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  • Please see the most recent updates in the "Where did the .com name go?" thread. Posts number 16 and 17.

    Post 16 Update

    Post 17 Warning

Tuskegee Airmen

warchild

warchild

Charter Member
Just a heads up guys, that this weekend will be the release of the movie "Red Tails" the true story of the Tuskegee airmen ( or so Lucas Films says). Any history buffs or warbird buffs should find this a fairly interesting film.
Lucas Films has also sponsored a grant to The Tuskegee Airmen Inc. site. It is a 501C non profit organization with 57 chapters nationwide. You can learn more about TAI here http://www.tuskegeeairmen.org/.
Enjoy
Pam
 
I cringe every time I see the otherwise fine trailer on TV when it shows that CGI P-51 doing what looks like a tail slide with a roll over perfectly timed to take a 90 degree deflection from on top shot on a Luftwaffe fighter flying underneath it and cut it apart in a half second burst of 50 cal fire!

You try a maneuver like that in actual combat and you expose yourself to death because you surrender all of your energy for one snap shot! Very dangerous because the approaching enemy merely has to pull up when you are in a zero velocity situation and he has the easiest direct gun shot possible to cut you open like a can!

It looks nice for the movies, and few will cringe. But, I guess I am one of those few. I will see the movie out of basic respect for the actual men involved.

Ken
 
theres an interview with the guy who pulled that stunt on the red tails sight. Somehow, he actually did it but it was asgainst an ME-262 not a bf-109.
go to the red tails movie site. Select go to the base from the menu on the bottom, and click on the movie projector. its the bottom reel of film.
 
What Roscoe Brown described does not seem to match what was depicted in that movie clip. He simply said he dived down below the bombers and then pulled up to nail a passing Me-262 that flew overhead him -- unless I completely misread what he was describing.

Cheers,

Ken
 
The clip we're all talking about here is so far the only CGI "hiccup" I've noticed in what we've been shown thus far. That one clip is visually impossible as portrayed from a flight dynamics standpoint... But it hasn't killed my desire to see the movie because everything else I've seen so far looks like nicely done, well executed CGI. I plan on seeing it opening weekend. Looks like a lot of fun.
 
Thanks JD.. Thats pretty awesome of ya...

What Mr brown says is "I saw these streaks coming, so instead of going this way ( motions left and around ) I went down, turned the plane upside down, went down under the bombers and i caught one of the jets just as he was coming in shoot down the B-17."

not sure if it matches the clip your decribing, but i thought it did..
Pam

mmm, yeahh.just watched that segment seveal times through. he wasnt fuly upside down, but stalling. he didnt use flaps which could have given him a tight turn radius like that displayed, but, technically, something similar, but less spectacular did take place..
 
I plan to see it - I saw an interview with George Lucas where he said that if this film does well in the first week or two he can release both a prequel about their training at Tuskegee and a sequel...familiar ground for Mr.Lucas who indicated that the other two films are better than this one...If the sequel follows Benjamin O. Davis Jr's career I can believe it.
 
Lucas is very committed to bringing the legacy of these men to popular film and I salute him for that. It is without question a very worthy subject.

Warchild, what you are doing is a split-S, roll inverted, pull down, and that is a classic maneuver. The opposite in a modern Immelman and that is also a classic maneuver. If the CGI had smoothed it out in more of an arc in the sky, then I would have been fine with it. But, the CGI scene was more of the aerobatic flying show aircraft perform, which is a climb straight up to stall, with a tail slide, and then a push of the stick to flip over and head for the ground. It looks great for an airshow, but it's such a terrible surrender of energy in combat that when you hover there at the top nearly motionless you are helpless if an enemy comes along and plugs you. I cannot believe Roscoe Brown would pull a maneuver like in that movie clip. But, a split S or Immelman I could definately believe.

On the other hand, if you first roll inverted and push forward on the stick, aren't you going to push up in pitch relative the ground?

Cheers,

Ken
 
That would be awesome.. I learned about the Tuskegee airmen some time ago, asnd to be quite honest, i'm still quite ignorant about them, but, what little i did learn, sure rocked my world.
Their still fighting though. The Alabama parks service declared Moton field an historical site, but its done nothing to improve the condition of it despite a large budget. Kentucky DID name one of its freeways that stretches 127 miles after the Tuskegee airmen because of the 11 members that came from that state, and this new site, TAI, looks to want to do outreach and education. Its been an uphill war for these gentlemen for more than sixty years, but they persevere.. pretty damned amazing..
Pam
 
Skyhawk_310R said:
On the other hand, if you first roll inverted and push forward on the stick, aren't you going to push up in pitch relative the ground?

Cheers,

Ken
Click to expand...

Yup, and thats the point of it.. Looking at it from a glass half empty pov, that stall exposes you to a lot of danger, but from a glass half full pov, it exposes you to an incredible number of opportunities. Now, i'm not going to defend Lucas. We've all grown old watching the effects produced by Industrial light and magic. i guess that maneuver is where some of that magic comes in, but, i do know this from experience..
When your in combat, you dont think about the danger. if you do, your dead. You follow your training first, and yoyur instincts afterwards. Fighter pilots are chosen for their instinct for the kill, even today. Brown wouldnt have been thinking about being exposed, he would have been hunting his next target.
The 322nd flew over 1500 sorties during the war. They never lost a single bomber to enemy fire, but they lost 63 men, and another 33 were captured.. They didnt think about the possibilities of getting killed. They thought about their families back home and living free, and the only way to do that was win the damned war.. It took untill 1947 to even be awarded their medals..
When i was in Nam, when the mortars would start falling, i'd grab the M1 and head out for my post while the mortars were still dropping. I was terrified beyond anything i could ever hope to describe, but i and so many others, refused to think about it. the only thing in my little brain was get to my post. I dont think these gentlemen would have been much different.. :)
Pam
 
Gentlemen,

I would ask that you please visit my Red Tails review thread on Newshawks. Your input would be greatly appreciated.

JAMES

ATTN: jdhaenens,

I have your scenery!!! Thank you. Thank you. Thank you.
 
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