Open question for Fs9'ers

[Motormouse]

Ok, fs9 still seems to be as popular as ever, especially for those of us whom cannot afford to upgrade our machines for the X factor..
I've noticed recently a lot of the FS9 add-on sites are or have disappeared into the ether.

This means searching for that particular scenery or add-on becoming harder.

As a community a lot of us have downloaded many MB of add-ons, which are/were not hosted at the main FS web-sites;
now a lot of the time PM's between members here results in a file being e-mailed whatever..but trouble is some
files are just too big to e-mail, for example CanarySim 'Project Canarias' or Heath Wells' Christchurch/Canterbury ,NZ

What would be the implications of uploading these files to a private web file transfer site and then sending by PM
link to download file from that site, and, would everyone join in?

At work we use 'Drop-Box' to transfer large files
; and I expect there are similar sites to be found.

I would suggest we start by having a 'wanted' thread for missing add-ons (Freeware only of course)

Your thoughts please.

ttfn

Pete

 

[AndyG43]

I guess if the product was originally freeware & it was done informally then there should be no issues; some designers specify their files not be hosted at other sites and, strictly speaking, I guess this would not be hosting.

Certainly if I have anything people are looking for I am more than happy to share.

 

[SgtT]

It's a shame that we lost so many sites for FS2004. I don't know if there would be an issue with the copyrights that belong to the respective developers or not.

T.

 

[KellyB]

I am not a lawyer, nor do I play one on tv, nor did I recently stay in a Holiday Inn Express, BUT

most of the freeware files we all download have only one stipulation: that whatever we do with them cannot be done for profit, so I don't see a problem with those files.

If there is a doubt, perhaps the originator could be contacted for permission.

This is a really good idea, and could go a long way toward preserving valuable stuff.

 

[stansdds]

Yes, generally speaking, the vast majority of freeware only stipulates that it not be sold for profit, and many stipulate that it not be posted on sites that charge for downloads. As long as there is nothing in the EULA/READ ME that restricts redistribution, then there should be no problem with hosting the freeware on any file sharing site. I know a lot of sites have disappeared, especially since the global economic recession, a lot of great freeware can easily disappear if it is not hosted somewhere.

 

[SSI01]

Gentlemen: Would this discussion properly fall under contract law? I believe it does - or possibly under laws governing intellectual property rights.

I've been doing FS since FS95 and as everyone has said in this thread every stricture I've ever seen re: textures, utilities, etc has said no one can make any money with them, or upload them to a for-profit site. Only occasionally have I ever seen a mention of a site where the file can not be uploaded to. Otherwise there are no restrictions on what can be done with the files.

I ask because I have access to a number of attorneys who may be able to answer this question for us. I would be happy to pose it to them, unless we have a JD as a forum member who could answer the question. This should remove all doubt.

 

[Wing_Z]

My qualification to comment:
I'm not a lawyer, but I've lived with one for years, been through patent filing, and I've written dozens of construction contract documents.

It's relatively easy to see what the author's intent is in a freeware package, and you have to take it case-by-case, just read the readme.

Files with stuff like this in the readme could be hosted on a freeware site:
******************************************************************************************
LEGAL GIBBERISH
THIS FILE IS FREEWARE AND IS INTENDED TO REMAIN SO
DO NOT MAKE MONEY OUT OF IT DIRECTLY OR INDIRECTLY FOR WHATEVER REASONS.
__________________________________________________________________________________________
Copyright: Files included in this realease can be freely distributed and edited with no restrictions as a freeware.
__________________________________________________________________________________________
The files included in this package are copyrighted to IFDG. They are not
to be included in a commercial package, compilation CD, or any other kind
of distribution for which money is charged or to be included on a website
that is not accessible free of charge, without the written permission of
the Author.
__________________________________________________________________________________________
Copyright and distribution
-This repaint is released as freeware, you are not allowed to include it in any commercial package. You are not allowed to re-upload it to any other website that charges for download.
__________________________________________________________________________________________
COPYRIGHT INFORMATION
These files are freeware. Please amend/distribute as you see fit.
They are unsupported, so please do not e-mail us if you have problems.
Under no circumstances may these files be sold or uploaded to a payware site or any kind of illegal warez site.
__________________________________________________________________________________________
This aircraft is released as copyrighted freeware.
As freeware you are permitted to distribute this archive subject to the following conditions:
No part of these files may be used without the prior written permission of the original author.
No money shall be made from or collected for the use and or distribution of this aircraft files,
or from any part of these files without the express written permission from the original author.
__________________________________________________________________________________________


Files with stuff like this in the readme could be not be hosted without author's permission:
*******************************************************************************************
THIS FILE IS ONLY TO BE UPLOADED TO HOVERCONTROL AND MAY NOT BE MODIFIED IN ANYWAY (OTHER THAN REPAINTS) WITHOUT THE EXPRESS CONSENT OF THE AUTHOR.
__________________________________________________________________________________________
You are not allowed to use any of the Files or Parts of it for Freeware
or Payware Projects without my personal permission!
__________________________________________________________________________________________
THIS PLANE IS MY PROPERTY
FOR EACH MODIFICATION PLEASE CONTACT ME BEFORE
__________________________________________________________________________________________
COPYRIGHT:
Freeware, use of the given model and its partsis forbidden for commercial use.
All rights belong to the author, repaint only From the sanction of the author.
Forbid accomodation in network and on CD without the sanction of author.
The publication of any modifications of the given model for FSX
without the coordination with the author is STRICTLY FORBIDDEN!
__________________________________________________________________________________________
The original author retains full ownership of these files and reserves all rights and privileges under U.S. and international copyright laws. This archive, or any of its contents, may not be redistributed or uploaded to any online site or service without the express permission of the author.
__________________________________________________________________________________________

Now this thread (like many others before it) could be filled up with gibberish about this or that possible technicality, generally by those uninformed about intellectual property laws (This includes many lawyers).
The rule is: if in doubt, contact the author, using the contact given in the uploaded package.
If no response within a "reasonable time" (I use 2 weeks) then carry on.
If an author objects to an upload, just remove it.
Remain civil, most times authors themselves do not understand their own "Legal Stuff".

 

[Tom Clayton]

I agree with Wing... Each file's "readme" needs to be evaluated on a case-by-case basis. If one simply says don't make any off my file, then uploading to some public repository should be no problem. But if it'slike the Hovercontrol example (lemme guess - that one of Jordan's?), then transfers should be handles privately. To save email bandwidth, I don't think there would be a problem uploading to a private server and then just emailing a link.

 

[rich12545]

This is a GREAT idea. Maybe we could have a request sticky. If anybody is looking for a file that isn't available anymore, someone who has it can upload it to a free download site and post a link. This would be a private sharing download not a public site (like the soh download section) so there shouldn't be a problem. I think freeware designers are concerned with people not making money plus giving attribution to them for the work.

 

[OleBoy]

Beyond the 'legality" issues, I was all for this idea when I first started reading. The more I read into it, and the depth went, I lost interest. There's just too much red tape involved. It turns fun into too much work.

I look at the issue in a simple manner, that, if said add-on was uploaded to a freeware site, it is freeware for all to enjoy. Period.

Generally speaking. If there is said plane or add-on I see in a post, I've joined in topics to learn more about them. Worst (best) case scenario, I get a hold of the poster who posted screen shots, that originally alerted us of the add-on. A quick pm asking them to share usually works one way or another.

If I reiterated anything, disregard.

 

[Motormouse]

Generally speaking. If there is said plane or add-on I see in a post, I've joined in topics to learn more about them. Worst (best) case scenario, I get a hold of the poster who posted screen shots, that originally alerted us of the add-on. A quick pm asking them to share usually works one way or another.

If I reiterated anything, disregard.

No, was meant as a topic to engender discussion.

ttfn

Pete

 

[AndyG43]

Beyond the 'legality" issues, I was all for this idea when I first started reading. The more I read into it, and the depth went, I lost interest. There's just too much red tape involved. It turns fun into too much work.

I look at the issue in a simple manner, that, if said add-on was uploaded to a freeware site, it is freeware for all to enjoy. Period.

Generally speaking. If there is said plane or add-on I see in a post, I've joined in topics to learn more about them. Worst (best) case scenario, I get a hold of the poster who posted screen shots, that originally alerted us of the add-on. A quick pm asking them to share usually works one way or another.

If I reiterated anything, disregard.

I'm not sure there is all that much 'red tape' involved, although I do get your point. Tom got it spot on I think; if the original readme has no restrictions, then happy days; if there are restrictions (as with the Jordan Moore example given) then 'private' transfers are the way to go. It's all about saving valuable or useful files for the future; the CFS2 guys did a similar thing recently with the old SCW stuff.

Another thought, picking up on Pete's original suggestion; as well as a "wanted" thread, why don't we put our heads together & come up with a list of the defunct sites?

 

[Willy]

General rule of thumb for uploading to here. If there are no restrictions against it, we have no problem with hosting files. But make sure that the author is given full credit in the file description. Any further questions can be asked of Rami our File Librarian.

 

[Motormouse]

Another thought, picking up on Pete's original suggestion; as well as a "wanted" thread, why don't we put our heads together & come up with a list of the defunct sites?

Good one Andy, didn't think of that either!
My initial thought was that those files that are able to be uploaded to here or other major sites ,will mostly have been uploaded by now;
I'm thinking that a 'wanted' thread would give us a single point of contact as it were to help collate whom has what; and whom is able to help out by private transfer. For example I have a copy of the 'JASDF Gifu AB and surrounding scenery' ; which I d/l from authors site before he stopped all fs action

ttfn

Pete

 

[OleBoy]

I have a substantial sized archive of FS9 freeware treats & goodies. Back when I was into FS9 as my only means, I felt like I was turning on the vacuum at freeware sites abroad. Everything fascinated me! At some places so much, I downloaded too much and got kicked out for 24 hours. I got messages that said like, "You've downloaded plenty for today. Come back in 24 hours. In the meantime, go flying!

I will do my best to help out

 

[rich12545]

Let me be the first to request.

Recently I have been looking for a scenery that has disappeared off the face of the earth. I finally gave up. It is Christchurch/Canterbury NZ photoreal. If anybody has it and can email it to me or post it somewhere for download I would greatly appreciate it.

 

[AndyG43]

Let me be the first to request.

Recently I have been looking for a scenery that has disappeared off the face of the earth. I finally gave up. It is Christchurch/Canterbury NZ photoreal. If anybody has it and can email it to me or post it somewhere for download I would greatly appreciate it.

I'll check that when I get home from work, as I have a lot of New Zealand scenery backed up, both Godzone & freeware.

 

[rich12545]

That would be great. I'm also looking for a Hamner NZ scenery by the same folks. Btw, Robin Corn (Godzone) recently took his fs9 stuff off the market and will someday present it as freeware. It's not even on his site anymore. I got in under the wire and bought the set a couple months ago. Between VOZ and all the NZ stuff I've been putting together I'll be doing some flying down under.

 

[AndyG43]

Sorry Rich, turns out I don't have it; and looking at the pictures I found, I also want it now!!

 

[rich12545]

Thanks for looking. And lots of luck finding. I've looked pretty much everywhere. There have to be a lot of people who still have it somewhere so maybe we'll get lucky some day.