Canadian GP.
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Panther_99FS
Retired SOH Administrator
Any other driver other than Vettel and Ferrari, no one would have any problems with it - especially if the call was made on Lewis/Mercedes...Everyone would be saying it was a great call!
Seb was under pressure and made a mistake!
Seb was under pressure and made a mistake!
Panther_99FS
Retired SOH Administrator
On a side note....
I can't help but wonder how fast Red Bull would have been since it looks like Renault has power.....
I can't help but wonder how fast Red Bull would have been since it looks like Renault has power.....
Panther_99FS
Retired SOH Administrator
One thing.....
Both Ricciardo and Max have shown that it's easy to get inside of Vettel's head. I'd argue that the only reason why Webber didn't was because Webber was diligent to team orders.
Seb has made mistakes before under while under pressure.
Roxane-21
SOH-CM-2023
Well... It is hard to tell if Vettel would have been able to stay more on the left. Maybe he was still out of control and could not do anything else, or maybe he got close to the wall on purpose to block Hamilton.
Nevertheless, he wouldn't have lost the race if he didn't make this mistake... again. This is the main différence between him and Hamilton. While under pressure, Hamilton doesn't make mistakes (see last Monaco GP) whereas Vettel looses is mind and makes many.
Nevertheless, he wouldn't have lost the race if he didn't make this mistake... again. This is the main différence between him and Hamilton. While under pressure, Hamilton doesn't make mistakes (see last Monaco GP) whereas Vettel looses is mind and makes many.
jamminjames
Charter Member
Seb was under pressure and made a error, but IMHO it was a cheesy call......
wombat666
Administrator
Another reason why EffWun sucks compared to MotoGP.
It's run by a committee and is influenced by 'inside interests' who care nothing for what was once the best open wheel racing on the calendar.
I only bothered with a quick look at the incident but I noticed the Canadian audience were cheering for Vettel in the aftermath, and they (mostly) know their racing business.
As for Hamilton, I still remain totally unimpressed, the image he presents alone is a poor one, while he has never driven an 'average' car.
At least Le Mans is almost upon us.
It's run by a committee and is influenced by 'inside interests' who care nothing for what was once the best open wheel racing on the calendar.
I only bothered with a quick look at the incident but I noticed the Canadian audience were cheering for Vettel in the aftermath, and they (mostly) know their racing business.
As for Hamilton, I still remain totally unimpressed, the image he presents alone is a poor one, while he has never driven an 'average' car.
At least Le Mans is almost upon us.
Ferry_vO
Retired SOH Administrator
Stupid decision by the Marshalls, a penalty for a slight move to the right by Vettel after he regained car control. The second time a fight for the lead this season is decided by a penalty. As if F1 isn't boring enough this year with Mercedes winning everything.
It was Hamilton who (Together with Schumacher) made Mercedes the team that it is today, it wasn't exactly a winner when he got there. Many said he was stupid to leave McLaren at that time.
And Le Mans...? Toyota just need to finish without too many problems to win again, LMP2 is now mostly a cup series with most of the field using the same chassis, and next season Ford and BMW will leave the GT class with no replacement in sight. Time for some major rule changes there.
It was Hamilton who (Together with Schumacher) made Mercedes the team that it is today, it wasn't exactly a winner when he got there. Many said he was stupid to leave McLaren at that time.
And Le Mans...? Toyota just need to finish without too many problems to win again, LMP2 is now mostly a cup series with most of the field using the same chassis, and next season Ford and BMW will leave the GT class with no replacement in sight. Time for some major rule changes there.
Panther_99FS
Retired SOH Administrator
1) McLaren went to garbage after Hamilton left.
2) Mercedes rose to World Champion status when Hamilton arrived.
'Nuff said.
Panther_99FS
Retired SOH Administrator
The only reason why Button has championship is due to Ross Brawn exploiting a rule that no other team did. After that, they went downhill until the arrival Hamilton. Remember, everyone thought Hamilton was crazy to leave McLaren for Mercedes?
Well McLaren went tho sh#$ after Hamilton left and Mercedes is well....'nuff said....
wombat666
Administrator
Without too being partisan Ed, 'Formula 1' as it is today is steadily going further and further down the crapper thanks to Hamilton, aided in no small part to so-called 'Social Media' and the obscene amounts of $$$ spent by Mercedes Benz.
I started following Formula 1 as a small boy in the mid 1950s thanks to my father and my enthusiasm remained strong up to the 1990s when it became SOP to drive the opposition off the circuit while bending the rules way out of shape was the done thing at certain operations.
By the end of that decade I was really losing interest and today I keep track of the farce that is 'EffWun' to see just how bad it has become and how much further it can fall.
I should state that I have never ever had any respect for 'Race Control', 'Race Stewards' and the 'Committees' that seems to be omnipresent today.
Racers race, the rest become 'Officials'.
I must add that for 30+ years I was a committed CART fan, a series that was effectively rooted in 1996 by the IRL and still managed to carry on despite becoming a single make, single engine series.
As for Hamilton, I've never rated him and while he has the numbers on the board for what passes as a 'Championship' he is no 'Champion'.
He lucked in with his first title, moved to the current team and once Vettel was out of RBR the Mercedes juggernaut did the rest, rather along the lines of the 1930s.
The current generation are all guilty of getting on the horn if anything displeases them but Hamilton and Vettel are seemingly the worst offenders, indeed both seem to require constant pit wall coaching at every round.
Be nice if they were able to follow 'The Iceman's' lead and just get on with their own race.
The Champion's 'Champion' remains Juan Manuel Fangio, winning his titles aboard Alfa Romeo, Ferrari, Mercedes Benz and Maserati, not always the best car, simply the best driver.
If Hamilton were to do a similar thing he'd be a real champion, but that won't happen because his over riding motivation appears to be financial.
Call my cynical (I am) but I think the image projected by a 30+ year old Hamilton is aimed at the current selfie-farce book generation.
Max Verstappen could give him lessons on maturity and personality.
Fortunately for me MotoGP provides real Motor Sport racing with a cast of decent and personable sportsmen.
I'll go take my medication now.
I started following Formula 1 as a small boy in the mid 1950s thanks to my father and my enthusiasm remained strong up to the 1990s when it became SOP to drive the opposition off the circuit while bending the rules way out of shape was the done thing at certain operations.
By the end of that decade I was really losing interest and today I keep track of the farce that is 'EffWun' to see just how bad it has become and how much further it can fall.
I should state that I have never ever had any respect for 'Race Control', 'Race Stewards' and the 'Committees' that seems to be omnipresent today.
Racers race, the rest become 'Officials'.
I must add that for 30+ years I was a committed CART fan, a series that was effectively rooted in 1996 by the IRL and still managed to carry on despite becoming a single make, single engine series.
As for Hamilton, I've never rated him and while he has the numbers on the board for what passes as a 'Championship' he is no 'Champion'.
He lucked in with his first title, moved to the current team and once Vettel was out of RBR the Mercedes juggernaut did the rest, rather along the lines of the 1930s.
The current generation are all guilty of getting on the horn if anything displeases them but Hamilton and Vettel are seemingly the worst offenders, indeed both seem to require constant pit wall coaching at every round.
Be nice if they were able to follow 'The Iceman's' lead and just get on with their own race.
The Champion's 'Champion' remains Juan Manuel Fangio, winning his titles aboard Alfa Romeo, Ferrari, Mercedes Benz and Maserati, not always the best car, simply the best driver.
If Hamilton were to do a similar thing he'd be a real champion, but that won't happen because his over riding motivation appears to be financial.
Call my cynical (I am) but I think the image projected by a 30+ year old Hamilton is aimed at the current selfie-farce book generation.
Max Verstappen could give him lessons on maturity and personality.
Fortunately for me MotoGP provides real Motor Sport racing with a cast of decent and personable sportsmen.
I'll go take my medication now.
Ferry_vO
Retired SOH Administrator
Not true, both Toyota and Williams had similar designs.
As for Hamilton, I do like that he's not as stiff and boring like for example Rosberg was.. Seems he's pretty good at combining his busy social life with full commitment during a race weekend.
F1 drivers have humongous egos, Max the worst. He’s a spoiled baby.
The stewards were going by the rule book and there was no flexibility there. If there was, a simple “change position” with Hamilton would have taken care of it. It would then be an exciting race although I think Hamilton still would have won.
F1 is rapidly going down the tubes. It supports whoever has the most money wins. Engines for most teams are bought and not developed in-house so those running as “second” teams don’t have the best. F1 prides themselves as having the greatest technology in the world which results in those having the most money for r&d always winning. I would love to see what percentage of the price of a new Mercedes, Ferrari, or Infinity goes into F1.
I have have lately become a big fan of Indy car racing. Competitive drivers and cars, lots of passing, and the most money doesn’t always win. Drivers have to learn road courses, city courses as well as ovals. Indy car pulled itself out of what’s happening to NASCAR today and rejuvenated the series.
Just my 5 cents with.
have a smurfy day,
Bob
The stewards were going by the rule book and there was no flexibility there. If there was, a simple “change position” with Hamilton would have taken care of it. It would then be an exciting race although I think Hamilton still would have won.
F1 is rapidly going down the tubes. It supports whoever has the most money wins. Engines for most teams are bought and not developed in-house so those running as “second” teams don’t have the best. F1 prides themselves as having the greatest technology in the world which results in those having the most money for r&d always winning. I would love to see what percentage of the price of a new Mercedes, Ferrari, or Infinity goes into F1.
I have have lately become a big fan of Indy car racing. Competitive drivers and cars, lots of passing, and the most money doesn’t always win. Drivers have to learn road courses, city courses as well as ovals. Indy car pulled itself out of what’s happening to NASCAR today and rejuvenated the series.
Just my 5 cents with.
have a smurfy day,
Bob
Roxane-21
SOH-CM-2023
Red Bull as well...
Panther_99FS
Retired SOH Administrator
Rog on the chassis correction....
I've said many times that IMHO, Hamilton is a modern day James Hunt....and when the team tries to reel him in (i.e, to make him more "proper"), he doesn't perform as well.....
Panther_99FS
Retired SOH Administrator
wombat666
Administrator
I never thought much of Hunt.
James Hunt was known throughout the motorsport fraternity as 'Hunt the Shunt' due to his penchant for driving his opposition off the road.
This nickname rapidly morphed into 'Hunt the C----' after he started assaulting track marshals.
He certainly was not a great 'Champion' (as portrayed in the film) and post the McLaren years he was an epic fail with Walter Wolf's crackpot outfit.
Now there's a thought, Wolf and Stroll, both Canadians with more money than sense.
I shall now retire from this forum.
James Hunt was known throughout the motorsport fraternity as 'Hunt the Shunt' due to his penchant for driving his opposition off the road.
This nickname rapidly morphed into 'Hunt the C----' after he started assaulting track marshals.
He certainly was not a great 'Champion' (as portrayed in the film) and post the McLaren years he was an epic fail with Walter Wolf's crackpot outfit.
Now there's a thought, Wolf and Stroll, both Canadians with more money than sense.
I shall now retire from this forum.