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Hamilton/Senna over Vettel/Schumacher - Why I Chose The Firs

Panther_99FS

Panther_99FS

Retired SOH Administrator
First and foremost, all four drivers are incredible drivers but there's one key factor IMHO as to why I chose Hamilton and Senna over Vettel and *Schumacher. (I'll explain the * in a bit).

The reason is simple. Both Hamilton and Senna had to battle a world class and champion team mate to contend with in their seasons.

Rosberg gave Hamilton fits just as Prost gave Senna fits.
Vettel never did have any competition and it's arguable that if Webber was given equal treatment, Vettel might not be the 4-time champion that he is today.

Schumacher never had any team mate competition.
BUT....The * with Schumacher is that it's arguable that Schumacher was so dominant in his era that no one else left in the field could have given him competition as a team mate!
 
Panther_99FS said:
First and foremost, all four drivers are incredible drivers but there's one key factor IMHO as to why I chose Hamilton and Senna over Vettel and *Schumacher. (I'll explain the * in a bit).

The reason is simple. Both Hamilton and Senna had to battle a world class and champion team mate to contend with in their seasons.

Rosberg gave Hamilton fits just as Prost gave Senna fits.
Vettel never did have any competition and it's arguable that if Webber was given equal treatment, Vettel might not be the 4-time champion that he is today.

Schumacher never had any team mate competition.
BUT....The * with Schumacher is that it's arguable that Schumacher was so dominant in his era that no one else left in the field could have given him competition as a team mate!
Click to expand...

Reubens Barrichello could.... but was never allowed to win, even when he lead a race start to finish, the Scuderia made sure of that.

Ttfn

Pete
 
I put Senna and Schumacher above Hamilton, both Senna and Schumacher won in sub standard cars. Hamilton as had it easy in the Mercedes, F1 was ruined when Timo Glock let Hamilton passed to rob Felipe Massa of the 2008 Championship.
They should bring back the big serrated curbs and proper grass instead of concrete painted green it at least kept the drivers honest to stay within track limits.
 
erican2 said:
I put Senna and Schumacher above Hamilton, both Senna and Schumacher won in sub standard cars. Hamilton as had it easy in the Mercedes, F1 was ruined when Timo Glock let Hamilton passed to rob Felipe Massa of the 2008 Championship.
They should bring back the big serrated curbs and proper grass instead of concrete painted green it at least kept the drivers honest to stay within track limits.
Click to expand...

That's a fair point. But I would also debate that Hamilton really knows how to develop a car. Mercedes was not winning championships until after he got there - and conversely, McLaren went rapidly downhill after he left.
Now to compare Vettel vs Schumacher, I would debate that Schumacher could develop a car whereas as Vettel can't.
 
Sorry but I did reply but got the dreaded server busy message and unable to get on the site until about 2hrs later. I enjoyed the racing better in the 70's-80s, I just wish they would get rid of that drs crap and driver aids and go back to a basic car where it was the driver and not the car that won the race.
The governing bodies are slowly destroying all forms of motorsport, it's much less enjoyable to watch now than it was a decade or two ago.
I have been to the TT races on the IOM over the years and the Le Mans 24hr but would not go to watch the current F1 drivers.
 
Out of the four I rate Senna as head and shoulder above the other trio, despite his obsessive personality.
Schumacher wasn't much at developing cars, that was primarily down to Ross Brawn and Jean Todt.
Vettel couldn't do anything to get the car(s) right, as he's demonstrated with FIAT.
As for Hamilton, IMHO he knows how to get his car set up to his liking by his team, but that's not development.
Senna was renowned for his hands on approach in the garage, while his 'team mate' Prost complemented Senna's input at the same level.

Mere drivers don't 'develop' F1 cars in this 'Millennial' era, it's the huge workforce employed behind the scenes who do.

:173go1:
 
Agree totally with you. You only had to watch Senna in the rain with an inferior car to realize how great he actually was.
 
erican2 said:
Sorry but I did reply but got the dreaded server busy message and unable to get on the site until about 2hrs later. I enjoyed the racing better in the 70's-80s, I just wish they would get rid of that drs crap and driver aids and go back to a basic car where it was the driver and not the car that won the race.
Click to expand...
Agreed 100%
 
wombat666 said:
Out of the four I rate Senna as head and shoulder above the other trio, despite his obsessive personality.
Schumacher wasn't much at developing cars, that was primarily down to Ross Brawn and Jean Todt.
Vettel couldn't do anything to get the car(s) right, as he's demonstrated with FIAT.
As for Hamilton, IMHO he knows how to get his car set up to his liking by his team, but that's not development.
Senna was renowned for his hands on approach in the garage, while his 'team mate' Prost complemented Senna's input at the same level.

Mere drivers don't 'develop' F1 cars in this 'Millennial' era, it's the huge workforce employed behind the scenes who do.

:173go1:
Click to expand...

What I find to be extremely interesting about Senna is that he thought Michael Andretti was an extremely talented driver - but Ron Dennis and McLaren basically set up Andretti for failure.
Even to this day, Mario has nothing but praise for how Senna treated Michael. It's also sad that Michael was chastised for bringing his wife to the races especially since drivers are doing this nowadays....
 
Its comparing eggs with apples. Some drivers mentioned are above average skilled drivers and some lifted their team to a higher level. Hamilton was lucky to arrive in what became the most dominant team at the right time. Perhaps George Russell has the same talents and skills, but he just haven't the right car to show it.

Personally I prefer drivers who can bring a team technically to a higher level. So for me its Senna and Prost above the rest. Hamilton is definitely a very talented driver, but I wonder how "good" he will stay in a "less good" car. I think he doesn't have the talent to drive a less competitive car like a Haas, Alfa Romeo or Williams. Schumacher was a talented driver as well and I think he was one of the forces which kept Ferrari "organised" in those days.

Vettel was lucky to arrive at Red Bull at the right moment, when red Bull was the most dominant team. But he also doesn't have the talent to drive less competitive cars.....

Fernando Alsonso is definitely a driver with above average skills, but he also has the talent to switch to the wrong team at the wrong time

Cheers,
Huub
 
Vettel won his first race in a Toro Rosso...

Alonso isn't a team player, and not someone to develop a car. If he doesn't get a winning car, he not an easy person to work with. Wonder how he will do at Renault..

Hard to compare all drivers like Huub said, but all were in the right team at the right time. Schumacher had a great team at Ferrari with Ross Brawn, jean Todt, Rory Byrne and Kees van der Grint (Bridgestone.) Hamilton has a great team right now too. Even someone praised for his technical skills like Niki Lauda had cars at Ferrari he couldn't make better.
 
Speaking of developing cars....I wonder if the Red Bull speed had more to do with Webber than it did Vettel....?
I'd say Dan Gurney was the greatest at getting the most out of a mediocre car....
 
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