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Raptor in dogfight for its future

the one i saw did front flips :173go1:

and i consider myself well read. i have read all the tolkien books, and lovecraft, almost everything by dean koontz, and most of stephen king. i read shakespear back in high school... :caked:

i also think the raptor is a fine looking machine. :kiss:


now that i've settled the argument with my skillful debating, and by boldly ignoring any factual evidence that suggests one thing or another, i would like to express my surprise that this thread generated so many posts.
i didn't expect it to be so thoroughly debated. :applause:
 
 
It's refreshing to see you know a bit about it--The B-1 world is one of incredible successes and failures. For thatreason, I try to avoid talking about it outside of our circles.
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Yeap, I have long followed the B-1 on it's journey and even as an outsider defended it vehemently. Even my good friend who used to drive F-15's used to join in on bashing the Bone. Now he thinks the opposite. The Raptor is going to be like anything as highly specialized. Very pricey and as such nearly everyone not in the loop will want to make it the proverbial red headed step child. The high unit costs aren't just overruns, it also has to do with reduction in numbers ordered. Originally we were looking at 750. Then 442, then 332, then 288, now 188. We're at 135 and counting. Each time you cut numbers, the price goes higher and higher.
Same happened to the B-1 back in the day, just as it did with the B-2. Many other planes that were expensive for their time suffered some sort of stigma or another inside and outside of the service. The Raptor is quite the engineering feat and nightmare. The avionics are as or more complex as anything in a fighter up to this point. The FBW/FCS coupled with systems/hydraulics operating the control surfaces and nozzles in a carefully integrated way has got to be a tedious thing to maintain and watch for wear & tear. Then again, the same was true of the F-4, F-15, & F-14 back in the day. Some said all three were accidents waiting to happen. Flight crews and ground crews beat the dents out quite well over the years.

My old ROTC Chief Master Sergeant used to cuss the F-100 and F-105 up one side and down the other since he worked on them early in his career. They kept em flying and combat worthy. I am going to give the Raptor the benefit of the doubt until proven otherwise. I am just of the thinking that I find it difficult to believe that Lockheed Martin would build a $138 Million dollar lemon. One guy I know had it right, we need the Raptor in sufficient numbers but more so we need viable strike/bomber assets. The F-22's will sweep the airspace of fighters & interceptors and the strike packages will eliminate what remains on the ground as well as DEAD/SEAD Missions. I'd finish the Raptors, build a limited number of F-35's, continue with the F-16 Block 60/62 & F/A-18E/F and be done with it. We also have to consider when we're going to build a new bomber. I know the design has more or less been decided on. But building it is another thing.

Thanks for those links Panther, are great reads!
 
No sweat...
Perhaps I should be the one apologizing.....:redface:

Since I work at NAF staff level, I'm used to viewing things in a different light....

tigisfat said:
I apologize if that's not good enough for you, but I suspect that's better than most here or anywhere.:kilroy:
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