Weapons Loadout Tutorial

[alpha_1]

Hi all. Because I'm currently experiencing some severe frustration with trying to change weapons for various aircraft in their dp files, I'd like to ask this question;

'Is there a tutorial available for dummy's like me so I can do this properly?'

Just tried with the Alpha Phantom and got less than stellar results. The file looks fine to me, but the plane cartwheels then blows up almost as soon as it loads. It could be that I had only changed the first loadout at that stage but not the rest. Having done this, I only loaded the first loadout for a test flight.

I'm sure there are things a guy needs to know about this and a tutorial might ease the frustration for some of us less gifted mortals when dealing with the problem of different weapons.

Another reason for this post is the AlphaSim modern weapons pak.......it does not work for me, period! I've tried downloading it from every available source with no luck. I get serious error messages every time when trying to load the plane with any weapons. These are NOT your standard 'missing' error messages, by the way.

Here's a sample: View attachment 19095

Any help with this issue would be greatly appreciated.

Cheers!

 

[erufle]

I am sure there are some that are downloadable but I can't think exactly where they are. What follows are a few tips I've saved:

Gunstation Definitions

[GUNSTATIONS]
gunstation.0= 0, 2, 1, 0.01, 870, 4, 0.01, 1000, 2, 40, 1d1*16, 0.55, 0.25, 2.2, 0.128056, 0, 0.1, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0.5

[GUNSTATIONS Defined]
gunstation.{A}0= {B}0, {C}2, {D}1, {E}0.01, {F}870, {G}4, {H}0.01, {I}1000, {J}2, {K}40, {L}1d1*16, {M}0.55, {N}0.25, {O}2.2, {P}0.128056, {Q}0, {R}0.1, {S}0, {T}0, {U}0, {V}0, {W}0.5

A. Gunstation number: (sequential) this will be the number to associate individual guns with (note that there is no particular weapon related to any particular gunstation number. Add as many as you want).

B. Trigger type: 0=Mach Gun 1=Cannon 2=Rocket 3=Bomb

C. System association (see last number for each entry in [SYSTEMS])

D. Gun type: 1=Mach gun 2=Cannon 4=Rocket 8=Bomb

E. Rate of fire (divide rounds/second into 1) Example: 50 rounds/sec = 1/50 = .02

F. Muzzle velocity: meters/sec (zero for Rockets & Bombs)

G. Round life (seconds round is tracked by simulation)

H. Muzzle flash: MS says flashes/sec. I disagree; I think this is actually 1/(flashes/sec). Typical values are .01 to .05

I. Range that AI aircraft begin firing (Meters)

J. Sound: 0= .303/7.62mm 2= .50 3= 13mm 4= 20mm 5= 30mm (set Bomb/Rocket to zero)

K. Tracer %

L. Damage dice: Typical values: 1d1*10 for .303, 1d1*14 for .50, 1d1*24 for 20mm, Rocket 1d1*300-3000, Bomb 1d1*600-6000 (this is the projectile's destructive power)

M. Gunstation X offset (Meters)

N. Gunstation Y offset (Meters)

O. Gunstation Z offset (Meters)

P. Pitch: angle of gunstation up/down (degrees) I suggest using similar angle values from other .dps in CFS. But if you must try calculating…

The acceleration affects of gravity on objects is independent of their weight. If you disregard the aerodynamic properties of the projectile and assume it falls at the same rate as any dropped object, then you can use -4.877t2 (It is the travel time of the projectile to its target) to determine how far the bullet drops in horizontal flight.

I would guess the average speed of the projectile is somewhere between its muzzle velocity and half that. I'm not going to add the plane's airspeed since the target is probably going just as fast. So let's take a target 1000 meters out, muzzle velocity of 870m/sec: t = 1000 / [(870 + 435) / 2] = 1.53 sec. This results in a drop of -4.877(1.532) = -11.42m. Now calculate an angle using tan ? = X/Z where X = X drop and Z = distance to target.

Keep in mind this is a very simplified approach and not the proper way to do ballistic calculations, however I doubt the MS simulation is much more complicated or accurate. Also, all this does you little good in the heat of battle when you're pulling hard on the stick in a 20 degree climb with 30 degrees of roll. That's what the tracers are for !

Q. Bank: angle of gunstation left/right (degrees) Again, I suggest using similar weapon/angle values from other .dps in CFS. If you really must calculate, remember: tan ? = X/Z where X = X offset and Z = distance to target.

R. Heading: heading of gunstation (degrees)(Example: A rear facing AI gunstation may have a heading of 180)

S. Constraint Angle left (max rotation angle for AI guns)

T. Constraint Angle right (max rotation angle for AI guns)

U. Constraint Angle up (max rotation angle for AI guns)

V. Constraint Angle down (max rotation angle for AI guns)

W. Round weight (oz)

Not sure if this helps. It's just kind of the quick and dirty on the subject and I'm not sure where it came from.

 

[alpha_1]

Wow!!

Hi Eru........Jeepers! Not sure what I expected but this is wayyyyyy ovah ma li'l head! Thanks for the input. I'm gonna copy and paste this for future reference.

:isadizzy:

 

[mariereid]

Alpha, I saw those messages when I installed ETO scenery and missions. I cannot remember what I did, but they disappeared.

 

[simonu]

theres more going on here than meets the eye,

Alpha, that error you are showing,

It looks like you have duplicate librarys; 2 files contain the same objects.

The plane jumping on the runway is because the plane is out of balance

The DP Gunstation defines weight of ammo among other things
aircraft dp s have the weight of shells
weps dps (bombs rockets etc (they are in /../OBJECTS_DP)) also have Gunstations that define weapon trigger and weight

All this ammo weight gets added to the fuel load and dryweight in the planename.air file and aircraft.cfg

Bare in mind here, that FS planes will be heavier, because some sort of ammo weight will already be added to the dry weight.

If the undercarrage can't take the weight or the CoG is disturbed all kinds of horrible things happen.

Where did you get your plane?
Are you adding a DP from a CFS2 plane to a plane built for FS?

 

[Stratobat]

Where did you get your plane?
Are you adding a DP from a CFS2 plane to a plane built for FS?

From the screenshot it looks like it's for the Alphasim A-4E Skyhawk?

I believe there were FS 2002 and CFS 2 versions.

Regards,
Stratobat

 

[Discus]

Alfa1

Have you read Caleb Flerk´s Tutorials?

http://www.cfgse.calebflerk.com/DP_File.htm

There you can find a bunch of tutorials about many of CFS2´s "dark" questions for dummies like myself.

Cheers, Discus

 

[simonu]

Ahhh Caleb Flerk, he set me on the path

 

[alpha_1]

Alpha Sim

Simonu, Stratobat guessed correctly.....these are CFS2 Alpha Sim, Tango Romeo reworks or just straight Alpha Sim planes. I thought it might be a problem with the Alpha Sim weapons. The planes load and fly fine empty, but when I try to add weapons, I get these messages.

Trying someone else's weapons does seem to upset the applecart somewhat. As for the cartwheeling, etc. I believe you're right. It's a CoG issue, each weapon type, (alpha, dBolt, etc.) must have different weights, thus throwing off the balance of the aircraft. SC7500 came up with a 'fix'.....lower the weight of the weapons to 10lbs.....

When you say file library, do you mean Objects_dp, Scenedb>weapons, or mdlnames.txt? or perhaps all of the above.

Funny thing with the Alpha weapons, I'm sure I installed them into a clean install, but I'll check, once I know what to look for. And by the way, this only happens with their modern weapons pack.....their other stuff works perfectly.

Discus, funny you should mention Caleb's stuff.....just downloaded it yesterday and haven't had time to take a look yet, thanks

Cheers

 

[simonu]

When I mentioned duplicate librarys I am talking very specificly about a type of scenery file that contains a library of objects, they can be weapons, trucks, buildings anything.

These objects must each have a unique name and a thing called a GUID which is a long number just like that you saw in your error.

The object names are the same as those of the DP files that tell CFS2 what the object is.

In fact it does not even matter that the scenery file is in the correct folder

you could put weapons in the veh folder or trucks in the inf folder CFS2 wont care because it is the DP that tells CFS2 what it is and as you know all the DPs are in OBJECTS_DP

As long as the DP file name and the object name are the same and they are unique.

Some Alpha planes do have weapons packs that contain weapons duplicated in the their modern weapons pack, they should be named slightly differently but I have problems just the same with one of their harriers, I havent got round to fixing it as the model is so old and dated I can't be bothered with it.

Weapons packs should contain a readme that details whats in them and how to apply them.

this especialy applies to pylons and rocket pods

there are a couple of utilities that can be used to look inside the files and see whats in them

When CFS2 reports it cant find an object and it uses the object name

it means that it has read the DP but cant find the model for the object with that name.

This may be because the DP is misnamed,
it maybe because the .bgl file that contains the model is not in an active scenery folder or more correctly "Has not been found in an active scenery folder"
(check that when the file unzipped the folder structure is sane)

.bgl goes in a scenery folder .bmp goes in a texture folder and both go into a folder that must be activated as a level in /settings/scenery library.

Don't get confused by the terminology it is not complicated

There is a caviat to this, when new scenery is installed to an existing active scenery folder;
as when you drag and drop the scenery and texture folders from a downloaded weapons pack to \scenedb\weapons folder you must get CFS2 to reload the entire scenery tree.
This is best done by simply restarting CFS2
but it can be done on the fly by going into the scenery folder in question and deleting the filelist.dat file and then making changes to /settings/ scenery library.

this all applies to errors were CFS2 names the object

when CFS2 can't find an object and quotes the object GUID then either the object name is duplicated or the object that is missing is being called from FS procedural scenery or GSL or combinations of.

Playing with dps is great fun, as you can add any thing you like as a payload.
a PBR river patrol boat slung under a huey
I once had a P51 armed with shed rockets!!! dont ask
You can learn all you need to know from careful study of the stock DPs
Many that have done this have posted what they gleened as you have seen
but having the info wont help you if you dont understand it.
To gain understanding you have to play about with it.
But don't frustrate yourself by rushing things
take your time and make sure you know how to undo any changes you make
The handiest tip I can any one is to use commenting when you edit a file
look

[GUNSTATIONS]
; Gunner (r) these here are comments
gunstation.0=0,55,1,0.08,839,2,0.01,500,2,40,1d1*14,1.2,0,0.08,20,0,90,-85,85,30,-60,1.6
; Gunner (l) so I don't have to remember which gunstation is which
gunstation.1=1,54,2,0.08,839,2,0.01,500,2,40,1d1*14,1.79,0,0.4,10,0,0,0,170,30,-60,1.6

[guns.0]
gun.0=2000,-0.39,-0.02,0,0,0,1,1000

[guns.1]
gun.0=2000,-0.71,0,0.17,0,0,1,1500

any text coming after a semicolon ; is ignored by CFS2 so you can leave comments where ever you change something to remind yourself what you did

you can use comments to disable items in payloads without deleting them

[PAYLOAD.0]
; Payload = Guns Only
mount.3=hc_gunner, 1, -1

[PAYLOAD.1]
; Payload = copilot
mount.1=hc_pilot, 1, -1

[PAYLOAD.2]
; Payload = copilot gunner
mount.1=hc_pilot, 1, -1
;mount.3=hc_gunner, 1, -1 <<<here I disabled the gunner in my huey payload
mount.4=PBR,1,-1

 

[alpha_1]

More to this.....

than meets the eye, Simonu. I will follow your advice and start to do some serious 'playing around' with some dp files. The Alpha Phantom was my first attempt in a long time. I once changed a P39 drop tank setup 'semi' successfully' but that was a long time ago.....time to get ma li'l feet wet again.

Thanks so much for this. This will help me a lot. Another cut and paste to my 'documents' file for CFS2.

Cheers!

 

[alpha_1]

Accidental Tutorial from Jagdfleiger

Hi all. My alpha modern weapons problems have been solved, thanks to another current thread on the Alpha Typhoon weapons.

I've added Jag's comments here:

The weapons_01_FREE.bgl file in the Alphasim free weapons pack will negate the individual weapons that come with each of the Alphasim airplanes. It is a headache of major proportions if you try and use the Free Weapons pack in conjunction with the weapons or the DPs from the individual planes packs which looks to be the case here. The two different weapons.bgl files seem to compete with each other and thus negate each other. Your DP file may also need some modification when using the Free pack and expecting the weapons to show up due to a tilde (~) being used in the title of some of them.

The solution for me has been to delete the weapons_01_FREE.bgl file from the Scendb > Weapons > Scenery folder and then use the weapons_XXX.bgl file that came with each plane's weapons pack as well as the original DP (un-modified) file.

Example: Scendb > Weapons > Scenery > weapons_01_FREE.bgl << Delete

This may be the easiest solution for you at this point.

OR

When using the weapons_01_FREE.bgl delete the individual weapons_xxx.bgl file from the individual weapons packs that came with each of the old Alphasim airplanes and then use the Alphasim free weapons pack weapons and update the DP file to reflect the titles of the free weapons if necessary.

Example: Scenedb > Weapons > Scenery > Weapons_typhoon.bgl << Delete

------------------------------------------------------------

Here is the readme file from the Alphasim Free weapons pack:

Listed below are the weapons included in the attached BGL, simply apply the name into the
planes DP and the weapon will be present, note that some weapons are named ~xxxx, you must include the ~ prefix. Example the first weapon simply requires the DP text of ~500LB_Bomb, another example : ~250LB_Bomb etc do not include ( " .sca " ).

Weapons prefixed with ~ have there center point placed where the weapon shackle
or mounting point would be, you only need to specifiy that same point in the DP and
all weapons marked ~ will align correctly with that pylon.

Weapons not marked with ~ have their center point at the weapons center and will need
individual mounting points in the plane DP for each location and weapon.

It is advised you do not mix ~ weapons with non ~ weapons. Weapons with the ~ prefix
allow greater flexability of weapons with in the current limits of DP mounts in CFS2

Final point, these weapons are freeware however if posted or used elsewhere please ensure
proper credit is given to all parties.

Apart from all that..enjoy

Michael Davies
Alphasimulations

Simonu, you nailed it, I just didn't know what to look for. All of you guys are freakin' awesome!! The time spent with us tyros is not always wasted and I for one am very thankful for everybody's input on this.....I learned a heck of a lot today, gentlemen!

Cheers! I salute you!:salute: