang in for the long haul. It'll generate critical mass, but it'll take time.
W
Winder
Guest
TBH we never expected many sales hence the price and we are doing this for dedication more than anything else - but sure ROF may be a factor...
Long haul - since I conceptualized and started OFF I have been at it 5 years - I think we are long-haulers and that will not change
I'll be buying ROF anyway - as a benchmark if nothing else - only campaign in 1918?
Jeez
WM
Long haul - since I conceptualized and started OFF I have been at it 5 years - I think we are long-haulers and that will not change
I'll be buying ROF anyway - as a benchmark if nothing else - only campaign in 1918?
Jeez
WM
J
jayo
Guest
I agree with OFF sales slowly increasing as time and other sim experiences go by,no need to be concerned (imo).
The time of release wasnt exactly condusive to the masses rushing to buy.......and as v1.2 has demonstrated,this sim IS turning into a sure-fire killer!!
The time of release wasnt exactly condusive to the masses rushing to buy.......and as v1.2 has demonstrated,this sim IS turning into a sure-fire killer!!
Q
quoth
Guest
I have to agree with Siggi on this. I obviously don't know what volume of sales you were hoping for but you've been unlucky with the release coinciding with the economic recession.
Also, as was mentioned in another thread, WW1 is a fairly niche interest, just look at the average age of forum members
Who said "build it and they will come" but if they don't know it's there or what it looks like...
I and I'm sure most others here love what you have done, applaud the level of support and feedback you give and hope that you will keep going but I think you may have to accept that it will be slow but hopefully steady.
Cheers
Q
Better sales need salesmen
I'd really wish you better sales numbers. That's why I write this example - draw your own conclusions:
A friend of mine was an artist, he painted huge oil-on-canvas works.
Since he had found a gallerist (in the 80s), he began to sell good.
After short time, he could afford a big Mercedes Limousine, and a big
factory store, were he painted. I'm sure, he could have got an own house
after some time, and maybe more.
But the deal was: 70 % for the gallerist, 30 % for the painter. Becoming
successful now, he complained about the unfair deal, wanted at least 50 %,
and as he didn't get them, he broke with the gallerist.
He never found another (they seem to stick together), and died poor in the mid-90s.
If you'd find a distributer, he might charge the larger amount from the price.
But what is better: selling 10.000 copies with a winning of, let's say, 25,- Dollar;
or 100.000 copies with a winnig of 5,- Dollar each? (Just a fictional example).
I'd really wish you better sales numbers. That's why I write this example - draw your own conclusions:
A friend of mine was an artist, he painted huge oil-on-canvas works.
Since he had found a gallerist (in the 80s), he began to sell good.
After short time, he could afford a big Mercedes Limousine, and a big
factory store, were he painted. I'm sure, he could have got an own house
after some time, and maybe more.
But the deal was: 70 % for the gallerist, 30 % for the painter. Becoming
successful now, he complained about the unfair deal, wanted at least 50 %,
and as he didn't get them, he broke with the gallerist.
He never found another (they seem to stick together), and died poor in the mid-90s.
If you'd find a distributer, he might charge the larger amount from the price.
But what is better: selling 10.000 copies with a winning of, let's say, 25,- Dollar;
or 100.000 copies with a winnig of 5,- Dollar each? (Just a fictional example).
C
cpirrmann
Guest
Some business observations for the OBD team.
You and I are in very similar circumstances. I have a very small (only me) clock repair and making business.
We both have niche markets, a very select customer base and are the only ones doing what we do (within our areas, mine being geographically, yours being logically).
We both have advertising problems. Most normal advertising mediums will not reach our customers. They are designed to reach a broad spectrum of people, mostly in age, and a very small percentage would have an interest in our product. Some may look to us hoping or expecting what they normally crave and receive, quick, easy and pruriently gratifying (inexpensive, battery clocks in my case, arcade, blood and explosion, 1000 kill careers in yours). Our real customers desperately need us, have been looking for years for us, would be ecstatic to find us, willing to pay almost any price for us, but don't know we're here.
There aren't many who do what we do (in your case, WWI flying sims). Our competition is very low, and fortunately, there's room for all of us. If people want what we offer, they don't have many choices, so when they find out about us, we usually get their business. We don't need t convince them to try us, we just need to let them know we're here, and even if they hear something not so good or even bad, if they want what we do, they have little choice but to give us a chance or do without, and if they choose the latter, they weren't very serious to begin with. So I would say not to fret so much about the negative posts or negative impact of some of the posts here. You're fortunate because between your responses and those who reside on this forum, the impact of those posts is swiftly mitigated. Anyone seriously wanting to learn about OFF is going to do more than just read the headlines.
They do find us, though, but it takes generally word of mouth and that takes time, but it seems to be the most gratifying method. I have customers tell me I have a good reputation and that doesn't come from advertising. So, if you can, be patient, and they will come. Maybe not right away, but they do come. Our customers can do much to help as many have offered to do (telling others about me at antique shows, etc. in my case, telling others about yours at airshow, fly ins, etc in yours).
This, as you have said, and as it is with me is a labor of love that we hoped to have turned into a money-making venture. I don't mean millionaire though that certainly wouldn't be unwelcome, but enough to be comfortable while we did what we love to do. That's not unreasonable since half our lives are spent doing our work. But, one must keep perspective. We have good customers that gush over us, tell us how glad they are we're here and make us very happy. And we have some who are not happy or are problematic. No matter how many more we have who love us, and bring us up, it's always the one or two we let spoil our whole experience and frustrate us. I don't know why that is, I guess it's human nature, but the best we can do when that happens is to address their concerns and focus on how many there are who appreciate us. We must keep our perspective.
The perspective also applies to money. If we let money drive us, then things begin to go bad. If we concentrate on doing this because we enjoy it, the money will eventually smooth things out. When things look bad, I sometimes say to myself, I don't HAVE to do this. I could do something else, be just as miserable but have more money. I then need to step back, take a deep breath and focus on the reason I do this instead of the money. Therefore, we must keep our eyes on why we do this. We do this to please ourselves, to satisfy us and because we enjoy it. If we can bring joy to others, a bit of pecuniary reward to ourselves, then all the better, but our enjoyment and satisfaction must be paramount because life is meant to be enjoyed and is too short to be otherwise. If your sales are slow or less than expected, don't lose your enthusiasm, but also, don't place it on sales, place it on your own satisfaction, on what you're doing. Only that is in your control, and there you should focus. You can take criticisms and suggestions from others and apply them how you wish, but if you are happy with how things turn out then let that be the deciding factor. You can't please everyone, no matter how much you want to help and make others happy. If you're not happy, they won't be either, so the best way to help them, is to make yourself happy, and enough will follow suit, and they are the ones who will support you and keep you up, which makes you happier, and them happier, and you build a rising thermal instead of a graveyard spiral. I speak in generalities but I'm sure you know how what I say applies.
I've used 'we' most in here because, as I said our businesses have very similar models and I know exactly what you guys are going through. Keep your passion, work towards your satisfaction and surround yourselves with those who are good for you in those pursuits and keep your perspective. It's not easy, but essential to success and happiness.
I'll tell you something, and I'm sure there many here who can tell you the same thing I am about to. I have been studying WWI aviation since I could read. The Blue Max is my favorite aviation movie. It was the greatest influence on my becoming a pilot. I have played WWI games since Avalon Hill's Red Baron in 1975. I've been using computers to play games since 1979. I have bought, played and discarded many games, but mostly flight sims. But I have to tell you, I haven't done more than just try any other computer game since OFF came out, and I mean Phase I. So, you know how long it's been out....that's how long OFF has been the focus of my computer gaming experience. That must mean something.
There's a phrase that's commonly use in other arenas but it fits OFF: "It's not perfect, but very close to it, and it's the best there is."
You and I are in very similar circumstances. I have a very small (only me) clock repair and making business.
We both have niche markets, a very select customer base and are the only ones doing what we do (within our areas, mine being geographically, yours being logically).
We both have advertising problems. Most normal advertising mediums will not reach our customers. They are designed to reach a broad spectrum of people, mostly in age, and a very small percentage would have an interest in our product. Some may look to us hoping or expecting what they normally crave and receive, quick, easy and pruriently gratifying (inexpensive, battery clocks in my case, arcade, blood and explosion, 1000 kill careers in yours). Our real customers desperately need us, have been looking for years for us, would be ecstatic to find us, willing to pay almost any price for us, but don't know we're here.
There aren't many who do what we do (in your case, WWI flying sims). Our competition is very low, and fortunately, there's room for all of us. If people want what we offer, they don't have many choices, so when they find out about us, we usually get their business. We don't need t convince them to try us, we just need to let them know we're here, and even if they hear something not so good or even bad, if they want what we do, they have little choice but to give us a chance or do without, and if they choose the latter, they weren't very serious to begin with. So I would say not to fret so much about the negative posts or negative impact of some of the posts here. You're fortunate because between your responses and those who reside on this forum, the impact of those posts is swiftly mitigated. Anyone seriously wanting to learn about OFF is going to do more than just read the headlines.
They do find us, though, but it takes generally word of mouth and that takes time, but it seems to be the most gratifying method. I have customers tell me I have a good reputation and that doesn't come from advertising. So, if you can, be patient, and they will come. Maybe not right away, but they do come. Our customers can do much to help as many have offered to do (telling others about me at antique shows, etc. in my case, telling others about yours at airshow, fly ins, etc in yours).
This, as you have said, and as it is with me is a labor of love that we hoped to have turned into a money-making venture. I don't mean millionaire though that certainly wouldn't be unwelcome, but enough to be comfortable while we did what we love to do. That's not unreasonable since half our lives are spent doing our work. But, one must keep perspective. We have good customers that gush over us, tell us how glad they are we're here and make us very happy. And we have some who are not happy or are problematic. No matter how many more we have who love us, and bring us up, it's always the one or two we let spoil our whole experience and frustrate us. I don't know why that is, I guess it's human nature, but the best we can do when that happens is to address their concerns and focus on how many there are who appreciate us. We must keep our perspective.
The perspective also applies to money. If we let money drive us, then things begin to go bad. If we concentrate on doing this because we enjoy it, the money will eventually smooth things out. When things look bad, I sometimes say to myself, I don't HAVE to do this. I could do something else, be just as miserable but have more money. I then need to step back, take a deep breath and focus on the reason I do this instead of the money. Therefore, we must keep our eyes on why we do this. We do this to please ourselves, to satisfy us and because we enjoy it. If we can bring joy to others, a bit of pecuniary reward to ourselves, then all the better, but our enjoyment and satisfaction must be paramount because life is meant to be enjoyed and is too short to be otherwise. If your sales are slow or less than expected, don't lose your enthusiasm, but also, don't place it on sales, place it on your own satisfaction, on what you're doing. Only that is in your control, and there you should focus. You can take criticisms and suggestions from others and apply them how you wish, but if you are happy with how things turn out then let that be the deciding factor. You can't please everyone, no matter how much you want to help and make others happy. If you're not happy, they won't be either, so the best way to help them, is to make yourself happy, and enough will follow suit, and they are the ones who will support you and keep you up, which makes you happier, and them happier, and you build a rising thermal instead of a graveyard spiral. I speak in generalities but I'm sure you know how what I say applies.
I've used 'we' most in here because, as I said our businesses have very similar models and I know exactly what you guys are going through. Keep your passion, work towards your satisfaction and surround yourselves with those who are good for you in those pursuits and keep your perspective. It's not easy, but essential to success and happiness.
I'll tell you something, and I'm sure there many here who can tell you the same thing I am about to. I have been studying WWI aviation since I could read. The Blue Max is my favorite aviation movie. It was the greatest influence on my becoming a pilot. I have played WWI games since Avalon Hill's Red Baron in 1975. I've been using computers to play games since 1979. I have bought, played and discarded many games, but mostly flight sims. But I have to tell you, I haven't done more than just try any other computer game since OFF came out, and I mean Phase I. So, you know how long it's been out....that's how long OFF has been the focus of my computer gaming experience. That must mean something.
There's a phrase that's commonly use in other arenas but it fits OFF: "It's not perfect, but very close to it, and it's the best there is."
S
Siggi
Guest
That was a truly inspiring post mate. Salute.
C
cptroyce
Guest
Off is like "fine wine"..not to eveyone's taste or budget. However, there will always be a market for it. IMHO.
Royce
Royce
R
rabu
Guest
Fair enough Siggi thanks
No selective reading virus, just concerned with thread titles keep saying "BUG!" when it's usually not or it's minor.
Someone glancing in the forum sees a load of those they won't bother buying it.
Anyway thanks.
And.. go into your My Computer --> rt clk "Manage" --> "Event Viewer" and see just what happened. You can Google for answers on line.
And please let us know what you find, Siggi.