It's a toss up!

falcon409 · Nov 12, 2009

Sometimes I can go for weeks without being able to capture anything worth using for photoreal scenery, SBX and the USGS sites are never very predictable. Then, out of the blue I can do an entire Island. . .go figure.
I don't know if I'll actually do anything with this but I had to place it anyway just to see how it looked.

Marlin · Nov 12, 2009

Looks great to me!!!

DB93 · Nov 12, 2009

falcon409 said:
Sometimes I can go for weeks without being able to capture anything worth using for photoreal scenery, SBX and the USGS sites are never very predictable. Then, out of the blue I can do an entire Island. . .go figure.
I don't know if I'll actually do anything with this but I had to place it anyway just to see how it looked.

Well, since you've already gone and placed it... no real reason to not keep going with it. Looks great to me, and while I have no idea where that is from that shot, I can tell it's a place I wouldn't mind flying in and out of. :applause:

NoNewMessages · Nov 12, 2009

Asking the obvious here, but you are aware that is not an active airport any more and hasn't been for a good while? Sort of like looking at Kahuku and wondering just where MS got their data from? :kilroy:

And there are "other sources" for good imagery, if you just hunt for them. If you decide to continue on "that airport", I have the whole island in 30cm source. And I mean the WHOLE island! Must finish that work I started last year!

falcon409 · Nov 12, 2009

LCSims said:
Asking the obvious here, but you are aware that is not an active airport any more and hasn't been for a good while? Sort of like looking at Kahuku and wondering just where MS got their data from?

Yep, this was a spur of the moment thing. I was shooting touch n go's at Dillingham and decided to fly around for awhile. When I spotted Ford Island I landed there and got the idea to try to get a satellite image. I couldn't get a decent hi res image for a small strip like Ranger Creek but it would give me the entire Ford Island, lol. Very frustrating and actually aside from the servers within SBX and the USGS Seamless Server I'm not aware of any other sources or what to even look for.

Finally, I won't be doing anything with Ford Island. Never intended to really I just was blown away that the servers could be so hit and miss. I've had at least a dozen different airports I wanted to do in photscenery and couldn't get any of the servers to give me decent imagery and then this. It would be very nice to have a source that was reliable.

GaryGB · Nov 12, 2009

falcon409 said:
aside from the servers within SBX and the USGS Seamless Server I'm not aware of any other sources or what to even look for.

Hi Ed:

Dick Ludowise (aka "rhumbaflappy") had mentioned a few years ago in an AVSIM thread that he found quality photoreal imagery publicly available via a U.S.D.A. web portal; that web portal has now developed to a level nearly as full-featured as the U.S.G.S. site. :iidea:

You merely need to create a free account so they can compose the requested package at their convenience (a couple of hours usually), and then send you a e-mail with a link to an individual per-order download URL.

If you further review the FSDeveloper thread I linked to in your Ranger Creek thread here (regarding George Davison's airport "skirting" for flattens), you will find it is a thread discussing in detail accessing and using U.S.D.A.'s "NAIP" aerial imagery (...sometimes better imagery than via U.S.G.S., and generated from lower altitudes).

Hope this helps ! :mixedsmi:

GaryGB

crashaz · Nov 12, 2009

falcon409 said:
Yep, this was a spur of the moment thing. I was shooting touch n go's at Dillingham and decided to fly around for awhile. When I spotted Ford Island I landed there and got the idea to try to get a satellite image. I couldn't get a decent hi res image for a small strip like Ranger Creek but it would give me the entire Ford Island, lol. Very frustrating and actually aside from the servers within SBX and the USGS Seamless Server I'm not aware of any other sources or what to even look for.

Finally, I won't be doing anything with Ford Island. Never intended to really I just was blown away that the servers could be so hit and miss. I've had at least a dozen different airports I wanted to do in photscenery and couldn't get any of the servers to give me decent imagery and then this. It would be very nice to have a source that was reliable.

Love the photoreal textures... but for what I am working on... the modern stuff won't work. Oahu is done very nicely for sat imaging if you want to do a modern Oahu.

falcon409 · Nov 12, 2009

GaryGB said:
. . . . . .If you further review the FSDeveloper thread I linked to in your Ranger Creek thread here (regarding George Davison's airport "skirting" for flattens), you will find it is a thread discussing in detail accessing and using U.S.D.A.'s "NAIP" aerial imagery (...sometimes better imagery than via U.S.G.S., and generated from lower altitudes).
Hope this helps ! :mixedsmi:
GaryGB

Hmm, ok, musta missed it. I went through all the links and never saw any reference to USDA sites. I'll check again when I get a chance.

Found it!!

jdhaenens · Nov 12, 2009

This is the USDA place: http://datagateway.nrcs.usda.gov/

falcon409 · Nov 12, 2009

jdhaenens said:
This is the USDA place: http://datagateway.nrcs.usda.gov/

Yep, I signed up for access. . .apparently I didn't get the level of access right though because the verification e-mail I got states:
<meta http-equiv="Content-Type" content="text/html; charset=utf-8"><meta name="ProgId" content="Word.Document"><meta name="Generator" content="Microsoft Word 12"><meta name="Originator" content="Microsoft Word 12"><link rel="File-List" href="file:///C:%5CUsers%5Cejwells%5CAppData%5CLocal%5CTemp%5Cmsohtmlclip1%5C01%5Cclip_filelist.xml"><link rel="themeData" href="file:///C:%5CUsers%5Cejwells%5CAppData%5CLocal%5CTemp%5Cmsohtmlclip1%5C01%5Cclip_themedata.thmx"><link rel="colorSchemeMapping" href="file:///C:%5CUsers%5Cejwells%5CAppData%5CLocal%5CTemp%5Cmsohtmlclip1%5C01%5Cclip_colorschememapping.xml"><!--[if gte mso 9]><xml> <w:WordDocument> <w:View>Normal</w:View> <w:Zoom>0</w:Zoom> <w:TrackMoves/> <w:TrackFormatting/> <w

unctuationKerning/> <w:ValidateAgainstSchemas/> <w:SaveIfXMLInvalid>false</w:SaveIfXMLInvalid> <w:IgnoreMixedContent>false</w:IgnoreMixedContent> <w:AlwaysShowPlaceholderText>false</w:AlwaysShowPlaceholderText> <w

oNotPromoteQF/> <w:LidThemeOther>EN-US</w:LidThemeOther> <w:LidThemeAsian>X-NONE</w:LidThemeAsian> <w:LidThemeComplexScript>X-NONE</w:LidThemeComplexScript> <w:Compatibility> <w:BreakWrappedTables/> <w:SnapToGridInCell/> <w:WrapTextWithPunct/> <w:UseAsianBreakRules/> <w

ontGrowAutofit/> <w:SplitPgBreakAndParaMark/> <w

ontVertAlignCellWithSp/> <w

ontBreakConstrainedForcedTables/> <w

ontVertAlignInTxbx/> <w:Word11KerningPairs/> <w:CachedColBalance/> </w:Compatibility> <w:BrowserLevel>MicrosoftInternetExplorer4</w:BrowserLevel> <m:mathPr> <m:mathFont m:val="Cambria Math"/> <m:brkBin m:val="before"/> <m:brkBinSub m:val="--"/> <m:smallFrac m:val="off"/> <m:dispDef/> <m:lMargin m:val="0"/> <m:rMargin m:val="0"/> <m:defJc m:val="centerGroup"/> <m:wrapIndent m:val="1440"/> <m:intLim m:val="subSup"/> <m:naryLim m:val="undOvr"/> </m:mathPr></w:WordDocument> </xml><![endif]--><style> <!-- /* Font Definitions */ @font-face {font-family:"Cambria Math"; panose-1:2 4 5 3 5 4 6 3 2 4; mso-font-charset:1; mso-generic-font-family:roman; mso-font-format

ther; mso-font-pitch:variable; mso-font-signature:0 0 0 0 0 0;} @font-face {font-family:Calibri; panose-1:2 15 5 2 2 2 4 3 2 4; mso-font-charset:0; mso-generic-font-family:swiss; mso-font-pitch:variable; mso-font-signature:-520092929 1073786111 9 0 415 0;} /* Style Definitions */ p.MsoNormal, li.MsoNormal, div.MsoNormal {mso-style-unhide:no; mso-style-qformat:yes; mso-style-parent:""; margin:0in; margin-bottom:.0001pt; mso-pagination:widow-orphan; font-size:12.0pt; font-family:"Times New Roman","serif"; mso-fareast-font-family:Calibri; mso-fareast-theme-font:minor-latin; color:navy;} a:link, span.MsoHyperlink {mso-style-priority:99; color:blue; text-decoration:underline; text-underline:single;} a:visited, span.MsoHyperlinkFollowed {mso-style-noshow:yes; mso-style-priority:99; color

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Take your government issued photo ID (e.g. state issued drivers license) and present it in person to a Local Registration Authority (LRA) who can activate your account with Level 2 access. Most LRAs are located at a USDA Service Center office, to find the nearest USDA Service Center office go to http://offices.sc.egov.usda.gov/locator/app?type=lra. We recommend that you call ahead to ensure that an employee trained as a Local Registration Authority (LRA) will be available to provide the service at the time you plan to visit the Service Center.

Yea, probably not, lol, lol. I guess I'll go back and try this again, lol.

Dain Arns · Nov 12, 2009

falcon409 said:
Yep, I signed up for access. . .apparently I didn't get the level of access right though because the verification e-mail I got states:
<link rel="File-List" href="file:///C:%5CUsers%5Cejwells%5CAppData%5CLocal%5CTemp%5Cmsohtmlclip1%5C01%5Cclip_filelist.xml"><link rel="themeData" href="file:///C:%5CUsers%5Cejwells%5CAppData%5CLocal%5CTemp%5Cmsohtmlclip1%5C01%5Cclip_themedata.thmx"><link rel="colorSchemeMapping" href="file:///C:%5CUsers%5Cejwells%5CAppData%5CLocal%5CTemp%5Cmsohtmlclip1%5C01%5Cclip_colorschememapping.xml"><style>  </style>

Take your government issued photo ID (e.g. state issued drivers license) and present it in person to a Local Registration Authority (LRA) who can activate your account with Level 2 access. Most LRAs are located at a USDA Service Center office, to find the nearest USDA Service Center office go to http://offices.sc.egov.usda.gov/locator/app?type=lra. We recommend that you call ahead to ensure that an employee trained as a Local Registration Authority (LRA) will be available to provide the service at the time you plan to visit the Service Center.

Yea, probably not, lol, lol. I guess I'll go back and try this again, lol.

Says you have an LRA in your hometown there... :icon_lol:

NoNewMessages · Nov 12, 2009

falcon409 said:
...actually aside from the servers within SBX and the USGS Seamless Server I'm not aware of any other sources or what to even look for.

Sometimes it takes a little hunting with Google to find stuff. Many times the USGS is getting their data supplied by the states, who go and get some crazy stuff done. A couple of states have 2 foot (not meters) elevation data. One state has 7cm aerial for the whole state. I'm slowly downloading the 2,000+ files as time allows. But even with 640gb internal and 640gb external storage, I must be aware of the size of things.

O'ahu is available in 30cm resolution, though it took some hunting to find the stuff. Fits nicely on 14 DVDs and some time next year I'll reload it and look at it again.

falcon409 · Nov 12, 2009

Well, my apologies to those who use this site and like it. . . .I guess I've gotten to an age or point in my life where some things just annoy the crap out of me and this site is one of em. I appreciate the information that directed me to this and I guess it's an alternative site if I ever want to have a bad day, lol. . .but as frustrating as the other servers are, I'll stick with them.

GaryGB · Nov 13, 2009

Hi Ed:

I know what you mean with some web sites being problematic to use, and the USDA has had an oddly independent mode of operation compared to other government agencies for many decades. :icon_lol:

But since I've occasionally been told during irate phone calls with representatives of the USGS that some imagery I requested which repeatedly and inexplicably never had the online order fulfilled, was reportedly "withheld" (not explaining whether this was due to homeland security or data management issues), I appreciated having the USDA site make the same imagery available via their servers when the USGS may have been having a "bad day". :applause:

Regarding your periodic failure to retrieve all tiles for a photoreal project via SBuilderX, you may be getting "profiled" by the imagery tile servers via your IP address or a cookie. :icon_eek:

FYI: Luis Sa' has occasionally had to find new ways to work around imagery tile server profiling of his DLLs used in SBuilder to deal with this problem, too.

If one has the more common "dynamic" ADSL ISP broadband type of account which allows periodic changes of IP address allocated to the "WAN-side" of ones modem or router (usually at intervals set by the ISP's DHCP server), one can also manually reset the assigned IP address any time one wishes to do so. :iidea:

If one's DSL modem is in "bridge" mode, one may wish to try forcing a "disconnect" of the broadband router via its GUI at 192.168.0.1 (most common modem or router address used in USA hardware).

Then one can re-connect to the TCP/IP PPOE under a newly assigned IP address via your ISP's DHCP server, invalidating imagery tile servers' "tracking and permissions" protocol for ones prior IP address.

If one doesn't use a router, and the DSL modem is in "normal" mode", power off the DSL modem; within 60 seconds of powering the modem back up, ones ISP's DHCP server should have assigned a new "WAN-side" IP address to the modem.

At worst, one might then have to re-initialize the connection between the modem and ones computer by re-booting Windows; but one usually only needs to refresh ones browser or re-login to a website or imagery tile server in order to "assume a new alias". :d

Upon returning the imagery website, one's computer may now look like a totally different computer ...without a tracking profile, so the server may be willing to allow more content to be downloaded to one's system.

One may need to also clear one's browser cookies; in addition to the UI to do this in FireFox (or MSIE) browsers, one may wish to use Nir Sofer's "MozillaCookiesView" utility from:

http://www.nirsoft.net/utils/mzcv.html

...or for MSIE browsers, "IECookiesView" utility from:

http://www.nirsoft.net/utils/iecookies.html

Afterwards, one may need to manually restore a few cookies for convenience of auto-login at favorite, trusted websites such as SOH, AVSIM, etc., but this might help get rid of many tracking histories (in addition to imagery tile servers!) that slows down browsing... and limits one's imagery downloads. :pop4:

I don't think imagery tile servers have begun logging MAC addresses yet; but if they do, rest assured that there is free and safe software one can then use to "randomize" one's MAC address in outbound TCP/IP data packets (this is done routinely for increased security by knowledgeable IT administrators for large computer networks ...as well as "hackers").

Hope this might help you (and others here) to get more "immediate gratification" with your photoreal imagery scenery projects !

GaryGB

falcon409 · Nov 13, 2009

Gary,
You are without a doubt the most informed and informative person I've ever run into, lol. Your posts read more like a tech manual than some manuals I've read. Basically what I do is copy everything you post and keep it in a file for FSX info.

After reading all that, and looking into the last thing you mentioned about possibly being targeted for having download too many images, I looked into my cookies to see if I could judge what actually was showing for those servers. What I discovered was that I have no cookies. The cookies.txt file that the cookie viewer refers to does not reside on my system.

I did a system wide search and it turned up nothing. . .I manually went into the mozilla file folder and went through each and every folder inside that directory and there was no cookie.txt. Having said that however, there is a cookie at play somewhere because all my logon id's and invoice info for sites like Aerosoft, Alphasim, IRIS, Flight1 and others has been preserved somehow, so not sure why the cookies file isn't retrievable.

Also, it seems as though if I were in fact being limited by the servers it would be total and not hit and miss as it is now. I should have never gotten on this scenery kick, because now I have all these airport I'd like to enhance and more often than not I'm unable to get anything usable as a background.

GaryGB · Nov 13, 2009

Hi Ed:

Although the "Cookies.txt" file was used in Netscape Navigator and earlier versions of Mozilla browsers, the new format used is a *.sqlite file extension database; cookies.txt is no longer used by Mozilla, and was of course never used by MSIE. :iidea:

FYI: Mozilla FireFox must NOT be running (as with all database engines, it will "lock" the *.sqlite files and not allow data to show in database browsers / editors or in NirSoft Mozilla Cookies Viewer).

The NirSoft cookie viewer utility by default looks for *.txt file extensions; but it also offers the ability to pick Mozilla's newer "*.sqlite" file extension as the "filter" in the File > Select Cookies File / Profiles Folder > Browse dialog.

When setting the Mozilla Cookies Viewer "Profiles Folder", browse to the Windows "active user account profile" \Application Data folder chain and select the desired active user account profile under:

(ex: C:\Documents and Settings\[active user profile name]\Application Data\Mozilla\Firefox\Profiles\ ...on Windows XP Pro)

When setting "Files of Type: to "FireFox 3 Cookies File (*.sqlite)", one should browse to the Windows "active user profile" Application Data folder chain, select the desired active user account "FireFox profile".

Now one find and selects the "Cookies.sqlite" file; this is where your "active" FireFox cookies are listed.

(ex: C:\Documents and Settings\[active user profile name]\Application Data\Mozilla\Firefox\Profiles\[profile name].* ...on Windows XP Pro)

NOTE:The paths shown above are slightly different in Vista and Win7 !

Once opened, the cookies.sqlite file can be edited as desired (but it is best to make a backup first !).

BTW: For more complete control, I prefer to use the NirSoft Mozilla Cookies Viewer or the OpenSource SQLite Database Browser:

http://sourceforge.net/projects/sqlitebrowser/

Or, one can use the default FireFox feature via:

Tools > Options > Privacy Icon > History Subsection > Show Cookies Button

(careful... no option to back up the cookies there !)

More likely any "imagery tile downloader profiling" that is being done by an imagery tile server is primarily based on one's IP address, so it is best to first simply try manually resetting the ISP assigned IP address issued and periodically changed by their DHCP server ...as described above; one can do this as often as desired as the end user in charge of ones TCP/IP connectivity under Windows. :engel016:

Its true, though, that imagery tile servers can intermittently STALL... GlobalMapper often has BIG "time-out" problems with the MS TerraServer servers.

However, any profiling by big imagery tile servers (most likely via IP address) is "quantity" based, rather than on an all or nothing basis, so only after a certain data transmission threshold is reached, do they start messing with an IP's download options.

Hope this helps better clarify the "new" status of the cookies file in Mozilla FireFox browser platform. :mixedsmi:

Happy Exterminating ! :rocket:

GaryGB

It's a toss up!

falcon409

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Marlin

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DB93

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GaryGB

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crashaz

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jdhaenens

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falcon409

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Dain Arns

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