CC anti sub missions Tigermoth I give up!!

H

HouseHobbit

Charter Member
This is Crazy! :icon_lol:

1) You have been Posted to a St. Evel assigned to the Coastal Command for anti-sub patrol..Take off and join up with your wingman.. Head to your patrol station offshore..If you sight a U-boat.. Your Wingman will return to ase to report..remain on station over the contact, nearby are Royal Navy Destroyers.. If possible signal to them and guide them to the U-boat..Tally Ho!!

25 January 1940. On that date Flg Off P. C. Hoyle of No 1 CPF, in Tiger Moth N684l took off at2.20pm from Dyce, (St.Evel) in company with Pilot Officer Child (N6845). Nearly an hour later Hoyle spotted an oil slick which was apparently moving steadily, and signaled by Very Light to some nearby destroyers..


2)
You have been Posted to a RNAS Station assigned to the
Coastal Command for anti-sub patrol..Clear the Hanger and Station yourself on the runway 11 o'clock (Left ahead).. Take off and fly to your patrol station offshore..Your wingman is already positioned to takeoff, join Him at the patrol area..If you sight a U-boat.. When your mate turns back to report and you have confirmed a enemy sub..Turn to Find the RN ships, signal to the RN ships and guide them to the U-boat..Remain to report the battle, Until the goals are achieved.. Tally Ho!!

Cruise at 75-85 mph altitude 1000ft..Dec 17 1939 A TigerMoth spotted a periscope and started to dive towards it. The periscope quickly disappeard into the depths.. The "scarecrow" had at least achieved its purpose. Tiger patrols were normally flown in pairs..If any U-Boat were sighted. One Tiger could return to base and summon Help. While the other watched the U-boat and tracked it..if within visual range of a RN fighting ship. The Tiger could fire a Very Light cartridge then circle the U-boat's location awaiting help.

Built two historical missions with the Tigermoth for Beau, not a problem :applause:
Until I discovered how bad British naval gunnery was!!
Led the DD's and Corvette's to the target they closed to rock throwing distance, and NO Hits!
:icon_eek: :icon_eek: :icon_eek:


Well the DD's did manage to hit each other as the sub passed, I guess that counts..:banghead:

Had to amend the missions so a CC Aircraft called in by the returning Wing-man did the Job..
I am using the Diving sub in ETO for this so I had to stay a respectable distance to keep the u-boat on the surface..

Sometimes the limits of the CFS3 game engine are hard to fool, I often can find a way to side step this..
But Not today..
 
Yes I've had that too Owen. I've been having a go at one (only a what if), and had the same problem. I wonder if the same magic can be worked on them as 01-driver did to MTB's and S-Boots?
 
Bad Shooting

Sh***, you've got the entire Royal Navy shooting at those subs :icon_lol:

You can edit the gun xdps for the main guns of destroyers. If the the main gun of the destroyer per the ship's xdp is "4.5in_gun" then go to the guns folder and find the 4.5in_gun.xdp file, reduce noise of the gun to something like "0.01". The lower the value the better. This will increase the accuracy of the gun.

Also, have you tried adding a skill level for the destroyer formation in the mission file? Just as an experiment because it probably won't do anything but try adding Skill="3" in much the same way you do for an air formation when writing a mission.
 
Daiwilletti said:
Sh***, you've got the entire Royal Navy shooting at those subs :icon_lol:

You can edit the gun xdps for the main guns of destroyers. If the the main gun of the destroyer per the ship's xdp is "4.5in_gun" then go to the guns folder and find the 4.5in_gun.xdp file, reduce noise of the gun to something like "0.01". The lower the value the better. This will increase the accuracy of the gun.

Also, have you tried adding a skill level for the destroyer formation in the mission file? Just as an experiment because it probably won't do anything but try adding Skill="3" in much the same way you do for an air formation when writing a mission.
Click to expand...

Thanks for the information David.. I will use this in my advanced ETO Set up..
I just reloaded ETO 1.40 and corrected the "Quirks" in a virgin install.
I am going to leave this all stock for the public..

The missions work well as I have them now and the CC Aircraft are nasty to subs..
The RN ships are of course where Missing the mark, but it does reflect that sometimes to get a historical mission in a stock set up can be difficult..
I will change the values in the ships used and include a Set of modified XDP's for those who want them..

And Of course the ships are set for expert(3) in the mission, Like it Helped!! :banghead:
:icon_lol: :icon_lol:
It is a very complicated set of missions and flying it and following the plan isn't hard..Many things are timed to happen when the player follows the flight plan..kind of cool to see it all unfold..
The action is great, But you do have to fly the flight plan given in the briefing..
I am amazed sometimes by the gift the developers/authors of ETO/PTO/RS/ MAW And DPC Korea have given to us all
Truly Grateful..It is so COOL!!
 
Owen when you talk about the tigertmoth firing a light cartridge what did you mean? I thought Tigers were unarmed.
 
David it Worked!!
Changed the values in the Gun XDP( to .001) as advised and the RN suddenly starting Hitting! :applause:
Now these are Historical..
WOW didn't know that this would improve the Guns so Much..
I Will include the Gun XDP files with the upload with instructions where to place them..
Thanks, very Much..

Lewis, our Tigermoths don't have a flare gun, so this part isn't able to be used in these missions..

Now the RN can shoot so I just have the player fly over the sub to confirm the target, then to the RN Ships to lead them to the sub..
The player remains over the sub until the RN ships do their dirty work..
Until the Goal is achieved..And yes they do Cross the T..
 
can anyone picture a hobbit unarmed to the teeth .... no matter what the plane .......the moth got hobbitted
 
I'm glad you sorted out the flare gun thing, Owen pretty cool. Now with those altered destroyers, how about this for an idea. We could modify a few stand alone destroyers and corvettes (like Steve did for those MTB's/E-boats, the non-driveable ones that is) and release them as a pack on my site. They could then be used for future missions where more aggressive ships are needed. Now if we could only get them to depth charge then the missions would be really historical.
 
Wow, these things are down right deadly now, I have only two DD's attacking and they do a job on the sub..
I have the Tigermoth set finished and polished up now..

I have made several changes to the first set I sent out, corrected the spelling in the briefings and sorted out the attacks..
Replaced the aircraft as was used at St.Marys (hurricanes) Thanks Clive..
And a nice read me for those who sometimes really, read this..with the Historical information supplied by Masters Clive and Jeff..
Thanks Guys..
Just awaiting the final Tiger for this and off we go..

Thank You David for the information on getting the guns more accurate, who would have guessed that changing the"noise" would effect the accuracy.. Now all the ships using these guns will be a challenge to deal with..
I will remember this ..


Finishing a set for Rising Sun CBI will have this for the Rising Sun
team, and doing a Helldiver set in PTO also..
Now I have a virgin ETO 1.40 again I will recheck the A2 and A21 missions and get these out also..

Off to beat some Hobbits and gnomes, Work!! you bloody halflings!! :violent:
 
BeauBrummie said:
I'm glad you sorted out the flare gun thing, Owen pretty cool. Now with those altered destroyers, how about this for an idea. We could modify a few stand alone destroyers and corvettes (like Steve did for those MTB's/E-boats, the non-driveable ones that is) and release them as a pack on my site. They could then be used for future missions where more aggressive ships are needed. Now if we could only get them to depth charge then the missions would be really historical.
Click to expand...

Jeff,
it looks like all one has to do is change the "Noise" settings in the Gun XDP, and it automatically effects any ship or item that uses that particular gun..
No need to make different ships..
Yes it will effect future missions, but I can adjust to having ships the hit things in my set ups..

I am checking out several of these and changing the "Noise values" in several of the Ships guns to improve the accuracy in them..
Just as a test to see how this works..
So far a marked improvement in the ships shooting..
Finally the RN can hit something..:icon_lol: :icon_lol: :icon_lol:

manged so far to set up some nasty Japanese ships in PTO, that are as deadly as the real, ones were during WW2
Cruisers that is, HMIJS.Sendai and HMIJS.Yubari by Jaycee

So far tests look very promising..
In Rising Sun, PTO and ETO..
MAW is next, and DPC Korea..
 
HouseHobbit said:
Jeff,
it looks like all one has to do is change the "Noise" settings in the Gun XDP, and it automatically effects any ship or item that uses that particular gun..
No need to make different ships..
Yes it will effect future missions, but I can adjust to having ships the hit things in my set ups..
Click to expand...

I realised that this evening Owen. One thought occured to me is that as ships also use their big guns as flak, will they become super AA ships?
 
BeauBrummie said:
I realised that this evening Owen. One thought occured to me is that as ships also use their big guns as flak, will they become super AA ships?
Click to expand...

@ Owen,
Pleased it worked :redface:. I enjoy watching maritime battles when they aren't completely pathetic! The "noise" category refers to the "scatter" of the gun - its more statistical noise, rather than acoustical noise. Hence in the AvHistory weapons pack, for example, the hand_held defensive guns on aircraft have a higher noise than say a power turret which is pretty lethal (the stock FW Condor is a prime example - maybe a bit TOO deadly :isadizzy:)

@ BeauBrummie, the thing that changes the main guns is adding "aircraft" to the targetcategory entry in the gun xdp. It becomes important that the rate limit is not set very high in the gunstations of the ship xdp, otherwise the big guns are lethal (because of the very low "noise" limit). Remember fouteman's destroyers and corvettes when they came out? They included an experimental "gun" of mine that fired at aircraft. Truth be told I didn't like the long range hail of flak too much, so tend to just slightly modify the stock guns.

IIRC Jaycee already has some of his bigger guns set up to shoot at aircraft as well as ships - those Japanese cruisers are mean things!

HTH,
D
 
Downlimits for panning guns

I also forgot - the panning of the ship guns is also important. I don't know if the downlimits set in the m3d model are a limit on the downlimit you can set for the gunstation. But at closer ranges, the ships' guns are higher than the submarines - hence if they cannot pan down below 0 degrees, shots will whistle overhead. Probably a real issue for some ships in some circumstances.

I've gotten into all sorts of trouble setting downlimits in the "Gunstations" section of vehicle xdps, because I don't know if a downlimit below 0 degrees should be positive or negative.... Probably a case where I should ****....in the aircraft and vehicle sdk I guess.....

but is there anyone out there who could help out on the downlimit question?
 
I am testing that..
I have a mission (just finished) where I have one Destroyer and Cruiser with the improved main guns, and 20 miles away the same ships without the improvements..

I fly about in a enemy aircraft at different ranges and see what happens..
To both sets of ships With the change and without the change..

Had to make new Mdl names and such and set it up
Had to change the Gun Names in the Gun XDP and Mdls so they would not conflict
(XML editor and hex editor worked well setting this up..)
And set up new XDP's ...Mdl's for the ships changed..
Again to ensure no conflicts and that the CFS3 game engine didn't try to read the wrong ship files..

Been flying near by testing what effect difference it has on the main guns..
When I do several tests I will be able to better answer this..


Wow David, you are a wealth of info..
I guess as long as the main Guns are not set up with 'Aircraft" then they are not a big threat..
This will help in learning to set this up Many Thanks ..
 
I have been testing to XDP change for the guns on the ships used in the Tigermoth missions..
I am pleased to say this has Not changed how deadly they are to Aircraft as i can see..
Many Many times i have used a Stock XDP and a Ship(standalone I set up) with the main gun changes to the XDP.
And have Had no problems..

This as I have now tested 100 times (perhaps)
So I guess that changing the gun XDP for accuracy the amount It did, allowed the DD's to hit the sub, without causing me Grief with aircraft..
And there is Much Rejoicing!!
:applause: :applause: :applause:
 
HouseHobbit said:
I have been testing to XDP change for the guns on the ships used in the Tigermoth missions..
I am pleased to say this has Not changed how deadly they are to Aircraft as i can see..
Many Many times i have used a Stock XDP and a s Ship(standalone I set up) with the main gun changes to the XDP.
And have Had no problems..

This as I have now tested 100 times (perhaps)
So I guess that changing the gun XDP for accuracy the amount I did, allowed the DD's to hit the sub, without causing me Grief with aircraft..
And there is Much Rejoicing!!
:applause: :applause: :applause:
Click to expand...

Great to see all the testing results, Owen!

Aircraft will not be affected unless you delve into the gun xdp, and change the targetcategory="" parameter. Ships will only start to shoot at aircraft if their guns' xdp files are modified to include aircraft in the targetcategory field.

Of course, if the gun's "type" entry in the gun's xdp file ="flak_gun" then the gun automatically shoots at aircraft by default, without the need for the targetcategory="aircraft" entry.

The aircraft and vehicle SDK v1.5 contains an interesting file called "xdp.xsd" this file contains all the different categories that can be found for all the different xdp types in CFS3. (well actually I've found its missing a few things but its still useful)

Here is the section addressing gun xdps:

<xs:element name="Gun">
......
<xs:attribute name="GunType">
.......
<xs:enumeration value="flak_gun" />
<xs:enumeration value="cannon" />
<xs:enumeration value="drop_tank" />
<xs:enumeration value="rocket_container" />
<xs:enumeration value="bomb_container" />
<xs:enumeration value="pylon" />
<xs:enumeration value="gun" />
..................
</xs:attribute>
<xs:attribute name="TargetCategory" type="xs:string" />
<xs:attribute name="SoundName" type="xs:string" />
<xs:attribute name="Range" type="xs:decimal" />
<xs:attribute name="Rate" type="xs:decimal" />
<xs:attribute name="MuzzleVelocity" type="xs:decimal" />
<xs:attribute name="TimeAlive" type="xs:decimal" />
<xs:attribute name="Noise" type="xs:decimal" />
<xs:attribute name="DefaultWeapon" type="xs:string" />
......................
</xs:element>

I've removed some lines, shown by the ........ I've opened the xdp.xsd file using notepad.

Don't know if this stuff is of interest or not but for what its worth, its there and now is hopefully searchable when threads are searched.

David
 
Daiwilletti said:
Great to see all the testing results, Owen!

Aircraft will not be affected unless you delve into the gun xdp, and change the targetcategory="" parameter. Ships will only start to shoot at aircraft if their guns' xdp files are modified to include aircraft in the targetcategory field.

Of course, if the gun's "type" entry in the gun's xdp file ="flak_gun" then the gun automatically shoots at aircraft by default, without the need for the targetcategory="aircraft" entry.

The aircraft and vehicle SDK v1.5 contains an interesting file called "xdp.xsd" this file contains all the different categories that can be found for all the different xdp types in CFS3. (well actually I've found its missing a few things but its still useful)

Here is the section addressing gun xdps:

<xs:element name="Gun">
......
<xs:attribute name="GunType">
.......
<xs:enumeration value="flak_gun" />
<xs:enumeration value="cannon" />
<xs:enumeration value="drop_tank" />
<xs:enumeration value="rocket_container" />
<xs:enumeration value="bomb_container" />
<xs:enumeration value="pylon" />
<xs:enumeration value="gun" />
..................
</xs:attribute>
<xs:attribute name="TargetCategory" type="xs:string" />
<xs:attribute name="SoundName" type="xs:string" />
<xs:attribute name="Range" type="xs:decimal" />
<xs:attribute name="Rate" type="xs:decimal" />
<xs:attribute name="MuzzleVelocity" type="xs:decimal" />
<xs:attribute name="TimeAlive" type="xs:decimal" />
<xs:attribute name="Noise" type="xs:decimal" />
<xs:attribute name="DefaultWeapon" type="xs:string" />
......................
</xs:element>

I've removed some lines, shown by the ........ I've opened the xdp.xsd file using notepad.

Don't know if this stuff is of interest or not but for what its worth, its there and now is hopefully searchable when threads are searched.

David
Click to expand...

Thank you very much David..:applause:
this is very valuable indeed!
I don't have the skills needed to sort all of this out, your information is most welcomed..
And makes this Much easier, Oh yea!
 
I have all the Tigermoth missions set finished and tested here..
Just awaiting the final for the Tigermoth..
I hope to send all of this to Clive for upload when the tigermoth final is released..
And there is Much rejoicing!
:applause: :applause: :applause:
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top