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G3M Nell range...

D

dasuto247

Members +
Building a mission for a IJN bomber campaign.Already released the Genzan Air Group attacked on Prince of Wales/Repulse.Now working on the night raid on Singapore on December 8 1941.Everything is great but one issue is range of the Nell. I feel like just not getting the range from a plane that had plenty of that.Without a checklist did some testing.Found flying at 14,000 feet, lean mixture, 38-40 percent throttle, props at 25 percent, could keep IAS of 119 knts, pretty good range but just not what expecting.Faster more powerr, less rang, lower speed and settings, can barely stay airborne, even AP for cruise goes haywire. Anyone have much time on this plane(Wolfi's G$M) any tricks? The haul to Singapore and back is a long one.Also, noticed if switch the fuel selector to a wing tank, when switch back the tank goes to zero, from 99 percent to zero.Bug? how to fix it?
 
Reply...

Dasuto247,

This is where you have to do some research. You need to find out how much total fuel the aircraft could hold, and in how many tanks, and then once you have the information, you have to go into the air file and make the adjustments to correspond with the historical data.

Wolfi is usually pretty good with regard to using the correct engine data, but in this case, taking a cursory look at the air file, the cylinder number data, individual cylinder displacement, compression ratio, engine horsepower, and max RPM are not correct.

You also need to check the aircraft's dry weight against the historical specs.

All of these have an impact on performance, but the golden rule in mission builder if you are going to warp is that the faster you set the speed, the more fuel you burn.
 
Reply...

Dasuto247,

Try this...I corrected most of the engine data, fuel capacity, and the aircraft's weight. She was almost 6,000lbs too heavy.

There are only two fuel tanks, left and right.
 
Rami said:
Dasuto247,

Try this...I corrected most of the engine data, fuel capacity, and the aircraft's weight. She was almost 6,000lbs too heavy.

There are only two fuel tanks, left and right.
Click to expand...


Thanks.I am just learning about using aired on the airfiles, having been tinkering.The TBF's range is one am working on currently or attempting to . Thanks for tinkering with the G3M, I will give it a try later on and let you know the results.
 
Rami said:
Dasuto247,

Try this...I corrected most of the engine data, fuel capacity, and the aircraft's weight. She was almost 6,000lbs too heavy.

There are only two fuel tanks, left and right.
Click to expand...


Would you happen to know anything about the bombsight? How it is supposed to work? hit F9 just brings up the bomb sight and the panel, no view of the ground.
 
If you really want to know...

dasuto247 said:
That would be appreciated Blood Hawk.Forgive my ignorance, workbook?
Click to expand...

I won't overload you but if you want to take a look then go here...

http://www.mudpond.org/

Flight Dynamics workbook...
http://www.mudpond.org/FlightDynamicsWorkbook.zip

Airupdate...
http://www.mudpond.org/AirUpdatePage.html

Airwrench...
http://www.mudpond.org/AirWrench_main.htm

Airwrench is another tool that you can use to see the results of your changes in AirEd. Its not a be all - end all. Thought it does help when your trying to push the limit of CFS2.

By using the workbook and the airupdate you can change other aspects of the airfile a little quicker than with just AirEd. Although you can do it with just Aired.

I will say that its not for the faint of heart. You may also want to brush up on some aeronautical engineering terms. Maybe keep a bottle of Tylenol near by. Possibly a second computer. 'cuz you might "accidentally" throw your key board through the monitor.

I have two other programs that work in the same manor as Aired and Airwrench. If you want to dive in that deep I can pass them along.
 
I have found a ton of info for the G3M2. From what I have, I should be able to give you a fairly accurate airfile, as far as engine performance goes. As long as all of the rest of the data is correct.

I'm still not finding much on the supercharger boost pressures. I did find the prop pitch and dia. As well as a few other bits.

I'll get started and let you know how it goes.
 
Reply...

Blood_Hawk23,

I try to refrain from using the Air Wrench tool, because it adds a lot of FS9 junk to the airfile and especially the aircraft.cfg file. I'm pretty sure I got the Nell close by adjusting the parameters in AirEd. It's critical to get the engine data and weight correct, which I'm confident it is. The only info I couldn't find was the maximum manifold pressure.
 
Rami said:
Blood_Hawk23,

I try to refrain from using the Air Wrench tool, because it adds a lot of FS9 junk to the airfile and especially the aircraft.cfg file. I'm pretty sure I got the Nell close by adjusting the parameters in AirEd. It's critical to get the engine data and weight correct, which I'm confident it is. The only info I couldn't find was the maximum manifold pressure.
Click to expand...

I only have the free version. I just use it to see the changes.
 
Rami said:
Blood_Hawk23,

I try to refrain from using the Air Wrench tool, because it adds a lot of FS9 junk to the airfile and especially the aircraft.cfg file. I'm pretty sure I got the Nell close by adjusting the parameters in AirEd. It's critical to get the engine data and weight correct, which I'm confident it is. The only info I couldn't find was the maximum manifold pressure.
Click to expand...

Maximum manifold pressure was 44.0000. I was able to find a site with the engine specs of Mitsubishi engines at that time.
 
Don't forget the warp fuel bug that effects all twin or more engine aircrafts. You will be lucky to get half of the listed range for twin or more engine aircraft if you use warp. The best you can do is use unlim fuel OR double the fuel load for all tanks and edit 312 Fuel Weight per Gallon to be half weight from 6 to 3.

This will make aircraft have the right fueled weight and you should be able to get close to the right range using warp.
 
Allen said:
Don't forget the warp fuel bug that effects all twin or more engine aircrafts. You will be lucky to get half of the listed range for twin or more engine aircraft if you use warp. The best you can do is use unlim fuel OR double the fuel load for all tanks and edit 312 Fuel Weight per Gallon to be half weight from 6 to 3.

This will make aircraft have the right fueled weight and you should be able to get close to the right range using warp.
Click to expand...

Thanks for the help. I flew some with your new airfile, did get better fuel economy.Thing is I am thinking a lower IAS than 119 knts is needed but not sure how much lower should go, esp for a bomber.Cruising speed was 151 knots, range of 2,376 miles.Doubt I could get that at 151 knots.Then again is cruising speed the best for fuel economy? I did remember the the warp bug.My missions are meant to be flown in real time but include warp for those who do not have time to fly even with time compression.Will include the warning in the readme.Thanks for the new airfile. Has anyone published checklists for the planes that do not include them? They often serve as a good starting point.

Know anything about the OH Avenger's fuel situation? Also, in the nell(occurs in the Helldiver by wolfi as well) when switch the fuel selector from main(in Nells case, its for both tanks) to a wing tank, and switch it back, the fuel goes to zero and engine cuts of, will only work on wing tanks from then on.Bug or am I misunderstanding something?
 
dasuto247 said:
Thanks for the help. I flew some with your new airfile, did get better fuel economy.Thing is I am thinking a lower IAS than 119 knts is needed but not sure how much lower should go, esp for a bomber.Cruising speed was 151 knots, range of 2,376 miles.Doubt I could get that at 151 knots.Then again is cruising speed the best for fuel economy? I did remember the the warp bug.My missions are meant to be flown in real time but include warp for those who do not have time to fly even with time compression.Will include the warning in the readme.Thanks for the new airfile. Has anyone published checklists for the planes that do not include them? They often serve as a good starting point.

Know anything about the OH Avenger's fuel situation? Also, in the nell(occurs in the Helldiver by wolfi as well) when switch the fuel selector from main(in Nells case, its for both tanks) to a wing tank, and switch it back, the fuel goes to zero and engine cuts of, will only work on wing tanks from then on.Bug or am I misunderstanding something?
Click to expand...

Landing Speed for the Nell is 70 knts. Take off speed is 76 knts. Cruise speed is 151 knts at around 12,000 - 14,000 feet.

It has a 10ft constant speed prop with a pitch of 19-39 degs. Early G3M1's had a fixed pitch prop.
All of the charts for the prop have to be changed. I'm still working on that.

Engine performance
Maximum cruise — 600-650 hp. — 2,000 rpm.
Rated — 850 hp. — 2,250 rpm. to 8,000 ft.
Military rated & Takeoff — 1,050-1,075 hp. — 2,500
rpm. to 5,500 ft
 
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