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The Staff of SOH
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Please see the most recent updates in the "Where did the .com name go?" thread. Posts number 16 and 17.
The OZX Grumman Goose HD Redux Now Released!
- Thread starter JayKae
- Start date
Wow you guys can really grab some fantastic screenshots!
Its funny that durning the WIP stage i got a strange e-mail acussing us of Photoshopping the screenshots to make them look better than they really were and basically say we were full of it! yes sad but true.....Im so glad to see you guys have surpassed our WIP/pimp shots and that your enjoying the package
Sorry to say we didnt get around to touching any of the sounds in anyway,but im sure if anyone out there can get around to fixing the problems with it the team would love to hear from you so the issues could maybe get sorted and a patch worked up for everyone?
Cheers
steve
Its funny that durning the WIP stage i got a strange e-mail acussing us of Photoshopping the screenshots to make them look better than they really were and basically say we were full of it! yes sad but true.....Im so glad to see you guys have surpassed our WIP/pimp shots and that your enjoying the package
Sorry to say we didnt get around to touching any of the sounds in anyway,but im sure if anyone out there can get around to fixing the problems with it the team would love to hear from you so the issues could maybe get sorted and a patch worked up for everyone?
Cheers
steve
Gents, the solution to the sound issue was right here under our noses. Check out this thread: http://www.sim-outhouse.com/sohforums/showthread.php?t=79 -- it's just a matter of a super-simple sound.cfg tweak, and you're good to go!
Thanks again to the OZx team for rejuvenating such a fine bird and making it tons better.
Thanks again to the OZx team for rejuvenating such a fine bird and making it tons better.
Roger
Senior Administrator
Gents, the solution to the sound issue was right here under our noses. Check out this thread: http://www.sim-outhouse.com/sohforums/showthread.php?t=79 -- it's just a matter of a super-simple sound.cfg tweak, and you're good to go!
Thanks again to the OZx team for rejuvenating such a fine bird and making it tons better.
I've applied that tweak and it works, but everytime I go into vc from spot I hear the cabin water effect until I reduce throttle to zero then back up again and it goes. Anyone got an idea on that one?
oldpropfan
Charter Member
Just wanted to say thanks for all the hard work, the "new" Goose is just fantastic
. I can actually taxi her up and down a ramp now to get in the water:ernae: and the new paints are beyond words.
Haven't by any chance thought of doing a Redux on the stock DC-3 have you
. If not a graphical redo maybe we can talk Pam into at least tweaking the fm.
May have to cosmoline my Gooney for awhile as between this and the Aerosoft Catalina I'm moving my ops to the islands of Greece, the Carib, and ..........
Al
. I can actually taxi her up and down a ramp now to get in the water:ernae: and the new paints are beyond words.Haven't by any chance thought of doing a Redux on the stock DC-3 have you
. If not a graphical redo maybe we can talk Pam into at least tweaking the fm.May have to cosmoline my Gooney for awhile as between this and the Aerosoft Catalina I'm moving my ops to the islands of Greece, the Carib, and ..........
Al
piperarcherpilot
Charter Member
The graphics side of things is really nice!
And the flight model is MUCH better! However, I'm having a few issues after about 2 hours of flying/testing.
1) Roll authority seems too low based on real Grumman Goose videos.
2) Above about 160 mph, the propeller gauge shows the props overspeed and go far beyond redline, and the props will not respond to any control input until you slow down again.
3) I assume this is a transfered issue from MS. Even with the sound fix posted here, I still get the same problem with the mid range sounds playing continuously in the background inside the VC. The sound in this thing (from Microsoft's doing, that is) seems really buggy...
4) Probably the biggest issue: I cannot fly the missions anymore because when cargo is loaded, it must be defaulting to a very far forward CG. Even with FULL aft trim, I need LOTS of backpressure just to hold level flight. Also, the water run is about 5 times longer than it used to be (again, just when cargo is loaded in a mission).
All in all, there are elements that are much improved in the FM, but it seems there are also elements that make it less flyable than it used to be. Anyone else have these issues too?
Sorry, dont mean to only say negative things. I still cant get over how much better the plane looks with a high res makeover! Very nice!
And the flight model is MUCH better! However, I'm having a few issues after about 2 hours of flying/testing.
1) Roll authority seems too low based on real Grumman Goose videos.
2) Above about 160 mph, the propeller gauge shows the props overspeed and go far beyond redline, and the props will not respond to any control input until you slow down again.
3) I assume this is a transfered issue from MS. Even with the sound fix posted here, I still get the same problem with the mid range sounds playing continuously in the background inside the VC. The sound in this thing (from Microsoft's doing, that is) seems really buggy...
4) Probably the biggest issue: I cannot fly the missions anymore because when cargo is loaded, it must be defaulting to a very far forward CG. Even with FULL aft trim, I need LOTS of backpressure just to hold level flight. Also, the water run is about 5 times longer than it used to be (again, just when cargo is loaded in a mission).
All in all, there are elements that are much improved in the FM, but it seems there are also elements that make it less flyable than it used to be. Anyone else have these issues too?
Sorry, dont mean to only say negative things. I still cant get over how much better the plane looks with a high res makeover! Very nice!
Brett_Henderson
Charter Member
First off.. B E A U T I F U L work !! :ernae:
Now the picky stuff.. and it quite possibly could be my install method .. (I installed it to a temp location, and then moved it all in carefully)..
As a fellow freeware designer, I don't feel bad posting things like this... they're things I'd want posted... and as a real-world pilot.. I approach all my sim flights as though they were real..
That said.. I didn't get very far. I'll assume you researched empty/max weights (even though they don't correspond to anything I've found.. but they're close).. That aside.. the payload screen makes no sense..So I ventured into the cfg file. I found that many of the stations lines start with the cfg file equivelant of a REM ( "//" ) .. which makes that line nothing but a remark.
Will simply editing out those "//" leave me with what was intended ?
I'll report back.. I won't turn the prop on a plane until I'm comfy with how it's loaded..
Now the picky stuff.. and it quite possibly could be my install method .. (I installed it to a temp location, and then moved it all in carefully)..
As a fellow freeware designer, I don't feel bad posting things like this... they're things I'd want posted... and as a real-world pilot.. I approach all my sim flights as though they were real..
That said.. I didn't get very far. I'll assume you researched empty/max weights (even though they don't correspond to anything I've found.. but they're close).. That aside.. the payload screen makes no sense..So I ventured into the cfg file. I found that many of the stations lines start with the cfg file equivelant of a REM ( "//" ) .. which makes that line nothing but a remark.
Will simply editing out those "//" leave me with what was intended ?
I'll report back.. I won't turn the prop on a plane until I'm comfy with how it's loaded..
Hi Guys,
First of all many thanks for your kind words and screenshots. Pam, Steve and myself had a great time putting the Goose together and its very rewarding to see you guys enjoying it.
As Steve has mentioned, we didn't touch any of the sound files so if there are issues there I can only blame MS!
There was a comment about the props overspeeding...
The flight model and virtually every parameter in the Aircraft.cfg was altered to some extent. This is true for the engine and prop section. The installer is designed to update all these figures so the engines perform as intended. If you manually install the package there is a chance some of these figures could be missed and you'll get some strange performance issues such as prop overspeed.
I am working on an update for the [lights] section to add shockwave lights apart from what A2A has done. The Goose looks even better with these on... visions of strong lights fighting off the fog in some distant fiord as you land.
Cheers
Butch
WIP - I'll post the config once I am finished.
First of all many thanks for your kind words and screenshots. Pam, Steve and myself had a great time putting the Goose together and its very rewarding to see you guys enjoying it.
As Steve has mentioned, we didn't touch any of the sound files so if there are issues there I can only blame MS!
There was a comment about the props overspeeding...
The flight model and virtually every parameter in the Aircraft.cfg was altered to some extent. This is true for the engine and prop section. The installer is designed to update all these figures so the engines perform as intended. If you manually install the package there is a chance some of these figures could be missed and you'll get some strange performance issues such as prop overspeed.
I am working on an update for the [lights] section to add shockwave lights apart from what A2A has done. The Goose looks even better with these on... visions of strong lights fighting off the fog in some distant fiord as you land.
Cheers
Butch
WIP - I'll post the config once I am finished.
Brett_Henderson
Charter Member
I don't think a manual install would cause my issues.. It's just a cfg file text issue. I could be wrong.. Has anyone else seen this ?
The weights are off too (empty and max).. and the fuel tanks are 170 gal each.. I'm pretty sure the max fuel load was 220 gallons (110 each ), and a max range of aprox. 650nm..
I'm re-working the weight staions.. and descriptions (ala listing them in thier own paragraph).. and I'm changing the fuel tanks.. I'll change the weights too, and see if that makes it pilot-loadable from the 'Fuel and Payload' screen.. and report back..
The weights are off too (empty and max).. and the fuel tanks are 170 gal each.. I'm pretty sure the max fuel load was 220 gallons (110 each ), and a max range of aprox. 650nm..
I'm re-working the weight staions.. and descriptions (ala listing them in thier own paragraph).. and I'm changing the fuel tanks.. I'll change the weights too, and see if that makes it pilot-loadable from the 'Fuel and Payload' screen.. and report back..
piperarcherpilot
Charter Member
Brett,
I have the same 'slashed out' weights section too. There are no values for positioning the passenger seats, and the names of the stations have changed from default, so thats probably why the plane no longer works properly for any of the missions. I notice the same about the fuel tanks and max weight. Shouldnt max gross weight for a goose be about 1200 pounds higher so its around 8100 lbs (depending on model)?
Butch,
I used the installer. I'm noticing the same issues as here: http://www.sim-outhouse.com/sohforums/showthread.php?t=19064
I have the same 'slashed out' weights section too. There are no values for positioning the passenger seats, and the names of the stations have changed from default, so thats probably why the plane no longer works properly for any of the missions. I notice the same about the fuel tanks and max weight. Shouldnt max gross weight for a goose be about 1200 pounds higher so its around 8100 lbs (depending on model)?
Butch,
I used the installer. I'm noticing the same issues as here: http://www.sim-outhouse.com/sohforums/showthread.php?t=19064
Brett_Henderson
Charter Member
@butchm .. I've researched several sites.. empty weights are in the 5400lb range .. max weights are between 7200 and 8200 lbs..
Those numbers work out nicely, after I edited the weight stations.. Full fuel (220 gal) and 4 passengers (in addition to the two pilots) with 200lbs of baggage put it ~300lbs over-weight.. which is just about right. You can load 6,8, even 10 passengers into a Goose, but you have to carry well under full fuel.
Here is my edit.. it allows for pilot loading.. I've left all the passenger stations/baggage stations empty.. it can be edited for a partial, default load.. OR just leave it like this for full loading discretion.
max_number_of_stations = 36
station_load.0 = 340, 0.897, 0.0, -1.008
station_load.1 = 0, 10.767, 0, 0
station_load.2 = 15, 8.97, 0, -2.245
station_load.3 = 15, 7.633, 0, -2.247
station_load.4 = 0, 0, 0, 0
station_load.5 = 0, 0, 0, 0
station_load.6 = 10, 4.939, 0, 1.974
station_load.7 = 0, 0, 0, 0
station_load.8 = 0, 0, 0, 0
station_load.9 = 0, 0, 0, 0
station_load.10 = 0, 0, 0, 0
station_load.11 = 0, -13.9, 0.0, 0.0
station_load.12 = 0, -6.051, 0,0
station_load.13 = 0, -5.555, 0,0
station_load.14 = 0, -8.585, 0,0
station_load.15 = 175, -12.625,0,0
station_load.16 = 115, -14.645,0,0
station_name.0 = "Pilot-Copilot"
station_name.1 = "Nose Compartment"
station_name.2 = "Front Chain Locker"
station_name.3 = "Rear Chain Locker"
station_name.4 = "Pass #1 Couch"
station_name.5 = "Pass #2 Couch"
station_name.6 = "Hatch"
station_name.7 = "Pass #3 Left Seat"
station_name.8 = "Pass #4 Left Seat"
station_name.9 = "Pass #5 Right Seat"
station_name.10 = "Pass #6 Right Seat"
station_name.11 = "Rear Baggage"
station_name.12 = "Aux Seat"
station_name.13 = "Aux Seat"
station_name.14 = "Aux Seat"
station_name.15 = "Water Tank"
station_name.16 = "Lavatory"
This however, is just the begining. This realistic loading throws the performance out of whack.. I cant even get 1800 RPM on a takeroff roll.. and it's now way under-powered. I'll keep tinkering..
@piperarcherpilot ... Those sound issues are a pain.. I tried the sound.cfg edit last year.. no go. So i've just replaced the whole sound folder, with that of the P-51.. I think it's actually a bug in the mdl file.
Those numbers work out nicely, after I edited the weight stations.. Full fuel (220 gal) and 4 passengers (in addition to the two pilots) with 200lbs of baggage put it ~300lbs over-weight.. which is just about right. You can load 6,8, even 10 passengers into a Goose, but you have to carry well under full fuel.
Here is my edit.. it allows for pilot loading.. I've left all the passenger stations/baggage stations empty.. it can be edited for a partial, default load.. OR just leave it like this for full loading discretion.
max_number_of_stations = 36
station_load.0 = 340, 0.897, 0.0, -1.008
station_load.1 = 0, 10.767, 0, 0
station_load.2 = 15, 8.97, 0, -2.245
station_load.3 = 15, 7.633, 0, -2.247
station_load.4 = 0, 0, 0, 0
station_load.5 = 0, 0, 0, 0
station_load.6 = 10, 4.939, 0, 1.974
station_load.7 = 0, 0, 0, 0
station_load.8 = 0, 0, 0, 0
station_load.9 = 0, 0, 0, 0
station_load.10 = 0, 0, 0, 0
station_load.11 = 0, -13.9, 0.0, 0.0
station_load.12 = 0, -6.051, 0,0
station_load.13 = 0, -5.555, 0,0
station_load.14 = 0, -8.585, 0,0
station_load.15 = 175, -12.625,0,0
station_load.16 = 115, -14.645,0,0
station_name.0 = "Pilot-Copilot"
station_name.1 = "Nose Compartment"
station_name.2 = "Front Chain Locker"
station_name.3 = "Rear Chain Locker"
station_name.4 = "Pass #1 Couch"
station_name.5 = "Pass #2 Couch"
station_name.6 = "Hatch"
station_name.7 = "Pass #3 Left Seat"
station_name.8 = "Pass #4 Left Seat"
station_name.9 = "Pass #5 Right Seat"
station_name.10 = "Pass #6 Right Seat"
station_name.11 = "Rear Baggage"
station_name.12 = "Aux Seat"
station_name.13 = "Aux Seat"
station_name.14 = "Aux Seat"
station_name.15 = "Water Tank"
station_name.16 = "Lavatory"
This however, is just the begining. This realistic loading throws the performance out of whack.. I cant even get 1800 RPM on a takeroff roll.. and it's now way under-powered. I'll keep tinkering..
@piperarcherpilot ... Those sound issues are a pain.. I tried the sound.cfg edit last year.. no go. So i've just replaced the whole sound folder, with that of the P-51.. I think it's actually a bug in the mdl file.
Thanks Brett - will look into it. One of the problems with such a rare airplane is definitive information. The Goose, to use Pam's words was "the worlds tinker toy" and over time has been altered to suit the operator.
Even some of the data we collected from Antilles does not match that data we got from older sources so it begs the question... which one is right? I'd say the answer is somewhere in between.
Don't get too caught up in number crunching mate, go for a flight somewhere amazing and watch the world slip slowly by under those big beautiful radials.
It's what this is all about.
Even some of the data we collected from Antilles does not match that data we got from older sources so it begs the question... which one is right? I'd say the answer is somewhere in between.
Don't get too caught up in number crunching mate, go for a flight somewhere amazing and watch the world slip slowly by under those big beautiful radials.
It's what this is all about.
Brett_Henderson
Charter Member
Thanks Brett - will look into it. One of the problems with such a rare airplane is definitive information. The Goose, to use Pam's words was "the worlds tinker toy" and over time has been altered to suit the operator.
Even some of the data we collected from Antilles does not match that data we got from older sources so it begs the question... which one is right? I'd say the answer is somewhere in between.
Don't get too caught up in number crunching mate, go for a flight somewhere amazing and watch the world slip slowly by under those big beautiful radials.
It's what this is all about.
No doubt
.. and it IS a beauty (now).. I'm still blown away by the new look.I'm just a compulsive, realism chaser.. 1/2 the fun for me, is flight planning.. deciding where you'll go.. how many people on board.. appropriate fuel.. So I was thrown for a loop when I went to load it up
piperarcherpilot
Charter Member
I just did another series of test flights (with the sound off so as not to be distracted - "Microsoft, what in the world did you do...?!"). The engine RPM issue is real (after a re-install to be sure it wasnt a bad install). At 150 mph and manifold pressure at redline, the props start becoming erratically responsive to control inputs. At 160 mph, the props do not respond to any control inputs and slowly start exceeding redline. RPM continues to increase with increased airspeed (like they're beyond governing range or something) and at never exceed speed as marked on the ASI, the props are at 3200 RPM and still climbing. I repeated this several times and got the same results. I do not regain control of the prop pitch until i've slowed through about 100 mph.
Hmm...any ideas?
Hmm...any ideas?
Brett_Henderson
Charter Member
I've opened a can of worms here.. no turning back now
With the added weight, I just did a quick paste of the original engine/prop data.. bumped max engine RPM by 50, and i'm getting realistic performance and prop-control..
Next.. if you decide to reduce fuel capacity to the realistic 110 gal per tank.. you'll have to modify the fuel gauge. Even though it's digital, its XML code is displaying fuel as a percentage, that is then multiplied by capacity (hard-coded in the XML).. so it still reads full tanks as 170 gallons. I'm going to extract the XML doc from the cab file, and fix that, if anybody wants it.
As for the High-HP version.. I just flew it, and prop-control yields violent gyrations.. I'm not even gonna mess with that. The 450HP is fine. I'll probably mess with the MOIs, as it does indeed roll a bit heavy..
When all is said and done.. this is going to be my fav aircraft... now that it's better looking than payware :ernae:
With the added weight, I just did a quick paste of the original engine/prop data.. bumped max engine RPM by 50, and i'm getting realistic performance and prop-control..
Next.. if you decide to reduce fuel capacity to the realistic 110 gal per tank.. you'll have to modify the fuel gauge. Even though it's digital, its XML code is displaying fuel as a percentage, that is then multiplied by capacity (hard-coded in the XML).. so it still reads full tanks as 170 gallons. I'm going to extract the XML doc from the cab file, and fix that, if anybody wants it.
As for the High-HP version.. I just flew it, and prop-control yields violent gyrations.. I'm not even gonna mess with that. The 450HP is fine. I'll probably mess with the MOIs, as it does indeed roll a bit heavy..
When all is said and done.. this is going to be my fav aircraft... now that it's better looking than payware :ernae: