Help with MIP Maps

[Bullethead]

I'm using Paint Shop Pro 7. I'm using an OLD version of the Nvidia DDS plug-in because the current version doesn't work with PSP7. The current version is 8.23.1101 and I've got 5.67. I've never dealt with DDS and MIPs before, so have no clue how to use this thing.

When I open a DDS file, it asks me if I want to see the MIP maps it's got. I say no, so I just see the regular texture. I save it as some other format that supports layers, do my thing, flatten it, then want to save it as a DDS file. Then a box pops up that has a BUNCH of options about how to save the thing, and I have NO CLUE which ones to select. Could somebody please tell me?

The attached pics are 1st what an OFF skin looks like when I say OK, show me the MIPs when I open it. It appears to have 11 of them.

The other pic shows the box of options I get when I want to save the file as a DDS. Rabu said "use the same number and types of MIPs as it had to start with", but I have no way to find out that info, so don't know what to put in on this option box. I've made a few guesses but they never end up looking a thing like one of the OFF skins when I re-open it to check how it came out.

Any help would be appreciated. Thanks.

 

[ns13jarhead]

Have you checked out GIMP (www.gimp.org)? It's a free download and it's got the same functionality as PhotoShop, or so I'm told. It's probably more powerful than what I need right now.

 

[Bullethead]

Have you checked out GIMP (www.gimp.org)? It's a free download and it's got the same functionality as PhotoShop, or so I'm told. It's probably more powerful than what I need right now.

Yeah, I tried GIMP a couple weeks ago and decided I didn't like itl. I find its functionality very lacking compared to even PSP7, which is what made me break down and install old PSP7 instead. I think I might just have to buy Photoshop now, seeing how I think they don't make PSP anymore.

 

[rabu]

Yeah, I tried GIMP a couple weeks ago and decided I didn't like itl. I find its functionality very lacking compared to even PSP7, which is what made me break down and install old PSP7 instead. I think I might just have to buy Photoshop now, seeing how I think they don't make PSP anymore.

On the Navida website there is a free dds viewer called WTV that Tom Blaho created (click here); down load it and use it to view the dds files and see their type and MIP info along with alpha chanels, etc.

Do not open a dds with the MIPS, save it with the MIPS

 

[Bullethead]

On the Navida website there is a free dds viewer called WTV that Tom Blaho created (click here); down load it and use it to view the dds files and see their type and MIP info along with alpha chanels, etc.

Do not open a dds with the MIPS, save it with the MIPS

Thanks.

OK, looking at a randomly chosen skin in WTV, it appears that they are in DTX1 with no alpha channel. WTV also says it's showing MIP Map 1/12. Does say what method was used to create them. Should I assume they were made using a flat surface instead of a box?

This also brings up a question. In my attached pic above that shows the MIPs, there's 1 full-size version of the texture and 11 smaller copies, each 1/2 the dimensions of the one before. I had assumed that the full-size version was the real texture and the 11 smaller ones were MIP maps. But WTV says there are 12 MIP maps in total, which would have to include the full-size version. So is that how it works? Is everything really a MIP map, even the full-size?

It would help if I knew why MIP maps exist and what they do. I'm assuming they're for when the airplane is far away, so it only uses a small amount of texture, saving your graphics horsepower for the stuff that's up close. IOW, the texture equivalent of small LOD 3D models for distant planes. Is that correct?

Also, one of the save options is "use existing MIP maps". Does that literally mean that the original MIPs don't change at all? IOW, suppose I start with a green airplane and repaint it white. If I save as "use existing MIPs", would this plane then appear white up close but would turn green in the distance? IOW, should I generate new MIPs instead of using the old ones?

Thanks again.

 

[rabu]

Thanks.

OK, looking at a randomly chosen skin in WTV, it appears that they are in DTX1 with no alpha channel. WTV also says it's showing MIP Map 1/12. Does say what method was used to create them. Should I assume they were made using a flat surface instead of a box?

This also brings up a question. In my attached pic above that shows the MIPs, there's 1 full-size version of the texture and 11 smaller copies, each 1/2 the dimensions of the one before. I had assumed that the full-size version was the real texture and the 11 smaller ones were MIP maps. But WTV says there are 12 MIP maps in total, which would have to include the full-size version. So is that how it works? Is everything really a MIP map, even the full-size?

It would help if I knew why MIP maps exist and what they do. I'm assuming they're for when the airplane is far away, so it only uses a small amount of texture, saving your graphics horsepower for the stuff that's up close. IOW, the texture equivalent of small LOD 3D models for distant planes. Is that correct?

Also, one of the save options is "use existing MIP maps". Does that literally mean that the original MIPs don't change at all? IOW, suppose I start with a green airplane and repaint it white. If I save as "use existing MIPs", would this plane then appear white up close but would turn green in the distance? IOW, should I generate new MIPs instead of using the old ones?

Thanks again.

The MIPs give distance with less load, I think, don't worry about understanding the whole thing, just open them with the defaults with out the MIPS and save them in the same format and with the same number of new MIPS generated from your new editing.

 

[Bullethead]

All righty, thanks again. If I run into problems, I'll bother you again .

 

[sandbagger]

I skin using PSP version 7 and DXTbmp to convert the files from/to DDS format. Maybe its not as advanced as the Nvidia plug in, but its simple and avoids the tangle of 'what does this do' problems you're having.

Unless you have a better reason to use the plug-in rather than DXTbmp, I'd say stick with DXTbmp - its simpler.

BTW: OFF skins saved as DXT 1. I've used the following settings in DXTbmp for all of the skins I've converted from Extended Bitmap to DDS format:

Alpha Chanel window - left blank

MipMaps include:
checked the 'included when saving' box
didn't check the '16bit dither' box
selected 'box'
scaling filter selected 'none'.

Saved bitmap as DDS DXT1 format

 

[Bullethead]

I skin using PSP version 7 and DXTbmp to convert the files from/to DDS format.

I don't have DXTbmp but I have ConvIm by the same guy. Hadn't thought to try it again since I got the plugin, but gave it a go just now and it seems to do the trick perfectly.

Thanks