Ship Dynamics - Pitch and Roll?

[Shadow Wolf 07]

In a thread long ago I read that it is possible to increase the pitch nd roll of ships - carriers specifically - by increasing the numbers in the [Dynamics} para on the cfg file.

What is a good but not too challenging pitch and roll combination? The stock ships have nothing there - no entries. Collin's 43 and 44 Essex Class have no entries either.

The VN Carriers show:

[Dynamics]
pitch_wave_moment_scale = 1
bank_wave_moment_scale = 1
pitch_damp_moment_scale = 1
bank_damp_moment_scale = 1

Usio's carriers vary greatly from:

;[Dynamics]
; r“VŽž
;pitch_wave_moment_scale = 22
;bank_wave_moment_scale = 40
;pitch_damp_moment_scale = 10
;bank_damp_moment_scale = 16

...for the JMK USS Lexington to:

[Dynamics]
pitch_wave_moment_scale = 1
bank_wave_moment_scale = 1
pitch_damp_moment_scale = 1
bank_damp_moment_scale = 1

...for the JMK IJN Ryujo. And the other warships and cargo ships don't seem to follow any particular rule. Your thoughts?

 

[sc7500]

Hat In The Ring...

I set my ships for a fairly moderate "sea condition":

[Dynamics]
pitch_wave_moment_scale = 4
bank_wave_moment_scale = 3
pitch_damp_moment_scale = 1
bank_damp_moment_scale = 2

Looks about right from the air ~ haven't tried tweaking them much since 2004....

SC

 

[Shadow Wolf 07]

Thank you! Any other ideas opinions or suggestions?

 

[Collin]

I don't believe the cfg file will recognize any figure higher then 10.

I did add the dynamics to the earlier carriers I made but peeps complained that they couldn't land (wuzzes), so I left them off of the Essex lot.

regards Collin:friday:

 

[Shadow Wolf 07]

That's a shame Collin, even just a little realism makes the game better. I have a few - and I can't remember where I got them:

SHA_Lexington_CV16, SHA_Hornet_CV12, SHA_Bunker_Hill_CV17, SHA_Bennington_CV20 for example that have..

[Dynamics]
pitch_wave_moment_scale = -3
bank_wave_moment_scale = 6
pitch_damp_moment_scale = 1
bank_damp_moment_scale = 1

But then shouldn't the escorts and auxilliary ahips be rockin and rollin too?

 

[Collin]

[Dynamics]
pitch_wave_moment_scale = -3
bank_wave_moment_scale = 6
pitch_damp_moment_scale = 1
bank_damp_moment_scale = 1

But then shouldn't the escorts and auxilliary ahips be rockin and rollin too?

Yes, they should, but then you would get complaints moaning about how they can't be torpedoed.:faint:

What does the minus sign in front of the 3 do?

regards Collin:karate:

 

[Shadow Wolf 07]

"What does the minus sign in front of the 3 do?"

I don't know... I was hoping ypou would. I have to do some test flights and see

 

[Collin]

Suggest you make a mission with 2 ships that have the same dynamics but the minus sign is omitted on one of them. If they are side by side you can watch what happens.

regards Collin:friday:

 

[Shadow Wolf 07]

Suggest you make a mission with 2 ships that have the same dynamics but the minus sign is omitted on one of them. If they are side by side you can watch what happens.

regards Collin:friday:

Good suggestion. I just set up a pair of missions with 2 carriers: one has the 1,1,1,1 settings the other has the -3,6,11 settings. I take off from each with the 2 missions in the SB2C w/bombs, heavy to see if I get the same climbing and control problems that Cowboy_1968 refered to. I will land on each and observe each both from the deck and in the air. I'll do the test flights later and post the results. Also, I'll add one more carrier of the same size and author with the minus sign omitted.

 

[Shadow Wolf 07]

Collin, I used your Hancock 44 at 1,1,1,1; Randoph 44 at -3,6,1,1 and Shangril La 44 at 3,6,1,1.

I flew Wolfi's SB2C off the Randoph 44 first. I had no problems taking off or landing. Some spray was coming over the bow. Looking over at the Hancock, I noticed she was showing some pitch and roll but not much. The Shangri La looked like she was in heavy seas. Being an Army puke I don't know the terms but there are 2 bands of paint on the lower hull - one black and one red. Pitching down, the black band was almost completely submerged. Pitching up, 3 to 4 times the thickness of the black band was showing in red!

Later, after landing on Shangri La, It looked like it had about a 10* roll. Looking over at the Rabdolph I could see she had less than half the pitch that I had observed on the Shangri La.

I didn't bother with taking off/landing on the Hancock 44 because she looked fairly tame. I'd say the 1,1,1,1 setting is good for a standard and the -3,6,1,1 is good but more challenging.

 

[Collin]

Could you please repeat the experiment, but, this time, grab some piccies?

The spray is interesting, (and might become more interesting if you use the cruiser bow wave thats on my site at the bottom), I wonder if the spray will show on the aircraft windshield?

But well done, every little development helps and the dynamics is one of those unexplained.

regards Collin:ernae:

 

[Shadow Wolf 07]

Sure, but I have to do it on my desktop. I've been doing all this stuff on my laptop and the &%)@$! Vista OS doesn't like my Grab Clip Save or Fraps! I'll copy over the mission files to my XP desktop, where the screenshot and video work fine probably tomorrow.

Yeah, the bow spray was cool. I use Nibbio's effects for wakes, smoke, fires, debris and such and noticed the spray before but never focused on it.

 

[Blue Devil]

That's a shame Collin, even just a little realism makes the game better. I have a few - and I can't remember where I got them:

SHA_Lexington_CV16, SHA_Hornet_CV12, SHA_Bunker_Hill_CV17, SHA_Bennington_CV20 for example that have..

[Dynamics]
pitch_wave_moment_scale = -3
bank_wave_moment_scale = 6
pitch_damp_moment_scale = 1
bank_damp_moment_scale = 1

But then shouldn't the escorts and auxilliary ahips be rockin and rollin too?

Well...

...that would be me.

Alternate the signs (+/- ) of the "pitch_wave_moment_scale = n" and the "bank_wave_moment_scale = n" of Ships that are typically in the same formation (e.g. to Essex/Bunker Hill) so that they are not synchronous.

i.e.
pitch_wave_moment_scale = (-) (-) (+) (+)
bank_wave_moment_scale = (-) (+) (-) (+)

Negative (-) "pitch_wave_moment_scale = n" is preferred, ...as it starts the motion w/ a bow up movement that is faster than the damped return motion, ...so use it on the ships you launch off most. Set "pitch" so that the stern is not awash, ...then set the value of the bank to 2x pitch.

Set the CV's so the A/C don't slide off the flight-deck (yeh, ...ya wuss Air Force types, ...become NAVAL AVIATORS, ...or stick to yer two(2) mile long runways.)

As far as I can tell, ...the "damp" just reduces the entire dynamic, ...so just leave it on "1".

And yes, ...add [Dynamics] to the .cfg's of ALL your Ships.

e.g.

sha_mahan.mdl
[Dynamics]
pitch_wave_moment_scale = -4
bank_wave_moment_scale = -8
pitch_damp_moment_scale = 1
bank_damp_moment_scale = 1

afvn_SanDiego.mdl
[Dynamics]
pitch_wave_moment_scale = 3
bank_wave_moment_scale = 6
pitch_damp_moment_scale = 1
bank_damp_moment_scale = 1

sha_essex_cv9.mdl
[Dynamics]
pitch_wave_moment_scale = -3
bank_wave_moment_scale = 6
pitch_damp_moment_scale = 1
bank_damp_moment_scale = 1

Enjoy.

 

[Collin]

Thanks BD, (nice to hear from you again).

Though there is an art to landing on a pitching deck as well, especially if yer damaged:help:

regards Collin:ernae:

 

[Devildog73]

You guys really do not like my propellers and wings do you?

I break enough already damaged aircraft from missions without a rockin' and a rollin' flight deck to bring my wounded bird back to.

My ground crew always has to patch any old girl I go up in, 'cause I always overstay my welcome on missions and bring the girls home without ammo left and very little fuel.

Not sure I could miss the landing and come back around for a second go of it!

 

[Shadow Wolf 07]

Thanks BD! I'll work with it

"Though there is an art to landing on a pitching deck as well, especially if yer damaged:help: "

"I break enough already damaged aircraft from missions without a rockin' and a rollin' flight deck to bring my wounded bird back to."

Indeed...

 

[Blue Devil]

Thanks BD, (nice to hear from you again).

Though there is an art to landing on a pitching deck as well, especially if yer damaged:help:

regards Collin:ernae:

You too Mate...


Try snaggin' a wire in a Corsair w/ this on your CVE:

uss_sicily50.mdl
[Dynamics]
pitch_wave_moment_scale = -3
bank_wave_moment_scale = 7
pitch_damp_moment_scale = 1
bank_damp_moment_scale = 1


As for Tut's:

[FONT=&quot]"F4U Corsair Carrier Qualification"
by Fred "Crash" Blechman[/FONT]

Enjoy.

 

[Shadow Wolf 07]

As per Collin's request I redid my experiment. I took 22 pictures and made a video. First off let me say that I forgot when I loaded Jean Bomber's Truk scenery that the textures packs would overwrite my sea colors textures. I hate that Pactex Hudson River/Bayonne NJ slime green for the ocean. I have since put my stock water colors back in.

Anyway, the screenshots don't show the bow spray as well as the video... without the sensation pf motion it just looks like a slightly faded shot. The video is a bit jumpy because every time I hit the printscreen key, FRAPS and GrabClipSave took a screenshot and I got lag. Also sloppy editing comes into play

Both landings and especially the second are a bit bumpy but my plane stayed in one piece. I'm way out of practice!

Since there are a total of 22 pictures, I'll just post the link to my Photobucket page where they are uploaded. Oh, and for som reason, they uploaded in reverse order. Pictures start at the bottom of page 18 and continuing on page 19:

http://s81.photobucket.com/albums/j220/Pechora07/?start=340

The direct link to the video is:

http://s81.photobucket.com/albums/j220/Pechora07/?action=view&current=PitchandRoll.flv


Cheers :ernae:

 

[Collin]

Well done Shadow, I have studied both the vid and the piccies, thank you for taking the time to make them.

Points to note..

The spray, while it looks good is actually coming up through the model deck of the ship. This is happens because the special effect system ignores all solid models and does its own thing once triggered. But if you noticed it didn't spatter the cockpit glass like the rain effect does.

The rolling motion imparts an impetus to the aircraft model (this is also seen on the cockpit hud), and also makes the tires flatten or the whole wheel rise above the deck (vid time about 5.34).

The dynamics seem to make the ship move as if she was in a moderate to heavy swell.

Your landings are as good as mine, now try the Sicily.:faint:

Well done.

regards Collin:ernae:

 

[Shadow Wolf 07]

"Your landings are as good as mine, now try the Sicily.":faint:

Will do It seems that with all my add-on darriers, the LSO gives me a wave off as soon as he pops up. I may have to find a way to eliminate him.