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An old project brought up to date: Canso PBY-5 of SAGQ

For Cazzie, I put Blender "in the box" for the afternoon and try to use "The Gimp" to see what I can do for him:

1761933497615.png

1761933821410.png

Colors will still need to be adapted a little and the yellow band highlighted in black at the end of the fuselage must be shifted, but the idea is there and the result quite interesting because I was only able to find very few photos on the Net.
Insignia are not the most difficult to achieve.

All is backup in PSD format (PhotoShop) and under 16bit for a better resolution. Each PSD file occupies 150 Mo so it's un little longer to work ...
 
Hello everyone,

Thanks for your video, Tom. Precisely, it was this video which help me to create the PBY "Air France" interior.

With Hollister56 and Riger1962, we have been testing the latest modifications for nearly 15 days and I will make a brief summary so that we can share our information.
Moreover, I think that publishing here the test reports rather than exchanging messages would be more profitable.

Currently, the version v0.9.2 is the stable version that satisfies both simulators and meets all startup scenarios. It’s the version on my site.
In small committee we tested a v0.9.3 which contains some improvements proposed by Tiger1962 such as:
- a modification of certain parameters in the aircraft.cfg to improve the choice of variations in MSFS 2024
- adding an other panel.cfg in order to use Working Tittle GPS in lace of Asobo instruments (the user can choice what he want to use)
- two parameters revised in the flight model to help with starting on water in poor weather conditions (wind and swell)
- a parameter has been modicated to avoid some crash when the user take of from water
- modifications on the FLT files (having the floats in the lower position when starting on water, a grouping of certain electrical circuits, etc.)
- a reuse of the parameters of the B-24 regarding the base auto pilot (some parameters are too aggressive and will need to be revised so that the transistions are more smoothed)
- corrections on the 3D models (UVs)
- adding a repaint OA-10a for Cazzie (there are some slight details left like the registration on the rudder)
- the addition of vibrations on flight controls and various needles by additional calculation on the variables used for the animations.

At this stage:
- under FS20 the PBYs behave as on v0.9.2, no problem detected. (y)
- under FS24, the PBYs refuse to start their engines in Cold & Dark but work perfectly when the chosen starting situation has already started the engines (on the runway or in cruise flight) :(

After study, I think perhaps there must be a parameter in the FLTs that have been modified that should cause an issue with FS24.
I am therefore reinstalling v0.9.2 to apply the listed patches one by one and check each time if the problem occurs under FS24.
It might take a little time :cool: .

PS:
Some of you may have noticed that machine guns are no longer displayed from a certain distance. In fact, since they have a lot of polygons despite the cleaning I was able to do, to minimize the impact on the FPS, I moved them into the LOD01 but it intervenes very quickly. No doubt I will need to modify the display parameters of the two interior LODs.
 
Last edited:
lagaffe said:
Hello everyone,

Thanks for your video, Tom. Precisely, it was this video which help me to create the PBY "Air France" interior.

With Hollister56 and Riger1962, we have been testing the latest modifications for nearly 15 days and I will make a brief summary so that we can share our information.
Moreover, I think that publishing here the test reports rather than exchanging messages would be more profitable.

Currently, the version v0.9.2 is the stable version that satisfies both simulators and meets all startup scenarios. It’s the version on my site.
In small committee we tested a v0.9.3 which contains some improvements proposed by Tiger1962 such as:
- a modification of certain parameters in the aircraft.cfg to improve the choice of variations in MSFS 2024
- adding an other panel.cfg in order to use Working Tittle GPS in lace of Asobo instruments (the user can choice what he want to use)
- two parameters revised in the flight model to help with starting on water in poor weather conditions (wind and swell)
- a parameter has been modicated to avoid some crash when the user take of from water
- modifications on the FLT files (having the floats in the lower position when starting on water, a grouping of certain electrical circuits, etc.)
- a reuse of the parameters of the B-24 regarding the base auto pilot (some parameters are too aggressive and will need to be revised so that the transistions are more smoothed)
- corrections on the 3D models (UVs)
- adding a repaint OA-10a for Cazzie (there are some slight details left like the registration on the rudder)
- the addition of vibrations on flight controls and various needles by additional calculation on the variables used for the animations.

At this stage:
- under FS20 the PBYs behave as on v0.9.2, no problem detected. (y)
- under FS24, the PBYs refuse to start their engines in Cold & Dark but work perfectly when the chosen starting situation has already started the engines (on the runway or in cruise flight) :(

After study, I think perhaps there must be a parameter in the FLTs that have been modified that should cause an issue with FS24.
I am therefore reinstalling v0.9.2 to apply the listed patches one by one and check each time if the problem occurs under FS24.
It might take a little time :cool: .

PS:
Some of you may have noticed that machine guns are no longer displayed from a certain distance. In fact, since they have a lot of polygons despite the cleaning I was able to do, to minimize the impact on the FPS, I moved them into the LOD01 but it intervenes very quickly. No doubt I will need to modify the display parameters of the two interior LODs.
Click to expand...
This sounds amazing, I’m keen to take it for a test flight soon!

Incidentally would you mind sharing your method for adding vibrations to flight controls and needles please? I’d like to add this to the B24 in a future update since it adds a great deal of immersion in my opinion - but not sure where to start with implementing it.
 
My method is not revolutionary. It has already been used on addons in the time of FS2004 and FSX. At that time there were several addons that had been published on AVSim or FlightSim regarding the terms of "damage mod" and "realistic engine" ;) (google is your friend).

This consists of starting from random values and sinusoidal functions to calculate one or more local variables that will "oscillate" between two precise values: +value and -value.
By precisely choosing the calculation parameters, one obtains a value that corresponds to what one seeks to obtain.
For example, for a needle that varies between 0 and 2700 RPMS, a value of + or - 20 RPMs is required. after we can also choose a pass-all value and in the final calculations, correct with an adequate scale.

Finally, all that remains is to modify in the ModelBehavior the variable used to animate the needle to add its corrective factor applied to the calculated local variable.
If the local variable is calculated at a suitable period (not too large to avoid overloading the FS rendering engine) we obtain not a linear animation but a linear animation marred by "jolts" (sorry, I am not sure if this term is correct).

<Macro Name="MecanicVibration">
(A:GENERAL ENG PCT MAX RPM:1, Percent over 100) sp0
l0 0 &gt;
if{
(E:SIMULATION TIME, seconds) rand + s1 1.75 * cos
l1 rand + 3 * cos 2.2 * cos *
0.05 *
1 l0 0.3 - 0 max 0.7 / - *
sp0
}
els{
0 sp0
}
l0 +
</Macro>
Click to expand...

<Component ID="INSTRUMENTS_AIRSPEED">
<Component ID="ias_needle_l_id" Node="axis_ias_needle_l">
<UseTemplate Name="ASOBO_GT_Anim_Code">
<ANIM_NAME>needle_airspeed</ANIM_NAME>
<ANIM_CODE>(A:AIRSPEED INDICATED, knots) @MecanicVibration 1.25 * +</ANIM_CODE>
<ANIM_LENGTH>250</ANIM_LENGTH>
<ANIM_LAG>250</ANIM_LAG>
</UseTemplate>
</Component>
Click to expand...

After that, it is also necessary to look a little, study the planes that have this kind of functions, read the code and make one’s own. You can also read many posts published on FSdevloper.com ... a very good site where a lot of information can be find :encouragement:

When in 2021, I added a cat in my Menestrel HN-433, it didn’t take long for Gotfriends to publish an addon in the same genre. In 2013, I studied the Damage mod by Ismael Guzi and after many modifications I adapted it to the Cessna 150 that I published in 2013 for FSX/P3D on the bases of the Cessna 150 by Fravin for FS2004.
Last year this Damage Mod was revised and adapted to FS20 and it was used in the Stearman IB75A from GAS.

In the end, I know very well that once the PBY is published, there will be curious people who will read the code and will be inspired by it ... unless I decide to encrypt my files to stay a little ahead of the competition with my ideas. :cool:
 
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lagaffe said:
After study, I think perhaps there must be a parameter in the FLTs that have been modified that should cause an issue with FS24.
Click to expand...
I think I've found the problem - there's no apron.FLT file. I've created one from the existing hangar.FLT file (attached below) and we now have ignition:
 

Attachments

  • apron.zip
    1.3 KB · Views: 2
After several hours testing the two versions under the same conditions, I found several errors in the code:
- the management of the primer : it always displayed UNDERPRIMED => now it's OK
- the float up/down code : the wheels rise up when asked to raise the floats => solution find (see PS: b))
These are not exactly the ones I was looking for but it’s still a step forward.

On FS24, by starting in the ramp, I never succeed with the new version to start engines in Cold & Dark situations.
Only the old version allowed me to start in Cold & Dark and also in CTRL+E.

On the other hand, in this situation it is enough to change the PBY model and then engine begin to starts (sic)
When we ask to start the flight on the runway, engine are ON it goes correctly in any of the situations.

There must be a parameter that has been forgotten but which is automatically loaded when changing the plane.

Indeed, Tim, the apron.FLT was missing from all versions: I open the v0.7.7 and it was already missing.
I will add it in the test version and check again.

PS:
a) Why FS20 accept to run without a apron.FLT and FS24 no ? Nothing about this has been writed in the ChangeLog !

b) floats up/down:
The last SDK propose a GEAR POSITION:12/13 which are "auxiliary gears". I have try to use dummy gears just under the floats to force FS to add an effect when they are lowered.
; /Extrem Wing Floats : Aux Gears which should be raises or lowers using LVAR (>A:GEAR POSITION:12, enum)
; 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16
point.12 = 3, -1, -45.3, 1.27, 1500, 0, 0, 0, 0.5, 2.5, 0.7, 12, 11, 5, 0, 0, 1
point.13 = 3, -1, 45.3, 1.27, 1500, 0, 0, 0, 0.5, 2.5, 0.7, 14, 11, 5, 0, 0, 1
Click to expand...
That I don't think was that FS send a "raise command" to ALL gears when theses dummy gears was raised.

[EDIT] The error is mine: in fact iI had declared theses points as "3" i.e. skids and not as "4" i.e. floats. :(
At least by trying to correct a given point, 3 others were found and corrected. :encouragement:
 
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After several tests carried out with this file, the PBY starts well under FS24 as soon as the aircraft is loaded (after SHIFT+C) with the CTRL+E sequence.
On the other hand, manual startup in Cold & Dark does not work.
As much as I thank Tim for finding this missing file, I am not convinced that it was the reason for the malfunction of the CTRL+E.

If you reread the posts above, we see that on version v0.9.2 without the apron.FLT file, the CTRL+E command worked perfectly, so why was the behavior of v0.9.3 different?

I worked for 40 years in the field of Real Time Software (French Military Navy). In this category of software, there are two kinds of software: Hard and Soft.
- a Real Time Hard software is a software that reacts within 1 to 10 micro seconds with very powerful and adapted hardware.
- a Soft Real-Time software is a software that reacts within 10 to 100 milli seconds with much less efficient hardware: such as a high-end PC.

Aircraft simulation software can be considered as a Soft Real Time software, nevertheless for following an input/output (joystick) the aircraft seems to react correctly (display) there is a large number of calculations that are done within tight deadlines.

Current processors are multi-core and multi-thread CPUs. All the different tasks (acquisition of inputs, outputs, internal calculations, gauge calculations, aerodynamic calculations, display calculation, etc.) are carried out by numerous threads in parallel.
Schematically, we have a "castle of cards" whose balance is very precarious and the addition of extra cards can cause the whole to fall.
If we add additional calculations or modify the timing allocated to the different basic tasks, we disrupt the balance of the simulator !

Therefore, in order to arrive at the fact that the main change between these two versions apart from the absence of the apron.FLT file was the addition of the vibrations and the calculations necessary to calculate them.
In FSX it was already possible to define xml gauges (true or fake) to perform additional calculations and define the call period of these calculations (a multiple of 18hz). In MSFS we have a model behavior that allows the same type of thing. I use this function for numerous computatios.
By adding these calculations, we "add multiple cards" to the previous castle and the choice of calculation periods is very important because it can compromise the balance of the whole.

The presentation was undoubtedly a bit technical but how to analyze the fact that the CTRL+E does not allow in v0.9.3 to start the PBY when loading on a parking ... but that following a second load of an identical aircraft, the sequence of keys in question can work?
My observation is that there must have been variables that had not had time to initialize and that the second loading allowed these variables to be so.

Remember some FSX aircraft that, in order to function, required loading a standard plane like the C172 and then changing planes to choose the one that "caused" problems ... In this kind of situation, it effectively allowed for a complete loading of all the necessary variables because we did not master all the different tasks that run in background in FSX and in MSFS.

This does not take away from the fact that the apron.flt file had been forgotten and that Tim found this error.
 
lagaffe said:
On the other hand, manual startup in Cold & Dark does not work.
Click to expand...
Ah, sorry I should have mentioned that in FS24 you need to open the toolbar EFB's aircraft menu and load your fuel first.
I think FS24 requires an apron.FLT because it is much more focused on the .cfg and .flt files than previous sims, which may be due to the workings of the Career Mode or general game engine optimization, or both - who knows lol.
 
You are very close to the truth because in SDK 24, when looking for information on FLTs, the documentation immediately refers to Career mode and the creation of Missions.
On the other hand, I did not find an explanation about the variables that must be defined in these files as we can find regarding the CFG file for example.

I strongly think that the period to calculate my vibrations is too small (Frequency = 1/Period) and therefore the calculation frequency too large which must disrupt the other calculations. I will try to modify this frequency and see the result.

Since yesterday, after adding an apron file on the 4 types of PBY (liners, wb, military, 6A) I had to correct at least 5 or 6 different points (on some FLT, there were still parameters missing): so it’s very positive :encouragement:

@tiger1962,
Under FS24, I use the freeware W&L from GotFriends (a FS20 interface adapted to FS24) and before starting I verify always my fuel and the aircraft balance.
 
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My last test was to decrease the frequency used to compute viabration values: I change my initial value of 30 for 9 and after tests I will be better.
In FS24, the PBY now permit Cold & Dark operations (I made 3 differents flight restarting FS24 on each time to be absolutely sure).

For testing purpose, here the v0.9.3 including all the changes made over the past few days (read Documentations\ChangeLog_093.txt) :

Dropbox

www.dropbox.com www.dropbox.com

- Frequency for vibrations: 30 to 9
- Takeoffs from water are facilitated by the modification of 2 parameters in the flight model (lift and drag for floats)
- Some modifications on FLT files
- Apron.FLT added
- A black cat is displayed on the Military version (work in progress ...)
- Computations to manage the tooltip associated to the "primer" switchs are modified (the label PRIMED is displayed after three "times")
- Contact points 12 & 13 amended in flight_model.cfg to use now the parameter "4" (floats) => the wake of the floats is apparent
- Computations for vibrations added on throtle, rudder pedals, manifolds needles, RPMs needles and "Stick" doll placed on the VC
- A new repaint OA-10A "Rescue Rangers" for your friend Cazzie !

The UVs of the two canopy above the pilot & copilot have been amended for the repainters : Jankees and Marty! Theses UVs are now on the right place onthe left side of the "ailes.png" texture ;)

This links will be usable for a week and if everything is correct it will then replace downloadable version on my site :encouragement:
Thanks for all contributions :cool:
 
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Time for some Coastal Command love.

Hunting for Bismarck!
54905492882_2b6401727f_b.jpg
 
Hi All!

I have been following this thread on and off. I am getting back into flying after a hiatus and wish to download this wonderful aircraft for 2020. However, i can't seem to find out where or how. Any help is appreciated.

Thanks in advance, Joe
 
@Joe,
Post #215, I put a temporary link (to my Dropbox) valid for about ten days.
That you do not read the previous 10 pages is understandable, but reading at least the last page of the thread is not too much to ask :p
 
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