Multi-lod FsFrance Me-262a "Beta Range

[_486_Col_Wolf]

Was wondering if anyone else had this problem and if there was a fix. The MLOD FS France 262 after takeoff reads 99% fuel capacity. If you skip to next action the screen after spawn shows fuel low- engine sputtering, however the fuel guage shows 98 + %?? Any Ideas?

 

[Rami]

Reply...

486_Col_Wolf,

Welcome to the infamous jet warp "bug" of CFS2. You can't warp, the sim engine won't allow it, unless...you do a "fix" in the airfile, (Tango Romeo used to know how to do that, and it's in the Alphasim He162 Salamander) and it's been so long since I've done it, I've completely forgotten how.

The only problem with that is, hitting the engine key starts the engines immediately, there's no spool up effect. If I recall, I could never get it working with the Me-262.

I eventually came down on the side that the Me-262 moves so fast, you'll get where you're going quickly enough anyway.

It's one of the side effects of using a sim designed for props, not turbines.

 

[_486_Col_Wolf]

Thanks Rami, I was hoping it had to do with the AIR file showing two tanks and the CFG file showing 3 three. Since there is no fix I guess I'm out of luck LOL. I was writing some after-war missions for Operation Lusty with Watson's Whizzers. I guess I can shorten the test flight missions but the last one was going to be from Leipheim to Cherburg. Well, I guess I'll just have to fly the whole route! Thanks again for the quick reply

 

[Rami]

Reply...

Thanks Rami, I was hoping it had to do with the AIR file showing two tanks and the CFG file showing 3 three. Since there is no fix I guess I'm out of luck LOL. I was writing some after-war missions for Operation Lusty with Watson's Whizzers. I guess I can shorten the test flight missions but the last one was going to be from Leipheim to Cherburg. Well, I guess I'll just have to fly the whole route! Thanks again for the quick reply

486_Col_Wolf,

You can add the fuel tank, that's not a problem. I can do a side-by-side comparison of the two airfiles and see if it triggers my memory, but you'll have to give me a couple of days on that.

 

[msfossey]

Rami,

Is there a tutorial regarding the "how to" part of adding a fuel tank/drop tank?

Thanks,

msfossey

 

[Blood_Hawk23]

_486_Col_Wolf ...

Tango helped me with a setup a couple years back.
There is a way around the warp bug. one is to use unlimited fuel. the other is to use a different engine type.

In the air file,
If it has a "1501 fs2k turbine engine" then you will get the warp bug. if you do not (like the FoxFour jets) then you can warp.

check that out and see what you can do. I would use the FF Saber or Mig as a guide. It may require some work to get it right.

Note on fuel:
Last I knew you had to have the same locations in both the air file and cfg for the drop tanks to work.

 

[kelticheart]

Tango helped me with a setup a couple years back.
There is a way around the warp bug. one is to use unlimited fuel. the other is to use a different engine type.

In the air file,
If it has a "1501 fs2k turbine engine" then you will get the warp bug. if you do not (like the FoxFour jets) then you can warp.

check that out and see what you can do. I would use the FF Saber or Mig as a guide. It may require some work to get it right.

Note on fuel:
Last I knew you had to have the same locations in both the air file and cfg for the drop tanks to work.

Right on the nail head, Blood_Hawk23!

That's exactly what I was going to answer, since I crashed head-on in the same bug a while ago, when I wanted a realistic spool-up effect for early jet engines in Korea.

Only the FS2000 turbine/jet engine entries in the airfile allow a slow, realistic spool-up effect when starting an early jet engine. By the same token, these entries cause the CFS2 "warp-bug", that sucks up all the fuel in the tanks even if the gauges read near-full. Edit them out and the problem is gone, but you'll have jet engines startup as piston engines. No way out of it.

As to the drop tanks, there's no need to edit the aircraft.cfg. They only need to be added in the airfile, left droptank and right droptank, with the fuel capacity matching the one described in any given droptank *.dp file, if one wants to have the full capacity.

In case of aircraft using different droptank sizes, i.e. a P-51 either 75 or 110 gallon tanks, the top capacity must be entered in the record, otherwise you'll never get the extra fuel when using the larger tanks. When using smaller tanks, their *.dp file will prevent the extra fuel allowed by the airfile.
To add a working bomb bay tank, available for example in Malinowski's Ju88 collection, one only needs to have an external droptank with all the location coordinates set to zero and the allowable fuel capacity entry only.

Naturally, the last step is to set up a proper popup fuel panel, using MAPE fuel switches to take advantage of all the tanks listed in the airfile. Stock CFS2 fuel switches are very limited as they were designed to serve fighter planes only, which do not have the same fuel tank arrays usually found in multi-engined bombers and such.

Cheers!
KH

 

[_486_Col_Wolf]

The slow spool engine is what drew me to the ME-262 I'm using and I'd rather not do without it. This is when the warp bug started. I'll work around the warp bug with short test flights and one long flight to Cherbourg as part of my Operation Lusty missions. thanks guys!

 

[Blood_Hawk23]

The slow spool engine is what drew me to the ME-262 I'm using and I'd rather not do without it. This is when the warp bug started. I'll work around the warp bug with short test flights and one long flight to Cherbourg as part of my Operation Lusty missions. thanks guys!

To get around the warp bug just use the unlimited fuel option. and you can warp anywhere you want.

I did it for my own remake of Tango's bunker Hill Missions. I added Afterburners to simulate a cat launch. It works great but to do it you have to use the FS2k jet turbine and enable the afterburn. which gives you the warp bug.

Use "600 jet engine". I think you need "601 jet power" curve as well. maybe 600-606. I'm not sure.

Look at the FF sabers to see what they did.

So you do have to choose one or the other. I'm not sure if you could play with the sound files to increase the start up time or not.

Thats the Limits of jets in the Prop world.

UPDATE:
After lookin at the sabers I saw this.

In the 600, there are two speed settings for the starter speed look at those. maybe its something that can be adjusted. I imagin the higher the number the long it will take. probably in milliseconds. so its 3.277 seconds to start for the saber and 7.782 seconds to starter stops. That might have to be doubled. I could test it later and see.

UPDATE 2:
Nevermind it didn't work. the engine would not start.

Update 3:
Actually it may have worked. I had the sound muted. LOL
Time for bed I guess. 3am is late enough.

Till later,
John

 

[kelticheart]

To get around the warp bug just use the unlimited fuel option. and you can warp anywhere you want....

Yes, BH. If one never minds the realism factor, that's the only way to get around it.

But then the needs for external droptanks, plus the attention factor of dropping them just before a dogfight to get rid of the extra weight and drag, are gone as well.

To me, the price to pay for an "ear-candy" is a tad too high, since I am for close-to-real-life as much as possible. Obviously, anyone can choose the balance between fiction and reality that pleases them.

Cheers!
KH

 

[Blood_Hawk23]

Do you think a new sound would help?

 

[kelticheart]

Do you think a new sound would help?

...mmmm, why not? Good idea!

A starter-startup jet sound file modified to run longer than a piston engine one. Then again, the airfile should reflect the longer sound but I don't know how to modify it to achieve such result.

I noticed many times that startup soundfiles, played individually through Windows media player sounded longer that the actual engine start in CFS2. I have several aircrafts using the same sound set with different engine start timings, this must depend on the airfile.

Tinkering with it could bring back the original problem, but I believe it's worth a try.

Bearcat could answer this question better than me, as he holds a vast experience in modifying flight models.

Cheers!
KH

 

[bearcat241]

The easiest way to beat the warp issue is to simply use time compression during your commute to work. You are allowed to bump the sim speeds up to 4x the normal. BTW, 4x will get you anywhere you want to go in a hurry, and you can still take in some scenery along the way. Just make it easier by installing some basic (or advanced) autopilot gauge from the vast resources available in CFS2 and FS7/FS8/FS9. Yes, even FS AP gauges will work in CFS2 if your air file has active AP. After you pull up the AP window, its important that you set the altitude and heading first, then activate the AP and then go to time compression in this order. Keep your kite at the low end of cruise speed range if you have wingmen or you will end up flying away from your flight. Due to in-flight directional drift over long distances (caused by prop torque, wind or magnetic declination), you'll have to use the heading dial on the AP to constantly adjust your vector on the green line heading indicator of your CFS2 target window that points to the next waypoint.

As you get within 2-3 miles of your next waypoint, reduce the sim speed back to normal and disengage the AP. You don't want to be tinkering with the AP and/or sim speeds when you hit the waypoint and you have bogies spawning in your face or on your six.

I seldom use warp unless the mission objectives specifically call for it. This allows me to visually monitor fuel management along the way and avoid low fuel or no fuel issues at the next action point. If the next waypoint is really far away like 100-200 miles, i can even walk away from the computer for a brief period on AP.

 

[kelticheart]

The easiest way to beat the warp issue is to simply use time compression during your commute to work. You are allowed to bump the sim speeds up to 4x the normal. BTW, 4x will get you anywhere you want to go in a hurry, and you can still take in some scenery along the way. Just make it easier by installing some basic (or advanced) autopilot gauge from the vast resources available in CFS2 and FS7/FS8/FS9. Yes, even FS AP gauges will work in CFS2 if your air file has active AP. After you pull up the AP window, its important that you set the altitude and heading first, then activate the AP and then go to time compression in this order. Keep your kite at the low end of cruise speed range if you have wingmen or you will end up flying away from your flight.

As you get within 2-3 miles of your next waypoint, reduce the sim speed back to normal and disengage the AP. You don't want to be tinkering with the AP and/or sim speeds when you hit the waypoint and you have bogies spawning in your face or on your six.

I seldom use warp unless the mission objectives specifically call for it. This allows me to visually monitor fuel management along the way and avoid low fuel or no fuel issues at the next action point. If the next waypoint is really far away like 100-200 miles, i can even walk away from the computer for a brief period on AP.

Thanks, Bearcat!

I knew we could count on you, how are you these days?

This is a great solution! I used it several times when enjoying CFS2 as a simple flight sim and engaging into some elaborate flight plans just for the fun of flying.

I did not think it could be used successfully during missions. It'll also allow for a realistic, very enjoyable early jet engine startup (which I think you have set in your CFS2 warbirds, haven't you? ).

I save this thread, print it out and insert it my CFS2 manual, based on SOH threads. Over the years it has become a hefty book!

Cheers!
KH

 

[bearcat241]

Ciao il mio buon amico!

I'm doing well. As for the topic here, yes i do enjoy realistic spooling in my jets and wouldn't trade it for nutin'. I hate "instant start" air files and will do everything in my power to alter one at the first sign. BTW, a little off topic here, but if you guys want better AI wingmen performance in jet combat, do your dance in 2x speed. But be warned, bring your "A" game against the opposition. The bad guys won't linger in your gunsight for easy kills and they will magically find your six with quickness if you get sloppy

 

[kelticheart]

....I hate "instant start" air files and will do everything in my power to alter one at the first sign...

.....

Hey, I just had an idea!

Would it be too much asking you to pack together the flight models of the primary jets used in Korea (and the Me262, if you fixed it as well) you thus modified?

It would be a great mod to upload and your reply above, about taking advantage of the 2x/4x simulation rate CFS2 offers, could be included as the instructions to follow for the best way to get around CFS2 "warp bug" in early jet aircrafts. Practically, all of the tedious job of writing the readme is done already.

Should you prefer to hold back your work on the airfiles, the surest way to keep copyrights intact, just the engine spool up record entries for the airfiles would suffice nicely. It would save a lot of trial and error time waste for a whole lot of us!

How about it?

Cheers!
Stef KH

 

[bearcat241]

Would it be too much asking you to pack together the flight models of the primary jets used in Korea (and the Me262, if you fixed it as well) you thus modified?

Well, not much to upload regarding this. For single engine jets, i already have the converted SF8 Sabre in the library, unless somebody forgot to include it in the system revamp (hint to librarian). It has a realistic spool up. And Morton did a nice reiteration of it with his skin package recently. As for twin jets, i think most of us have an install of FS2002 or FS2004 on our rigs from which we can borrow the engine parameters of the Lear45 as a baseline for any twin engine legacy fighters like the 262. As for shortening the spooling times on anything, i've never bothered about it.

 

[kelticheart]

Thanks!

Well, not much to upload regarding this. For single engine jets, i already have the converted SF8 Sabre in the library, unless somebody forgot to include it in the system revamp (hint to librarian). It has a realistic spool up. And Morton did a nice reiteration of it with his skin package recently. As for twin jets, i think most of us have an install of FS2002 or FS2004 on our rigs from which we can borrow the engine parameters of the Lear45 as a baseline for any twin engine legacy fighters like the 262. As for shortening the spooling times on anything, i've never bothered about it.

Roger that, BC!

Cheers!
KH