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  • Please see the most recent updates in the "Where did the .com name go?" thread. Posts number 16 and 17.

    Post 16 Update

    Post 17 Warning

RN carrier trainers?

They wernt used that much as far as I know, I have a book on them here and I don't think many were built 18 I think. I remember one being used on a rubber deck for trials landing without an under carriage called the F.21 if you can believe that, apart from that I think most were used as T.22 to give fast jet experience but were soon replaced as the more powerful 2 seat T.11's were being built! I know Sea Venoms were used but never as trainers as far as I can remember!
 
I believe the Sea Balliol was the last dual control carrier trainer even if not used much, the T11 Vampire was not hook equipped so no deck landings, Sea Venom was not dual control.

Peter the Vampire was tested doing gear up landings on a big airbag and was successful but not adopted, to much time taken to get it out of the way for another to land.

I saw news reels of the trials as a lad back in the 50's

The Sea Vampire would have been used for training as other single seaters were 1st deck landing and cat take of the trainee pilot was on his own.
 
Vampire T11 and Sea Vampire T22 are essentially the same thing, T11 being RAF and T22 Royal Navy. Neither were hook equipped

The Vampire was the worlds first jet aircraft to land on and take off a aircraft carrier, it was not suitable for Royal Navy carrier use due to lack of power and range.
 
I read that the Navy replaced it's own T.22's which were early models with T.11's and kept the designation of T.11 not sure how accurate this is and as said there virtually indistinguisable externally apart from paint jobs! Think they varied in cockpit avionics and framed canopies?
 
peter12213 said:
They wernt used that much as far as I know, I have a book on them here and I don't think many were built 18 I think. I remember one being used on a rubber deck for trials landing without an under carriage called the F.21 if you can believe that, apart from that I think most were used as T.22 to give fast jet experience but were soon replaced as the more powerful 2 seat T.11's were being built! I know Sea Venoms were used but never as trainers as far as I can remember!
Click to expand...

Hi Pete

Perhaps you are thinking about the Sea Vampire F.20. I believe that the Navy had 18 of those.

The Sea Vampire T Mk 22 served with the Royal Navy from 1953 until the late 1970. 73 were delivered to the FAA. They served with 718, 736, 759 and 764 training squadrons as well as various RVNR and first line squadrons. They were also used by several station flights.

Their main role was in the fifties preparing pilots for the jet powered Attackers, Sea Hawks and Sea Venoms.

Cheers

Paul
 
Paul you are correct the F20 was a single seat fighter used as a lead in to the Attacker and later jets, the T22 was a 2 seat dual control trainer with more power than the F20 and used as a lead in the same way , essentially the same as the RAF T11.
 
Rich said:
Paul you are correct the F20 was a single seat fighter used as a lead in to the Attacker and later jets, the T22 was a 2 seat dual control trainer, essentially the same as the RAF T11.
Click to expand...


Thanks

For anyone who is interested a good book is -
De Havilland Twin Boom Fighters by Barry Jones (Crowood). This covers the Vampire, Venom and Sea Vixen and provides a decent coverage of FAA operations.

Cheers

Paul
 
Up until the end of fixed wing conventional flying in the FAA, they used marked out carrier decks on existing runways, and fitted these with mirror approach equipment. Arrestor wires were not used to my knowledge as the approach is the important thing, every thing else is someone else's problem!

Not sure about Capt 'Winkle' Brown being the most famous Briton (or indeed test pilot) of all, but he is indeed a special pilot. I had a 20 minute chat with him last year, whilst he was filming at the FAST mueseum for the BBC. He certainly packed a lot into his first 40 odd years on this planet!
 
paulb said:
Thanks

For anyone who is interested a good book is -
De Havilland Twin Boom Fighters by Barry Jones (Crowood). This covers the Vampire, Venom and Sea Vixen and provides a decent coverage of FAA operations.

Cheers

Paul
Click to expand...

Yeah that's a great book, I have it here!
 
calypsos said:
Up until the end of fixed wing conventional flying in the FAA, they used marked out carrier decks on existing runways, and fitted these with mirror approach equipment. Arrestor wires were not used to my knowledge as the approach is the important thing, every thing else is someone else's problem!

Not sure about Capt 'Winkle' Brown being the most famous Briton (or indeed test pilot) of all, but he is indeed a special pilot. I had a 20 minute chat with him last year, whilst he was filming at the FAST mueseum for the BBC. He certainly packed a lot into his first 40 odd years on this planet!
Click to expand...

Granted I may have been a little over enthusiastic however in my opinion he is one of the all time great pilots, and I'm jelous you have met him!
 
Well, while it might be hyperbole to say any one pilot was the best of all time, I believe he still holds (or at least for a while held) the record for the most number of aircraft test flown. I believe that extends to the ME-163, though I'm on a limb on that one. His book "Wings of the Navy" is superb. His prose is one of the best of the best (there's my hyperbole! :) ) but his treatment of all the allied carrier planes is very impartial and based on the wealth of his experience.

Rich, thanks for piping in on this - I was secretly hoping you would, as you're one of the guys who has understood what is/is not available for FSX FAA ops.

Pity about the Balliol, as I would bet it'll never be done in FSX - bless Ito for tackling those kinds of projects. Well, glad I asked anyway.

I find it odd that apart from the Balliol (and maybe navalized Harvards, don't know), the FAA's didn't focus on "carrier qualifications" the way the US did, with trainers like Trojans, Buckeyes, and the like, or the French with Zephyrs. I guess, like Calypsos points out, shooting approaches at the various RNAS was the option they pursued ... interesting.

dl
 
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