C-97 BETA now available for download!

jankees · Apr 27, 2015

TuFun · Apr 27, 2015

Daube said:
Nice view from there
Porto-Vecchio bay, right ?

Yep... sure is! :adoration:

Aharon · Apr 27, 2015

ejoiner said:
I bet that refueling of jets was done with the KC-97 version that had the two outboard jet engines for extra speed?

E

You would be correct but it could be done without two external jet engines which IAF or USAF did many times before anyway.

Regards,

Aharon

therealjambo · Apr 27, 2015

Hi Jankees,

It's about time I said Thank You Sir, for all your wonderful repaints.

Thanks,

Bob

DaveQ · Apr 27, 2015

Here's my two pennies worth but still a WIP. A standard 1970 scheme from one at AMARC - 53-0276. I've made a set of fairly standard stencils based on the paint kit and photos which the team are welcome to for inclusion in any future paint kit. There are a couple of things that can't be done because of the way the textures of the wing tanks and nacelles are mapped. The prop warning placards on the inboard nacelles display on both nacelles so I took it off, and the radio call sign cannot be displayed on the wing tanks because one map does both left and right tanks.

I've also tried to add some panel shading though there may not be very much - not sure, not many good photo of the KC-97 in service.

DaveQ

icycle · Apr 27, 2015

jankees said:

This is fantastic. Brings back many memories. My 1st airplane I ever set foot in/on was as a 3 year old on a Wis ANG KC97 @ KMKE. Grew up listening to them fly over the house, or better yet, taxi past from the viewing area next to RWY 07 in the 60's-70s. Something about the rumble to those huge engines, and massive props, made them distinct and special from the DC9's, B720s, B707s, B727s, FH-227's, and yes, C-119's found around the airport at that time.

Thanks for the great repaint.

Bill

Daveroo · Apr 27, 2015

im just curious..has there been any updates to the original package?..i mean should i re-download it?..

DaveB · Apr 27, 2015

Dave..

Patch-1 is available on page 7 (post#172) and yes.. I'd download and install it :encouragement:

ATB
DaveB

WND · Apr 27, 2015

DaveB said:
One for Manfred I think.. nav radios.

I've been trying to get the AP to follow a nav track rather than blindly letting it do it's own thing with a planned flight and GPS selected. I've noted on previous flights that the localizer/distance gauge often doesn't show TO.. only FROM. Further tests flying from VOR to VOR using nav1 show this still to be the case. For example.. I can setup on the runway at Culdrose, take-off and tune nav1 to the Lands End VOR. On this occasion (always) the FROM/TO arrow flags TO which is correct. However.. flying past the VOR.. the localizer/distance gauge remains at TO and doesn't flip to FROM as you overfly. Tuning to further VOR's on nav1 invariably flags FROM not TO though tuning to an ILS.. it will flag TO. It will not, however, flag FROM if you overfly.

The RMI consistently finds the VOR and points to it. It will also swing as you overfly.. eventually pointing 180 from where it was.

With all this said.. I can't see how you can successfully fly nav to nav using radios.. I certainly can't after days of trying. IF there was a way to switch radios.. eg, use nav1 for ILS and nav2 for navigation using the RMI.. you'd be able to do it. Is nav1 assuming an OBS control to select a radial? I don't know. For sure.. a control switch to select nav1/nav2 active-inactive would solve the problem and by changing 1, 0 to 1, 1 in the cfg would allow you to flit painlessly from one VOR to the next using the nav2 radio (or nav1 were it not slaved to the ILS/distance gauge).

Or.. perhaps I'm barking up the wrong forest I'm not sure what's more frustrating.. that I can't get it to work or the fact I'll probably never use it if it does!
ATB
DaveB

Dave:

Your not 'barking up the wrong forest' and as far as your frustration goes - I would guess it will be from probably never using it once it gets rectified !!! lol

As it is right now, the RMI works as it should however your #1 VOR - because there is no OBS currently connected to the #1 VOR head, you won't be able to use it as it should be used (I suspect on the next patch it will be fixed). What's happening in your case is it's reacting to the last known radial from either your 'default' flight when you load or the last flight in another aircraft or whatever Microsoft (or P3D) has for a default - and sometimes it just happens to work correctly for ya..

I've got around it temporarily by installing on a 'pop up' an HSI and I've had NO problems tracking nav / gps or anything else !! In fact at this point I haven't found too much with this aircraft that I haven't been able to work around myself - MJ and his team have done a great job so far !! Actually I'm really looking forward to the C-97G !!!!!!!!!!!

As far as putting an OBS on the #2 VOR (or RMI), it's my opinion you really don't want to do that - it currently works as intended - and I really don't think you can use the #2 to track anyways because I don't think the sim will allow that to happen - I think it's just programmed to recognize nav 1 only for stuff like that - altho I might be wrong on that assumption..

All I can say at this point is "hang in there" - it will eventually get fixed !!!

Hope what I have said helps ya..

Bill

usafvet · Apr 27, 2015

icycle said:
This is fantastic. Brings back many memories. My 1st airplane I ever set foot in/on was as a 3 year old on a Wis ANG KC97 @ KMKE. Grew up listening to them fly over the house, or better yet, taxi past from the viewing area next to RWY 07 in the 60's-70s. Something about the rumble to those huge engines, and massive props, made them distinct and special from the DC9's, B720s, B707s, B727s, FH-227's, and yes, C-119's found around the airport at that time.

Thanks for the great repaint.

Bill

Bill, I actually worked on the simulator for the KC-97 in MKE. they tried to get me to transfer from Madison, because Madison was losing it's C-131 sim. Great aircraft to ride and fly in, albeit slow and noisy,
you could definetly tell when the jets kicked in. I was lucky enough to get a ride during a refueling mission with the Minnesota ANG, topping off their newly acquired F-4's.

usafvet · Apr 27, 2015

mjahn said:
Eric, she should manage 20,000 easily, and does so on my setup, as on Ted's above. She wasn't a good climber though, in real life. Could anything be eating up your power, such as was mentioned, mixture (but you would normally get a warning and prompt from FSX). Also, sometimes it gets very cold up there, so check OAT and perhaps turn the heaters on. If that's not it make a screenshot of the Monitor panels, maybe we can see something there.

Zsolt: is that the box art from the Academy 1/72 plastic model kit? And did you build it?

MJ, yes it is the Academy 1/72. I have built one and have another still in box, untouched. Very nice model... but looks better with the resin add-ons.

dvj · Apr 28, 2015

Anyone working on this paint?

ejoiner · Apr 28, 2015

dvj said:
Anyone working on this paint?

Thats a C-97. Not a KC-97. I hope to paint that one like I did for FS9 when the C-97 is created. But, similar livery for the KC would be great!

E

Mach3DS · Apr 28, 2015

hmmm...

Daveroo · Apr 28, 2015

DaveB said:
Dave..

Patch-1 is available on page 7 (post#172) and yes.. I'd download and install it
ATB
DaveB

thank you DaveB

jankees · Apr 28, 2015

ejoiner said:
Thats a C-97. Not a KC-97. I hope to paint that one like I did for FS9 when the C-97 is created. But, similar livery for the KC would be great!

E

Yes, it was on my to-do list as well for the C-97.
I did something similar for the KC-97 though:

stovall · Apr 28, 2015

Jan, you beat me to the post. I just finished downloading your number 187 when I saw Eric's request. Great job as usual.

DaveB · Apr 28, 2015

WND said:
Dave:

Your not 'barking up the wrong forest' and as far as your frustration goes - I would guess it will be from probably never using it once it gets rectified !!! lol

As it is right now, the RMI works as it should however your #1 VOR - because there is no OBS currently connected to the #1 VOR head, you won't be able to use it as it should be used (I suspect on the next patch it will be fixed). What's happening in your case is it's reacting to the last known radial from either your 'default' flight when you load or the last flight in another aircraft or whatever Microsoft (or P3D) has for a default - and sometimes it just happens to work correctly for ya..

I've got around it temporarily by installing on a 'pop up' an HSI and I've had NO problems tracking nav / gps or anything else !! In fact at this point I haven't found too much with this aircraft that I haven't been able to work around myself - MJ and his team have done a great job so far !! Actually I'm really looking forward to the C-97G !!!!!!!!!!!

As far as putting an OBS on the #2 VOR (or RMI), it's my opinion you really don't want to do that - it currently works as intended - and I really don't think you can use the #2 to track anyways because I don't think the sim will allow that to happen - I think it's just programmed to recognize nav 1 only for stuff like that - altho I might be wrong on that assumption..

All I can say at this point is "hang in there" - it will eventually get fixed !!!

Hope what I have said helps ya..

Bill

Cheers Bill.. appreciate that :encouragement:

You strive for ages and get to the point where you wonder if you can't see the wood for the trees. Going back to the default Cessna did the trick as I realised almost straight away the lack of OBS was the cause.

I think you're right about the sim only recognising nav1 for linked navigation now you mention it. Your assumption about the localizer flagging TO in the first instance is almost certainly right too. That VOR is very close to my default flight start and almost directly ahead.

Right.. those frustrations aside (and they're put aside now I know it's not only me!!) I can continue to enjoy what is already a very fine model :encouragement:

ATB
DaveB

DaveQ · Apr 29, 2015

000rick000 said:

Great one Rick! Now do it with the boom in the slot.....!

DaveQ

HvyEng · Apr 29, 2015

Daube said:
One technical question, about the real bird: At what cruise speed was the refueling done ?
I have the A2A Stratocruiser, with Accusim. It's very nice but it's not really "fast". Could it really refuel heavy jets like a Phantom or such ?

Yes, there were only a few aircraft that were not air refueled from the KC-97.

The boom speed envelope for the KC-97 was 260 – 180 KIAS (Max boom speed – Flaps up 45* bank 180K stall speed). As long as the receiver could reach a safe speed within this envelope, they could refuel. The speeds and procedures were given in the 1-1C-1-XX series of manuals; for example, the 1-1C-1-8 was the F/RF-4 AR manual. It lists the cruise and AR speeds for an F-4/KC-97L pairing as 230KIAS at 20,000 feet. There is a maneuver available, called a toboggan, that was designed to keep a slow KC-97 in front of a fast receiver. The tanker/receiver would join and make contact at the top of the AR altitude block (20,000 feet usually), then begin a 300fpm descent to the bottom of the block (usually 2000 feet, or 18,000 feet in this case). They would then disconnect, climb, and repeat until the offload was complete. This was necessary for B-52 AR.

To give some perspective in comparison to modern capabilities, the KC-135 high-speed boom envelope was 330/M.85 – 180 KIAS, the KC-10 was 350/M.88 – 180 KIAS. The need for a high speed boom was proven with the KC-97, but both of the modern tankers still use the toboggan, although for the opposite reason. With the KC-135/KC-10 the toboggan is used to keep a slow receiver in contact, such as an A-10 or heavy C-130.

I’m working on the draft copy of the manual to be included with the release version, it should be available for beta reading in another week or so. It will include elements of tanker join-up and AR speeds for various receivers, as I can find the information.

Another plug for our forums, as this thread grows and grows, a summation of FAQ’s and file updates can be found at: http://teamstrat.proboards.com/

--Dan
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