Rhumbaflappy scenery thread...

[Rami]

To all,

It has come to my attention from some of you that there is a bit of confusion on how this new Rhumbaflappy mesh and watermasking works. Allow me to explain this a bit.

Rhumbaflappy's watermesh is designed to replace the existing coastlines in areas that we fight in, Europe and the Pacific.

You have two choices.

1) Junk the stock coastlines entirely, leaving just the north.bgl and south.bgl files in the scenedb\world\scenery folder before you add his new files, or

2) You can override the existing ones with his new files.

Keeping the stock files and his in the same folder without doing either of these things is most likely what's causing some of these issues.

In addition, if you choose to install his base LOD 5 mesh, that is designed to fit as the primary scenery layer. I used it and replaced the stock mesh files (anything that does not begin with "cst," north.bgl, or south.bgl) in my scenedb\world\scenery folder, and it works just fine.

The next level mesh, DEM mesh, is best used on top of the stock layers. It looks like this in your scenery .cfg

[Area.001]
Title=Default Scenery
Local=scenery
Active=TRUE
Layer=2
Required=TRUE
Remote=

[Area.002]
Title=Terrain
Local=C:\Program Files\Microsoft Games\CFS2 Scenery\Scenedb\World (PTO)
Active=TRUE
Texture_ID=1
Layer=1
Required=TRUE
Remote=

[Area.003]
Title=CFS1 Library
Local=C:\Program Files\Microsoft Games\CFS2 Scenery\Scenedb\library
Active=TRUE
Layer=3
Remote=
Required=FALSE

[Area.004]
Title=Airport Facilities Data
Local=Scenedb\AFDFiles
Active=TRUE
Layer=4
Required=TRUE
Remote=

[Area.005]
Title=Scenery Ships
Local=C:\Program Files\Microsoft Games\CFS2 Scenery\Scenedb\Ships
Active=TRUE
Layer=5
Remote=
Required=FALSE

[Area.006]
Title=Aircraft Weapons
Local=C:\Program Files\Microsoft Games\CFS2 Scenery\Scenedb\weapons
Active=TRUE
Layer=6
Required=TRUE
Remote=

[Area.007]
Title=Vehicles
Local=C:\Program Files\Microsoft Games\CFS2 Scenery\Scenedb\veh
Active=TRUE
Layer=7
Required=TRUE
Remote=

[Area.008]
Title=Effects
Local=C:\Program Files\Microsoft Games\CFS2 Scenery\Scenedb\fx
Active=TRUE
Layer=8
Required=TRUE
Remote=

[Area.009]
Title=Runways
Local=Scenedb\runways
Active=TRUE
Layer=9
Required=TRUE
Remote=

[Area.010]
Title=Buildings
Local=C:\Program Files\Microsoft Games\CFS2 Scenery\Scenedb\inf
Active=TRUE
Layer=10
Required=TRUE
Remote=

[Area.011]
Title=FS2000_props
Local=C:\Program Files\Microsoft Games\CFS2 Scenery\Scenedb\fs2kprop
Active=TRUE
Layer=11
Required=TRUE
Remote=

[Area.012]
Title=DEM mesh
Local=C:\Program Files\Microsoft Games\CFS2 Scenery\Scenedb\DEM mesh
Active=TRUE
Layer=12
Required=TRUE
Remote=

The DEM mesh LOD 8 is designed to lie "on top" of the LOD 5 and DEM mesh, and so this should be the next layer, number 13.

[Area.013]
Title=DEM mesh LOD 8
Local=C:\Program Files\Microsoft Games\CFS2 Scenery\Scenedb\DEM mesh LOD 8
Active=TRUE
Layer=13
Required=TRUE
Remote=

Now, if you have a question about Sander's stuff, don't worry. As long as you have his scenery "on top" of Rhumbaflappy's, that portion of Europe will remain unaffected. Certain areas, such as Norway and Brittany, (extreme Western France) as well as Africa, will have greatly enhanced coastlines.

Now, it is imperative that you REMOVE his old water files and flattens in these areas, because they will interfere with his new stuff. Here are the file names:

c2eurwater.zip
c2afrwater.zip
c2nasiawater.zip
cfs2coasteur.zip
[FONT=verdana, sans-serif]cfs2coastpac.zip[/FONT]

As of yet, I have not found any major issues with any of the new files, except for some readjustments I've had to make to certain missions. And yes, it is true that some Pacific bases are affected.

Rhumbaflappy, please correct me if I've made any mistakes!

 

[PSULLYKEYS]

Good job Rami, now I have an idea of the path to take.

 

[Morton]

This explains a lot and overall most of my Europe now looks ok.
I just wonder: I notice that some parts, f.ex north of Norway (Bodoe) and Malemes (Greek islands), are drawn without shorelines. Is this right?

I still have SdC's files on top of Rhumba's files.

Morton

 

[Rami]

That's where Sander's coastlines don't cover. Parts of Brittany in Western France are like that too, but that's okay with me.

 

[Morton]

Right! No problem.

Mort

 

[merlin2]

Qattara depression

Hi all; Just took a flight over the qattara depression (SW of Alamein) in LOD 8 with watermask;
it looks like a big lake; I assume that the watermasking basically covers anything at sea level or below with water--Qattara is below sea level. Is that right? (If you remove the water mask it looks a lot better, but there is some residual low detail water in the depression left over.)

I also noticed in the French side of the Pas de calais a lot more water than I expected.

Is there any way of editing areas such as these?

thanks

Merlin2

 

[rhumbaflappy]

Hi all; Just took a flight over the qattara depression (SW of Alamein) in LOD 8 with watermask;
it looks like a big lake; I assume that the watermasking basically covers anything at sea level or below with water--Qattara is below sea level. Is that right? (If you remove the water mask it looks a lot better, but there is some residual low detail water in the depression left over.)

I also noticed in the French side of the Pas de calais a lot more water than I expected.

Is there any way of editing areas such as these?

thanks

Merlin2

Hi Merlin.

Yes, these areas will need remasking. I have suggested detailed masking at the LOD5 size level, just as SDC has done with his scenery.

A quick fix can be done by using the FS9 watermasks and decompiling/recompiling them as CFS2 masking... but FS9 masks have some oddities, like incomplete masking. And, while some areas are shaped well in FS9, others are shaped poorly.

Dick

 

[miamieagle]

What can we do to fix the or erase the old Pacific Island coast line. I know you gave us a explanation on how to do it on your read me but I would like a little more detail.


Thank you and have a good day!

 

[rhumbaflappy]

Hi all.

Here's some images that show what's available for watermasks:

Here's the default Midway atoll:

Here's FS2004:

Here's the new CST watermasks:

And here's a reworked set using the SRTM Waterbody masks:

I'm trying to get a set based on SRTM magnetic reflectance, but I'm having problems with the JPL servers. That set would have about the best island definition and placement available without getting a team of surveyors out there.

The default data for both CFS2 and FS9 are wrong. My new watermasks are OK for placement, but they do have a flooded appearance... and I can see how they might not be what everyone would want. They were meant to be a quick way to get the general war theatre landmasses correctly positioned. They do that, but I think most endusers are having trouble seeing the point, as they are not detailed enough.

That's why I proposed making more detailed masking based on a smaller size ( LOD5 size vs. LOD2 sized ). I think Jean Bomber is thinking along these lines, and this was also SDC's thinking ( though SDC was wrong to assume the FS9 data was good data for all areas ).

For FS2004 users, the Ultimate terrain series for Europe, Canada, and the US are about as good a data set that you can buy. These are not available for CFS2, nor will they be in the future... if you own those sets, you could
decompile the LWM masking, and convert it to CFS2 masking. That's a lot of work for something that cannot be shared due to copyrights on the data that Alan licensed.

It may be that FS9 data for the same area as the Ultimate Terrain series would be OK, but then there still are some copyright problems as I'm sure Microsoft bought a license to use the commercial data, and that would not be transferable to CFS2... Microsoft might not care, but their data providers might. And in this time of economic woe, all we need is a bunch of lawyers to start suing freeware CFS2 scenery developers in order to generate some corporate income.

:focus:

For the Pacific, there are some problems with data. You could use Luis' Sa's gmaps to grab small areas of imagery for backgrounds to use with SBuilder or Ground2K... but covering the planet with this method would be insanity... and many of these images are Digital Earth, or other aerial imagery that just wasn't prepared quite right. Maybe OK for landmasses, but not for accurate positioning of buildings and runways.

So, I'm left with the SRTM waterbody data, and use Landsat7 images for correcting them as needed. And then there is the hyper accurate SRTM magnetic reflectance imagery... but that is only good for island areas, as it's the contrast I'm looking for to determine the coastline.

My plans are to rework the LOD5 areas that contain the default airfields, and to also rework the original AFD and runway BGLs to reflect accurate positioning, if possible, using LandSat7 imagery to find the right length, width, center, heading...

Unfortunately, I've found that Google Earth is NOT the best source for accurate images or placement. That's because the Digital Earth aerial photos aren't reprokjected or angle-corrected with the attention to detail that the US government used with LandSat7 satellite imagery.

And although FSSC seems to be the best for making AFD and runway BGLs, I can't use background images with any assurance, as the LandSat7 images must be reprojected from geographic to some kind of meter measurement... maybe with a bit more thought I can get this. But for now, I can get all the data from my GIS programs, enter it into FSSC without a background, and remake the BGLs.

Hopefully, the Jet Propulsion Laboratory will get their server back in order, and I'll grab a bunch of images to detail the landmasking near the default airfields.

If any of this sounds complicated, I can tell you it is. But I can still remember the first time I took census road and water data, and made scenery with it for FS2002... It was a definite WOW! moment for me, and led to a terrain revolution for the FS series, that still goes on today.

It's a process that takes time.

Dick

 

[rhumbaflappy]

What can we do to fix the or erase the old Pacific Island coast line. I know you gave us a explanation on how to do it on your read me but I would like a little more detail.


Thank you and have a good day!

Hi ME.

The folder that contains the default terrain is:

C:\Program Files\Microsoft Games\Combat Flight Simulator 2\SCENEDB\world\scenery

All files like "blablabla9.bgl" ae LOD9 mesh, which may not be very accurate, but it will be bumpy.

All files like "blablablam.bgl" are land/watermasking.

All files like "blablablap.bgl" are VTP1 lines, which are the beaches, streams and roads. If you use any addon land/watermasking ( like my set ) then these have to go, as the lines no longer will match the masking.

SDC's Europe addons, and some stuff Jean Bomber is working on have new masking and VTP1 lines for beaches and roads. These maskings and VTP1 lines should overwrite the default masking, or my replacement masking... but the default lines ( "blablablap.bgl" ) may still need to go.

Dick

 

[PSULLYKEYS]

Thanks Rhumba.I wondered about that also!

 

[Skipsan]

Ramba is quite right about Midway I lived there and walked every inch and dived the waters and lagoon for over 4 years off and on. Somewhere in my files are info on the flora & fauna, I can probably give general early bldg layouts/location and the general sea plane runway/rams on sand a Doti for runway/berms, general bunker.bldg locations on eastern if need be. I have no GDM's for facilities on the islands, sorry.

Skipsan

 

[DauntlessDriver546]

Did you see any plane wrecks while you were out there diving, Skipsan?

 

[miamieagle]

Thank you very much!:ernae:

 

[Jean Bomber]

Hi all
The first big project as has suggested Dick ,that surely could take several years,would be to redone the entire default airbases and make new coastlines to fit with the Rhumba's mask ; for the pac theatres this could be made island by island ,Crachaz has begun by the first Hawaï ,rhumba show Midway
..we could take the WWII PTO battles order ...:d ....this could be better if we have a plan ,we should realise these future sceneries in FS standard size as Rhumba has organised his work and as SDC had made his Euro scenery and how the scenery game is made.We must think FS ....lod13 ,lod8, lod5
from Christian Fumey's Ground2K_US.doc that explain clearly best that I could :
"....
Vocabulary :
- LWM : Land/Water Masks -> how to define or re-define land or water surfaces
- VTP : Vector base Textured Polygons -> how to create textured polygons and lines (road, river, shore …)

1. The earth is covered by water tiles (landclass 100)

2. Land tiles are defined where necessary; a tile covers about 1.2x1.2 km; each tile corresponds to a LOD13, a Lod13 has always the same sizes in longitude/latitude : 0.010986328125°for latitude and 0.0146484375° for longitude.
Each LOD13 is divided in 256x256 points. Each point covers about 4.8x4.8 meters, a point is the smaller surface we can display using Resample.exe, LWM or VTP.

LOD13s are arranged in LOD8, a LOD8 = 32x32 LOD13, or in LOD5, a LOD5 = 256x256 LOD13.
We can used other groups, but in Ground2K, only LOD13, LOD5 and LOD8 are used.

In the rest of this help, we respect the FS vocabulary : a LOD13 is an Area, an LOD8 is a Cell
......"
Many of the PTO islands to redone have not generally a huge land area and they are displayed as confetis on a huge area of sea ,for example the entire Truk lagoon represents 4xlod8 in size ,many islands are on one or two lod8 ,Midway some (22) lod 13 ,we don't have to rework the entire CST area,that could be possible to basically draw coastlines ,from LWM 1.3 bitmap from the Rhumba's masks for the essential lod5 zones,and corrige some disturbed meshed zone from srtm bmp,redone the interesting target area in most detailled lod 8 ,and a last level ,some lod 13 mostly detailled, around the airfield ,port, etc...And the MR's blended process etc....
I think the internet,or other, "investigation" work is the best to redone the default airfields,and all the others,the goal is to find wwII maps,most near of,on various scale sized with coords ,if possible, to make accurate G2kprojects and pics that help for feel the mood of the sceneries for make the blended texture mask and place the infs...etc....
Here a the kind of link as I like as example that talk ,between others, about Midway .....
there are some good maps and pics
http://www.airfields-freeman.com/HI/Airfields_W_Pacific.htm
I've seen in an another thread on SOH about a pdf doc about all the wwII PTO airfields ,I have it somewhere in my DD ,this kind of historical list with maps and coords info could be a good base for start to redone in first the default airbases.
A last ,non negligeable parameter, is that ...Sometimes there's just not enough hours in the day....
.... ............

JP

 

[Skipsan]

NO DD546 not really in 1987 there was still a few pieces of a PBY still over at the Rusty Bucket. The only artifact of WWII I found in the lagoon was a bomb in paled into a coral head. We had EOD come out from Pearl and blow it. Fine & Feather was not to happy about that one:Banane47:

Skipsan

 

[rhumbaflappy]

There are also other problems. Some airfields changed much during the war... so what period do use?

And, some islands have actually changed shape over the years ( Iwo Jima is a good example ).

Eventually, we can only get it close, and hope it fits historical needs.

I'm more concerned about runway and coastal location, rather than accurate building placement ( gsl ) or setting up missions.

Dick

 

[merlin2]

Original scenery dimensions

Just for the record; what area does the original CFS2 high quality scenery cover? This will help in knowning when to use the original, and when to slip in Rhumbaflappy's LODs and Watermask.

thanks

 

[kelticheart]

A good day to everybody!

I have been reading this thread and now I feel a little :isadizzy: and .....

The reason is because my pc seems to behave the opposite of anyone else's. I had hell for years with SdC's coastilines not following ETO coasts very well and only recently I discovered it was casued by a conflict with leftover European water files from my old Gary Burn's BoB scenery, which I still use and enjoy a lot.

When Rhumba stated SdC's stuff wuold have interfered with his mesh and watermasks I thought: "Great, I just fixed a problem now I am getting myself a new one!"

Not so. Even the latest LOD8 mesh sits with SdC's coastlines very well and my ETO shores look better than they ever did before!

Now the PTO. Rhumba suggests to rename the default shorelines, roads and streams "pac????p.bgl", which will conflict with his watermasks and so I did. I did not rename them, just moved them to a new SCENEDB\world\scenery subfolder I called "default_PTO_shores". Easier to move them back, just in case.

Look what happened....as you can see from the attached screenies, without the default Pacific shorelins CFS2 is not even capable anymore to distinguish between land and water, misplacing all of the landclass tiles.

The area is the Palau Islands and I took off from the Arakabesan strip, which shows water texture covering the hills laying to the right of the strip in shot #1. Once in the air, the misplacement of the landclass is very obvious: look at the peninsula in shots #2, 3 and 4, the mesh is under the water and the land texture is parallel to the mesh in the water! Shots #3 and 4 show well the path I followed, I took off, gained altitude while veering to the right, Arakabesan is near the right-hand side top corner in shot #3 and almost in the center in shot #4......

next....
​

 

[kelticheart]

...and now with the default shorelines back in place...

......now look what happend when I put the default shorelines back to SCENEDB\world\scenery and I got the last screenie: the very same peninsula now is in the right place, just like any other small island of the Palau archpelago!
Not only, the scenery looks splendid to me with the new, accurate mesh! I am using PacTex v.2 and Jimko's Pacific Blues water class.

Yes, probably there are shores here and there that climb slightly up the cliffs, perhaps a little water, too, but I can truly live with these small defects!!! Overall the Pacific now looks a thousand times better than it ever did before, while, I am sorry, but I could not accept how the scenery looked without the default shorelines in place.

Now, why everybody else has to remove the default PTO shorelines, while in my pc I must do the opposite?

Not only: I haven't noticed the expected drop in framerate anticipated by Rhumba when adding the LOD8 mesh on top of LOD7, LOD5 and LOD8 watermasks. I am not complaining, but my pc is now a 5 year old AMD Sempron running only at a 2Gb clock, with just 1Gb of RAM, my ATI Radeon SVGA has only 128Mb of RAM: performance should have slowed down!

It beats the hell out of me........:isadizzy::isadizzy::isadizzy:
KH :ernae: