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"Dumbing Down" the Betty Gunners

TARPSBird

TARPSBird

Moderator
Staff member
I'm re-installing CFS2 on my internal HD just in case I am ultimately not able to recover my original install off my messed-up external HD. Just a standard install right now. I am about to update the stock aircraft with The B24 Guy's overhaul versions but I'd like to know if the Betty's dp file has been tweaked to reduce the firepower and accuracy of the gunners.
I know the original MS dp was unrealistic and you'd normally get killed :engel016: at long range in any QC session against the Betties. More questions may follow, I've forgotten a lot of CFS2 good-to-know stuff.
 
I recommend for you to read this post from its first page to it last page. It has a list of Websites dedicated to this Sim and it also has many tips on how to expand your enjoyment through this Sim.

http://www.simviation.com/cgi-bin/ya...1117604819/all

If you have any questions please come back here to this forum and we as a community will help you along!

Watch you six and enjoy to its maximum.

P.S. One word of advice. Go slow with the addons since if you add to many addons at the same time. It may corrupt the program. Another advice IS to make a copy of your CFS2 on a external Hardrive just in case your CFS2 ever stop working or gets corrupted. This way you can fix it much easier than having to starting all over again!

Good luck and Enjoy!:wavey:
 
You can get a corrected Betty .dp with Defense of Australia, I think.
 
Here is a couple of posts on the subject by the B-24 Guy a couple years ago.

G :ernae:

Evil rear gunners
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Hi All,
As most of us CFS2er’s know the AI gunners have better aim than today’s smart bombs.
I mean come on, I was 2000ft above a Val and I made a high speed pass and got hit four times.
Dead center hits too. Two hits on the engine and two on the fuselage.
The most common fix for this is to reduce the range at witch the gunners open fire.
The other thing is to reduce the rate of fire.
These fixes work OK, but introduce unrealistic behavior.
I mean if I were rear gunner, I would give an attacking aircraft a burst, even if I new he was out of range, just to let him know I got my eye on him.
Well to make a long story short, last night I got one of my ideas. “What if I introduce an error factor on the bullets?” So I gave it a try. First, to make sure it would give the effect I was after, I offset the angle by 10deg., and those gunners could not hit the broad side of a barn as they say. Lot of tracers flying by, but no hits. This is good. I now have it set at 1deg. and so far I like it.
I think it is more realistic because the closer you get the less the error becomes and the chances of getting hit increase. Also, when you do get hit, it is no longer dead center.
If you would like to try it, use DPED to open the Aircraft’s DP file and change the L/R angle of the rear gunners bullets from 0 to 1. If you think you are not getting hit enough change it to 0.5 or 0.75.
Overwrite and del the CDP file and let me know what you think.
B24Guy

Hi All,
This is the fix I use.
Set the box marked "Trigger" to "0 Guns" and the box marked "Spec" to "2 Cannon"
I think that prehaps the box labled "Trigger" in DPED is really the "Spec" and vice-a-versa. Because the box marked "Spec" controls the player's trigger button.
Try it. You will be glad you did.
Regards,
B24Guy
 
All of that...

...does work nicely. It's old knowledge and has been well-tested. :applause:
 
miamieagle said:
P.S. One word of advice. Go slow with the addons since if you add to many addons at the same time. It may corrupt the program. Another advice IS to make a copy of your CFS2 on a external Hardrive just in case your CFS2 ever stop working or gets corrupted. This way you can fix it much easier than having to starting all over again!
Click to expand...
I agree, this time I'm not doing as many add-ons as with my previous install. Not as much scenery and not as many aircraft - at least not as many in the sim at one time as I used to have. Thanks everybody for your comments.
 
good post gedm,

Although a lot of this could be avoided and be more realistic if cfs2 had modeled Dispersion.
 
I mean if I were rear gunner, I would give an attacking aircraft a burst, even if I new he was out of range, just to let him know I got my eye on him.
Click to expand...
So reduce the round life value to the effective range of the gun based on its muzzle velocity.

That way, ...the gunners fire, ...and you see tracers, ...but they don't hit outside lethal range.


The other thing is to reduce the rate of fire.
Click to expand...
Flexible mounts with lightweight barrels are not stable, ...and the barrels flex.

Put them in an unstable, ...buffeting, ...possibly maneuvering aircraft...

Add to that a two(2) to three(3) hundred yard unstable maneuvering target...


A 1/3 rate of fire to represent accurate rounds (triple the % tracers to maintain visuals) is not unreasonable.

Waist gunners have mostly high angle rate shots, ...so reduce their range.

Tail gunners have more low angle rate shots, ...so increase their range.

Also, ...bullets slow down, ...so reduce the initial muzzle velocity by 1/3 (2/3 of spec.)

ie.
G4M2_Betty .dp

[GUNSTATIONS]
;; 1000ft ToF MV

; Type 92 7.7mm Machine Gun:
gunstation.0=1,51,1,0.300,635,0.258,0.01,164,1,60,1d1*3.2,0.00,0.00,6.424,0,0,0,-30,30,30,-30,1.2
; Type 99-1 20mm Cannon: Turret
gunstation.1=1,52,1,0.350,475,0.640,0.05,305,4,75,1d1*39.2,0.00,1.589,-2.200,0,0,0,-175,175,80,-5,13.8
; Type 99-1 20mm Cannon: (0.50xLethal Range)
gunstation.2=1,54,0,0.360,475,0.320,0.05,305,4,75,1d1*39.2,-0.877,0.225,-6.190,0,0,-90,-60,60,60,-60,13.8
; Type 99-1 20mm Cannon: (0.50xLethal Range)
gunstation.3=1,55,0,0.330,475,0.320,0.05,305,4,75,1d1*39.2,0.877,0.225,-6.190,0,0,90,-60,60,60,-60,13.8
; Type 99-1 20mm Cannon: (1.5xLethal/Engagement Range)
gunstation.4=1,57,0,0.340,475,0.960,0.05,458,4,75,1d1*39.2,0.00,0.001,-14.180,0,0,180,-30,30,45,-45,13.8
; Bomb Release:
gunstation.5=3,21,8,0.00,0,0,0,0,0,0,0,0,0,0,0,0,0,0,0,0,0,0
; Torpedo Release:
gunstation.6=5,62,32,0.00,0,0,0,0,0,0,0,0,0,0,0,0,0,0,0,0,0,0


[guns.0]
gun.0=680,0,0,0.800,0,0,1,680

[guns.1]
gun.0=500,0,-0.029,0.900,0,0,1,500

[guns.2]
gun.0=500,-0.923,-0.006,0.000,0,0,1,500
[guns.3]
gun.0=500,0.923,-0.006,0.000,0,0,1,500

[guns.4]
gun.0=500,0,0.001,-0.900,0,0,1,500

[guns.5]
gun.0=16,0,0,0,0,0,0,0

[guns.6]
gun.0=2,0,0,0,0,0,0,0


Not "dumbing down", ...but "smartening up"...

Enjoy.
 
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