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The Staff of SOH
Aeroplane Heaven / Just Flight Spitfire is out
- Thread starter dhasdell
- Start date
The promo video was made before the development was complete. The undercarriage electrical indicators do work as they should - extinguish when the gear is in transit and light when the gear is locked.
That is not what I meant. I mean the red pins visible on the upper wing surfaces. They need to disappear into the wing when the undercarriage comes up. I see from one of the screenshots that the pins are now down in flight ...
A
Andrew Entwistle
bazzar
Charter Member 2018
It is the same reason. As I said, the video was produced before the production was complete. If you really want the reason (although do you hear anybody talking about why the landing gear pins stay up?) is that the gear process in the pump operated gear is special code. The video recording process used by the guy that did the video does not appear to record this correctly. So a "g" key arrangement was provided to allow him to raise and lower the gear for certain shots. I hope that explains it for you.
Fireball6
Charter Member
Hi Bazzar, just want to let you know that i have the "problem" with the red pins - as you can see on the attached pics, on the models with mirror mounted, the pin is showing when gear is up and on the models without the mirror they are not showing while gear is down.
I re-installed it twice and checked it a few times - with the same result. It seems that this happend only to the MK1A-Model.
Kind regards and many thanks for this fine Spit
Dirk
I re-installed it twice and checked it a few times - with the same result. It seems that this happend only to the MK1A-Model.
Kind regards and many thanks for this fine Spit
Dirk
Attachments
bazzar
Charter Member 2018
Hi Dirk and thankyou for the HU. I think I know what this is now. Can you tell me if it is there if you use the VC lever or just when using the "G" key?
I believe we can get better integration between the gear code and keystrokes so will be issuing a new model in a small SP soon. I also have a better sound for the gear pump. More anon.
I believe we can get better integration between the gear code and keystrokes so will be issuing a new model in a small SP soon. I also have a better sound for the gear pump. More anon.
Bradburger
Charter Member
Well, I picked up the new AH Spit last night, and using just over 8 quids worth of JF points that I had left, I got it for about half price!
In terms of the 3d Modelling, this is by far the best Spitfire AH have ever done, with some lovely textures, and as some very nice features also.
Good work chaps!
However, I have noticed a few 'squawks' as regards the 3d model.
1. The detail on the aileron textures depict the later metal skinned type, and not the fabric covered ones, as would have been fitted to the aircraft modeled, and all Spitfires up until early/mid 1941 when the metal ones where introduced.
(https://photos.app.goo.gl/4Plir9vYJY3P3xFH2)
2. The flare chute on the starboard rear fuselage is incorrectly depicted. This wasn't introduced until later marks. (The MK.I/II had a downward firing one fitted behind the pilot, aft of frame 11).
3. There are some problems/anomalies with the textures on the elevator horn balance, in that some metal texturing is represented on it that should actually be fabric, as per the elevator. There also appears to be some evidence of the incorrect extended horn balance textures still present on some textures as well.
4. The cockpit air vent opens the wrong way. That is to say that the outside vent flap should open facing the oncoming slipstream to let fresh air in, and not towards the tail as it does at the moment.
5. There is an extra metal patch at the rear of the cockpit rail on both sides of the fuselage that shouldn't be there.
6. The hydraulic tank (as fitted to the earlier hand pump undercarriage models) which was fitted behind the pilot, aft of frame 11, is not modelled - see this thread when I mentioned and discussed it with you : -
http://www.sim-outhouse.com/sohforums/showthread.php/107943-Dunkirk-Spitfire-WIP-update
7. Is there any chance of removing the prop pitch engine off animation? The pitch of the blades would of course only move once the engine had started, and oil pressure was established.
Here's a link to some screenshots I took in MDL converter showing these issues for your reference: -
https://photos.app.goo.gl/1FN8hPdBnIvHUia73
And for reference/comparison to the above issues, below are some pictures from David Whitworth's Flickr album of N3200 at Duxford: -
Elevators 1 - https://www.flickr.com/photos/dwhitworth/13605359445/in/album-72157642955945255/
Stb Elevator - https://www.flickr.com/photos/dwhitworth/13625689733/in/album-72157642955945255/
Air Vent Open - https://www.flickr.com/photos/dwhitworth/14672747597/in/album-72157642955945255/
Port Fuselage Cockpit Section w/canopy rail - https://www.flickr.com/photos/dwhitworth/13876168785/in/album-72157642955945255/
Stb Fuselage Cockpit Section w/canopy rail - https://www.flickr.com/photos/dwhitworth/13625655063/in/album-72157642955945255/
Cheers
Paul
In terms of the 3d Modelling, this is by far the best Spitfire AH have ever done, with some lovely textures, and as some very nice features also.
Good work chaps!
However, I have noticed a few 'squawks' as regards the 3d model.
1. The detail on the aileron textures depict the later metal skinned type, and not the fabric covered ones, as would have been fitted to the aircraft modeled, and all Spitfires up until early/mid 1941 when the metal ones where introduced.
(https://photos.app.goo.gl/4Plir9vYJY3P3xFH2)
2. The flare chute on the starboard rear fuselage is incorrectly depicted. This wasn't introduced until later marks. (The MK.I/II had a downward firing one fitted behind the pilot, aft of frame 11).
3. There are some problems/anomalies with the textures on the elevator horn balance, in that some metal texturing is represented on it that should actually be fabric, as per the elevator. There also appears to be some evidence of the incorrect extended horn balance textures still present on some textures as well.
4. The cockpit air vent opens the wrong way. That is to say that the outside vent flap should open facing the oncoming slipstream to let fresh air in, and not towards the tail as it does at the moment.
5. There is an extra metal patch at the rear of the cockpit rail on both sides of the fuselage that shouldn't be there.
6. The hydraulic tank (as fitted to the earlier hand pump undercarriage models) which was fitted behind the pilot, aft of frame 11, is not modelled - see this thread when I mentioned and discussed it with you : -
http://www.sim-outhouse.com/sohforums/showthread.php/107943-Dunkirk-Spitfire-WIP-update
7. Is there any chance of removing the prop pitch engine off animation? The pitch of the blades would of course only move once the engine had started, and oil pressure was established.
Here's a link to some screenshots I took in MDL converter showing these issues for your reference: -
https://photos.app.goo.gl/1FN8hPdBnIvHUia73
And for reference/comparison to the above issues, below are some pictures from David Whitworth's Flickr album of N3200 at Duxford: -
Elevators 1 - https://www.flickr.com/photos/dwhitworth/13605359445/in/album-72157642955945255/
Stb Elevator - https://www.flickr.com/photos/dwhitworth/13625689733/in/album-72157642955945255/
Air Vent Open - https://www.flickr.com/photos/dwhitworth/14672747597/in/album-72157642955945255/
Port Fuselage Cockpit Section w/canopy rail - https://www.flickr.com/photos/dwhitworth/13876168785/in/album-72157642955945255/
Stb Fuselage Cockpit Section w/canopy rail - https://www.flickr.com/photos/dwhitworth/13625655063/in/album-72157642955945255/
Cheers
Paul
Bradburger
Charter Member
Apologies Baz.
Yes, it would be better to use the official support channels, but I get so used to you and other developers being on here, it seems natural!
(I'll send the above via JF support).
To clarify, the hydraulic tank is actually the silver 'box' with the filler cap that is mounted approximately halfway on the starboard side of the fuselage behind the pilot's seat frame, as in the picture I took of it on P9374 that you show, part of a batch I linked in your announcement thread.
The black circular item is actually a different type of voltage regulator that was fitted to the pilot's seat frame behind the headrest on the early Spitfire MK.Is, as per P9374 & N3200, X4650 etc (i.e. all MK.Is produced up until the end of 1940).
(Reading again one of your replies in the thread that I mentioned the early hydraulic tank in, I now see were the confusion with the voltage regulator came from!)
Here is an example of one of the early voltage regulators, posted several years ago by someone involved with one of the MK.I restorations: -
https://forum.keypublishing.com/showthread.php?103220-Spitfire-early-voltage-regulator-12V-5C-984
Cheers
Paul
Yes, it would be better to use the official support channels, but I get so used to you and other developers being on here, it seems natural!
(I'll send the above via JF support).
To clarify, the hydraulic tank is actually the silver 'box' with the filler cap that is mounted approximately halfway on the starboard side of the fuselage behind the pilot's seat frame, as in the picture I took of it on P9374 that you show, part of a batch I linked in your announcement thread.
The black circular item is actually a different type of voltage regulator that was fitted to the pilot's seat frame behind the headrest on the early Spitfire MK.Is, as per P9374 & N3200, X4650 etc (i.e. all MK.Is produced up until the end of 1940).
(Reading again one of your replies in the thread that I mentioned the early hydraulic tank in, I now see were the confusion with the voltage regulator came from!)
Here is an example of one of the early voltage regulators, posted several years ago by someone involved with one of the MK.I restorations: -
https://forum.keypublishing.com/showthread.php?103220-Spitfire-early-voltage-regulator-12V-5C-984
Cheers
Paul
bazzar
Charter Member 2018
As usual we will be releasing updates for these models and I will incorporate what I can. The "tank" issue is a classic example of confusing components. You will find a voltage regulator mounted low down behind the pilot seat. I've obviously got that mixed up. I will remove it and add the silver box tank to the SP build. Thanks Paul.
heywooood
Mayor Emeritus of Taco City
models of the most pivotal Warbirds draw such intense scrutiny and criticism from the community, and probably no other more than the MkI Spitfire - It's a wonder they are taken on as projects at all.
I'm not saying the fans of these planes of fame should do any less - a job worth doing is worth doing well..and a paying customer has the right to expect quality commensurate with the price tag.
But I am saying that it takes courage for a developer to take them on at all, knowing that they can expect reams of lets call it encouragement to get it 'right'
Also that it keeps happening despite every plea from every developer to use the proper method of reporting that those laundry lists of encouragements end up here..lol
Thank you to Aeroplane Heaven for taking them on - The little Spit is very welcome here in my hangar and I know you will support it (bearing in mind it did not cost me $60 to purchase it)
I'm not saying the fans of these planes of fame should do any less - a job worth doing is worth doing well..and a paying customer has the right to expect quality commensurate with the price tag.
But I am saying that it takes courage for a developer to take them on at all, knowing that they can expect reams of lets call it encouragement to get it 'right'
Also that it keeps happening despite every plea from every developer to use the proper method of reporting that those laundry lists of encouragements end up here..lol
Thank you to Aeroplane Heaven for taking them on - The little Spit is very welcome here in my hangar and I know you will support it (bearing in mind it did not cost me $60 to purchase it)
Bradburger
Charter Member
Bazzar,
Looking back at that thread I should have course picked up on the confusion!
(I failed to mention it was silver and box shaped).
heywood is right in that these classics do indeed draw a level of attention quite possibly not seen with other types.
And it's interesting that it mirrors to an extent what today's owners and restorers of these classics are doing! (That is, trying everything down to minutest of details as correct and accurate as possible).
As a side note, all four of the MK.I Spitfires that have been rebuilt or ground up restored over the past few years, have had no expense spared by the restorers and owners trying to get things exactly right for the time period that their example was built/in service. Many of the Spitfire specialist companies that restore or were involved in them found that doing both P9374 & N3200 was something of challenge, purely because there wasn't so much in the way of documentation or other complete examples to study and were heavily into reverse engineering and building a lot more things from scratch compared to later marks of Spitfire.
For them, it was something of a learning curve!
So my hats off to Aeroplane Heaven for having a crack at the early MK.Is.
They have done a wonderful job so far, and correcting some of the smaller details will make it even better!
Cheers
Paul
Looking back at that thread I should have course picked up on the confusion!
(I failed to mention it was silver and box shaped).
heywood is right in that these classics do indeed draw a level of attention quite possibly not seen with other types.
And it's interesting that it mirrors to an extent what today's owners and restorers of these classics are doing! (That is, trying everything down to minutest of details as correct and accurate as possible).
As a side note, all four of the MK.I Spitfires that have been rebuilt or ground up restored over the past few years, have had no expense spared by the restorers and owners trying to get things exactly right for the time period that their example was built/in service. Many of the Spitfire specialist companies that restore or were involved in them found that doing both P9374 & N3200 was something of challenge, purely because there wasn't so much in the way of documentation or other complete examples to study and were heavily into reverse engineering and building a lot more things from scratch compared to later marks of Spitfire.
For them, it was something of a learning curve!
So my hats off to Aeroplane Heaven for having a crack at the early MK.Is.
They have done a wonderful job so far, and correcting some of the smaller details will make it even better!
Cheers
Paul
Fireball6
Charter Member
Hi Bazzar,
it happend both ways - by using the "G"-Key and also by using the gearlever in the VC. From inside the pit you see the pins work like they should - went down, but in the outside-view they persist.
Sorry for being late in answering, real life took time today
Dirk
WarHorse47
SOH-CM-2024
I can confirm Dirk's observation. I just flew the 1A model. After takeoff and using the VC lever, the red pins still show after the gear is retracted. The pins are not visible from the VC, but from all external views only.
Only other thing I noted is that the atc_id for the early model doesn't match the aircraft (from atc_id=6777 to atc_id=X9787). Not sure if that was intentional.
And, last but not least, I noticed that the text for the cover on the starter button for the 1A was inverted.
Thanks for the great aircraft.
