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PBR Texturing: Introduction to 3D Workflow in Photoshop

It's a really clever and inexpensive piece of software that I've definitely not explored the full potential of (primarily because my modelling isn't good enough to make best use of it.)

I'm glad to see that others are getting much more from the package - are any of you using Megascans as well? I played with it pre-release but that is too expensive for me at present. It looks like for scenery that uses PBR in a 64-bit sim, it'll be a phenomenal resource.

Ian P.
 
It's a really clever and inexpensive piece of software that I've definitely not explored the full potential of (primarily because my modelling isn't good enough to make best use of it.)

I'm glad to see that others are getting much more from the package - are any of you using Megascans as well? I played with it pre-release but that is too expensive for me at present. It looks like for scenery that uses PBR in a 64-bit sim, it'll be a phenomenal resource.

Ian P.

I'm using Megascans Ian. I opted for the "Hobby" subscription for starters, but will upgrade to the commercial license when I begin to use the assets in future payware. The Megascans Mixer and Bridge are fantastic for creating and organizing assets. Once the interface is set up, the custom scans from Megascans are automatically inserted into the Quixel work flow.

I'm still in the learning curve, but anyone with Photoshop experience will pick up the logic of the Quixel software without any problems. The learning curve for PBR, as it relates to simulators like Prepar3D, is going to be comprehensive but well worth the investment of time and capital. Once Prepar3D goes full PBR, our flight simulators are going to be...well...magnificent. IMO
 
Some of the posts above you were talking about a process using Quixel and Gimp, yet at the moment I don't think Quixel can work with The Gimp ... maybe in a while but not yet unless a solution already exists ?

After some unsuccessful attempts with Quixel (repeated crashes with 16 GB of RAM), I decided to explore another software of the same kind: Substance Painter (SP).

SP has the advantage of being an independent program and not a plug-in which makes it less dependent on the machine's memory.
After a few tests, I managed to find a workflow that allows me to use it with current versions of Prepar3D (textures not PBR). That said, SP's vocation is to offer PBR textures and I think I can share my experience on this other way of approaching this subject.

Thanks for your post.
 
Some of the posts above you were talking about a process using Quixel and Gimp, yet at the moment I don't think Quixel can work with The Gimp ... maybe in a while but not yet unless a solution already exists ?

After some unsuccessful attempts with Quixel (repeated crashes with 16 GB of RAM), I decided to explore another software of the same kind: Substance Painter (SP).

SP has the advantage of being an independent program and not a plug-in which makes it less dependent on the machine's memory.
After a few tests, I managed to find a workflow that allows me to use it with current versions of Prepar3D (textures not PBR). That said, SP's vocation is to offer PBR textures and I think I can share my experience on this other way of approaching this subject.

Thanks for your post.


As far as I know Quixel does not work in Gimp. I referenced Gimp as a software that can be used to prepare assets for Quixel. Those assets would be any bitmap that Quixel uses, along with the mesh to construct the model used. :encouragement:
 
Quixel is a native Photoshop plugin which works heavily with xml scripting. I also had RAM related crashes with my 16GB RAM, but only when 3Do was running over a prolonged period of time and the texture maps were set on 4096 squared.

Lagaffe, it would be interesting to know about your experiences with Substance Painter! As an independent application it might have a better performance and be more efficient with RAM usage, as you stated. Did I understand that there is a workflow which allows exporting Directx type textures (diffuse + diffuse alpha, specular) ? Or, does it burn AO maps into the diffuse map? Does it support bump map painting?


Cheers,
Mark
 
Curvature Options in Quixel 2

This cap also shows the normal mapping that is automatically generated when selecting a texture. The ability to move the mesh and light in three dimensions takes the guesswork out of bumps, spec, gloss, curvature and weathering, all of which are adjustable. Pretty trick.


44543217761_86e84fdb99_o.jpg

You can say that again! Beautiful work there "G"!
 
Quixel is a native Photoshop plugin which works heavily with xml scripting. I also had RAM related crashes with my 16GB RAM, but only when 3Do was running over a prolonged period of time and the texture maps were set on 4096 squared.

Lagaffe, it would be interesting to know about your experiences with Substance Painter! As an independent application it might have a better performance and be more efficient with RAM usage, as you stated. Did I understand that there is a workflow which allows exporting Directx type textures (diffuse + diffuse alpha, specular) ? Or, does it burn AO maps into the diffuse map? Does it support bump map painting?

Cheers,
Mark

Yes, perfectly I succeeded in early 2018 in making a set of textures for Prepar3D or FSX with Substance Painter 2017.

Wanting to try my hand at creating planes for X-Plane, I followed Javier Rollon's Youtube channel dedicated to the creation of his SF-260 (exemple: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gjwy3_7vDyQ&list=UUozowg6xXJuz1FO3D42T2zg&index=55&t=20s). It was when he approached texture creation with SP that I became interested in this software.
After some research I actually found Quixel too and tried to do some tests with both software to see.

As far as I'm concerned, I'm more comfortable with SP and on the memory side it seems "lighter": it's a software in its own right and not a plug-in like Quixel, so it's more responsive and less subject to lags and blockages.

It was during my Menestrel HN700 project that I became interested in SP. After browsing the Internet and reading your work as well, I began to understand the interaction of the different textures between them and how we could still create a process to create FSX/P3D textures based on SP.

AO creations - interior - front gear - rear gear :
attachment.php



attachment.php



attachment.php


After SP workflow
- interior - front gear - rear gear :
attachment.php



attachment.php


attachment.php


These are not too complicated textures to make and I could have done them with just Gimp. There, it allowed me to test the process and get a result that I liked.

Since May 2018, I have put this project on hold to devote myself with Jean-Pierre Fillon (Quebec.org) to the realization of a large Quebec airport (near Montreal) that will soon be completed.
I would have to get this Menestrel HN700 back together to revive my memory and give you the elements that I have used to achieve theses textures.

In principle, the process is almost identical:
- creation of AOs in your modeling software
- duplication of the desired object (front wheel for example) then assignment via a multi-material of several basic colors to distinguish the different elements (brakes, tire, cylinder, valve, etc.):=> texture ID
- import into SP of the duplicated object (FBX or OBJ format, I prefer FBX)
- import of AO and ID texture
- selection of diverses elements via the color defined in the texture ID then application of the various layers

PS: This process is identical between the two software packages.

The main problem lies in the way we initialize the project in SP since according to the pattern used at the beginning we define a certain number of textures that will then be processed in the software and ultimately when exporting will correspond or not to the desired goal.
I took notes during my various essays and I have to gather them together to make a summary... in English (I'm French, sorry)

The two screenshots of my SP input and export settings are refused by my image host: Postimage ??? I don't understand why.
Anyway, I'll try to give you the main parameters:
- New project
Create a texture set per UDIM tile => unchecked
Normal map format : DirectX
Compute tangent space per fragment => unchecked
Document resolution .... as you want
- Export
Config: Document channels + Normal + AO (With Alpha)
Common padding : Dilatation + Default background color (dilatation 8 pixels)

Texture sets
DefaultMaterial_Diffuse
DefaultMaterial_Specular
DefaultMaterial_Glossiness
DefaultMaterial_Height
DefaultMaterial_Normal
DefaultMaterial_Emissive
DefaultMaterial_Normal_DirectX
DefaultMaterial_Mixed_AO

After that, I have tried to compose all theses textures to obtain the result as you seen before, using the Marks's advices about Quixel.

Best regards,
Didier.
 
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Thanks for taking your time for this write-up, Didier! Very interesting.

I'll see if I can get a try-before buy version of Substance Painter and give it a try so I can compare the results. Although, I must say, I wouldn't want to miss the bump mapping tool of Quixel, and the Megascan Mixer/Bridge feature.


Cheers,
Mark
 
I know a commercial developer (sim software developer, not add-on developer) from outside the flight simulation world whose team started developing PBR using Quixel and then moved to Substance because of instability and other issues with Quixel.

Substance is A LOT more capable and powerful than Quixel, but the price rises to match. I've used both and I'd much prefer to work with Substance - I just cannot justify hundreds of pounds spent on software that gives me no return.

Or, more precisely, Mrs. P would pointedly refuse any justification I came up with for spending hundreds of pounds on software for no return. :D

Ian P.
Edited to add: She nodded.
 
Looking at the Substance licenses... WOW! Those prices!!! I will just invest in more DDR RAM on a new build next year.
 
Looking at the Substance licenses... WOW! Those prices!!! I will just invest in more DDR RAM on a new build next year.

Yes, it is but you can find this software on STEAM at a lower price. During November 2017 I find a very good PROMO and succeed to buy it for 70 € :santahat:
 
Looking at the Substance licenses... WOW! Those prices!!! I will just invest in more DDR RAM on a new build next year.

Yes, it is but you can find this software on STEAM at a lower price. During November 2017 I find a very good PROMO and succeed to buy it for 70 € :santahat:
So wait a little before ...
 
Looking at the Substance licenses... WOW! Those prices!!! I will just invest in more DDR RAM on a new build next year.

Yes, it is but you can find this software on STEAM at a lower price. During November 2017 I find a very good PROMO and succeed to buy it for 70 € :santahat:
So wait a little before ...

You can also buy a BUNDLE (very expensive) or only SP ... I choose the last solution.
 
Ok, didn't know Steam offered Substance. Get one year updates, not bad. Thanks!
Currently its Substance Painter 2018 at $149.99 and good reviews.
 
I really like the idea of a side by side comparison of Quixel and Substance Painter. Both represent a step towards PBR integration in Prepar3D and should be explored in depth.
 
SB offers a 30 day trial, at the bottom of the page mentiond above. I think I'll grab it and run a comparison!


Cheers,
Mark
 
That's what I did, with both Substance Painter and Builder - They were both fantastic resources. I'd thoroughly recommend that anyone with even a passing interest in PBR and modelling use the trial periods to take a look.

Ian P.
 
Have started on Quixel but find it little less than utterly nerve-wrecking, starting with the online activation, the loading of the program, the import of textures and meshes etc. Error messages crop up galore, all gobbledegook. You have to go to the online manual, which lists an impressive number of possible hitches. At one point they say, start Photoshop in admin mode, then shut down, then try again. (Why didn't I think of that for my uploaded models -- in case of trouble start FSX, then close it, repeat until it's working.) Haven't even got to baking anything. Let me see, where is that 'frustrated' smiley ...
 
Have started on Quixel but find it little less than utterly nerve-wrecking, starting with the online activation, the loading of the program, the import of textures and meshes etc. Error messages crop up galore, all gobbledegook. You have to go to the online manual, which lists an impressive number of possible hitches. At one point they say, start Photoshop in admin mode, then shut down, then try again. (Why didn't I think of that for my uploaded models -- in case of trouble start FSX, then close it, repeat until it's working.) Haven't even got to baking anything. Let me see, where is that 'frustrated' smiley ...

Ouch!!!

Ok...show of hands...do we want to see an installation tutorial. Probably the best place to start is getting the software plugged in without having a psychotic break.
:dizzy:

I can put together a video that eases the pain.



IMPORTANT...IMPORTANT...HUGE...

Make sure that you're forcing 3DO2.exe to use your video card instead of integrated graphics - you can configure this through your Nvidia control panel. Bigger capacity cards make a world of difference in Quixel. Did I say huge??? Yep....

I'm in the process of booting back into my fully reborn, revitalized, clean, fresh...7TB of freshly formatted drives, squeaky clean Windows 10 OS and updated Prepar3Dv4.
First thing I installed, after the OS was Photoshop. Right after that Quixel, then a fresh install of 3D Studio Max, then Prepar3Dv4.

On the clean system, the Quixel install was not eventful. I ran the install and it booted Photoshop and went straight to work. I had been experiencing serious lags before, but on the clean boot it is lightning fast.

I'm rapidly coming back to life, so I will have some time to dedicate to an install video to get people up and running.
Also, I'm going to download the trial Substance Painter and do a side by side. I'll see what works best for me and stick with it. PBR is here to stay, so there is no time like the present.
 
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