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Update Douglas_C-47_Beta_V3.14 feedback and support topic

MJ C-47 v3.14 – [SMOKESYSTEM] not working

In preparation of an event (Market Garden) I need to have the effect dropping paratroopers working in P3D4. With a small modification I have this effect working throughout all versions of P3D even P3D4. For some reason it stopped working. I tested the effect file with the Visual fx tool from the SDK and it works fine, but somehow it cannot be activated with the smoke instruction. In the Key assignments in P3D smoke on/smoke off is connected to the I key. I know that a few gauges in the MJ C-47 does not work in P3D4. Is there anyone to help me out with this? Is it difficult to build a small gauge to activate the smoke instruction? Thanks in advance.
Roy
 
MJ C-47 v3.14 – [SMOKESYSTEM] not working

Some instructions on the P3D side of the forum led to the fact that I can now drop paratroopers again.
Roy
 
Hey,
just installed it into P3Dv4, and everything seems to be working except the cockpit sounds. Fuel pump sound is the standard cessna one, no switch sounds, no callout/ checklists sounds, what works are only the engine/ gear/ flap sounds once the engines start.
Did I miss something during the install? I installed the 3.14 (186-something-MB) zip, the TW soundset and the 3.14 fixes.
I have her also in FSX-SE, there everything is working properly.

Best,
Matthias
 
You need to download the 64 bit sound gauge by Dawson and install it to get the sounds to work. I believe there is a thread about it somewhere on this forum.
 
Hi,
While checking the Aircraft.cfg [airplane_geometry] section "htail_pos_vert = -52.7". At least I think I know this can't be right. But when checking the default DC-3 I see the same value. I'm hesitant to make any changes as I don't know if this was done as a "temporary" fix for some other problem and never corrected. Anyone have any info or thoughts on this?
Also does anyone know of any central location where anomalies like this might be posted? I have no idea if this has been brought up before and if so I don't want to waste people's time rehashing this or anything similar. Fantastic plane, of course!
Jim F.
 
It all depends on where the "reference" point is.

In this case, it would appear that the position is correct, since that's where the various lights that should be on the top of the tail show up. Easy way to check. Make an entry in the Lights section at about the position that either a) you think the tail should be, or 2) the position the tail IS. Load up the plane and take a look at where the light you added shows up. That will tell you what's going on.

Looking at other positions being called out for the plane, that one looks to be correct for this plane. Just the way the dev created it.

Does that help?
Pat☺
 
Hi Pat,
I wasn't sure if you were referring to my post but am assuming you were.
Here's a quote from the SDK:
"Vertical distance of the horizontal tail apex (measured at centerline of aircraft) from defined reference point, (feet). This distance is measured positive in the up direction."
I'm interpreting apex as the forward most point of the horizontal tail if it were independent of the aircraft. This would put the apex 52.7 feet below the centerline of the plane. Checking similar sized aircraft shows values which are several feet positive which seems rational.
Jim F.
 
Hello again Jim.

I am referring to your posts.

Is there something wrong with the aircraft model that you think might be connected
to this aircraft.cfg file entry?

Have you tried amending the number to the value that you consider to be correct and
if so, what is it about the model that changed?
 
Last edited:
Hi Jim. Yes I was.

You're assuming the reference point is at the usual place most devs place it. Apparently, in this case, it's a bit above that.

Like I say, one way to verify it is to put a light there, load up the plane and see where it shows. If it shows up at the top of the fin, you have your answer. It would mean the reference is above where most place theirs.

Or you can do as Mr. Ncooper suggests, and change the - to + ie: just get rid of the minus sign and see what happens. Make sure you save the aircraft.cfg before you make any changes, though.

Alternatively, you can email the Dev and ask him/them.

But like I said, look at some of the light positions. They tell the tale of the tail :D
Pat☺
 
Hi again Pat,
I don't know if your familiar with the free "Visualizer" progam but it's simpler to use than placing lights to determine locations. Here's a picture of the C-47.
attachment.php


I tried to draw a green circle at the reference (1/4 chord, centerline, waterline). If you look closely at the encircled area you can see a lateral line there also. The multiple longitudinal lines are 1 foot apart. If you follow the waterline (?) aft you can see that the correct "htail_pos_vert" is approximately 2.5 feet above the waterline. It's strange but after checking numerous aircraft anomalous readings just pop out at you.
When I first posted here my concern was not so much this one strange value but in seeing if there was a specific area in which to post similar things or if this had already been discussed. I have half a dozen or so more questions regarding the aircraft.cfg and without some central place I'll probably post in this thread or start a new thread dedicated to similar questions regarding the C-47. It seems with the plane still in beta now is the time. By the way I always appreciate your replies. You always make an effort to be helpful.
Jim F
Edited for clarity.
 

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Hi Jim :D
I've seen references to that program before, but never used it. Maybe time I gave it another look.
You're 100% correct, though. It does look like it's at about 2.5' up. I was wrong, so I apologize.
Maybe there's an aerodynamic reason the placed it were they did. I read something about that in the .air file "bible". They reference the position of the horizontal tail in relation to the wing having some kind of effect. Darned if I can recall the details, though. I'll try to find it again.
Either Mr. Jahn and team had a good reason to place it that way, or it was one of those "through the cracks" things. If the former, perhaps he will tell us what gives, if the latter, maybe he will correct it.
Have you tried placing it at +2.5' and seeing what happens? At worst, it will be uncontrollable, at best, you found and fixed a problem, which is what Beta is for, after all :encouragement:

In any event, I'll give that visualizer a look. As I recall, last time I tried it it didn't work on my system, but that was a while back, and a couple computers ago.
Have fun!
Pat☺
 
Hi Pat,
I haven't modified any of the values in the aircraft.cfg. As the value was simply copied from the default DC3 I think it was just a typo and apparently had little effect on operation. But I'm not sure something in either the .air or .cfg file wasn't jockeyed to compensate for it. I will get around to changing it after getting a bit more comfortable with the plane.
I Googled "Visualizer FSX" and it's readily available at Developer. You want to use it with FSX in a window and Visualizer visible also. When you start it first click "Connect to..." then choose something you'd like to see the location of like Wingtips then "Force A/c..." . After you see the aircraft reload click in the FSX window and unpause. You can click as many points as you like if you'd really like to be confused!. And for some odd reason "Datum" is listed in the Wings section. For this C-47 you'll see the datum is located 20 feet forward of the reference and at the nose of the plane. This is handy if you have the plane 3 views drawn on graph paper as you can read the values directly from the graph paper graduations without having to go positive and negative from the reference.
The main reason I'm looking so carefully at the plane is it's my intention to modify some of the panel window numbering as I have buttons on my yoke dedicated to do certain things and I really don't want to mess up things like the monitor and checklist features. And I still haven't figured out what changes the overhead panel panel lettering between the standard and paratroop versions.
Jim F.
 
Hello Jim,

At the risk of being overlooked a third time, this would be the ideal single place to post
feedback about the current model.

The main reason I'm looking so carefully at the plane is it's my intention to modify some of the panel window numbering as I have buttons on my yoke dedicated to do certain things and I really don't want to mess up things like the monitor and checklist features. And I still haven't figured out what changes the overhead panel panel lettering between the standard and paratroop versions.
Click to expand...

The 2D panel window numbering can be changed to suit yourself.
They must be in numerical order but there is no reason why you should not change them around.

The difference between the standard and paratrooper VC overhead is
SimObjects\Airplanes\Douglas_C-47_Beta_V3.14\texture.Paratrooper\panel_3.dds and
SimObjects\Airplanes\Douglas_C-47_Beta_V3.14\texture.Paratrooper\panel_3_LM.dds
which are loaded when the paratrooper version is selected.
 
Last edited:
jandjfrench said:
Hi Pat,
I haven't modified any of the values in the aircraft.cfg. As the value was simply copied from the default DC3 I think it was just a typo and apparently had little effect on operation. But I'm not sure something in either the .air or .cfg file wasn't jockeyed to compensate for it. I will get around to changing it after getting a bit more comfortable with the plane.
Click to expand...

Really looks like it is a typo when we see the same value for pos_lon and pos_vert (from FSX default DC3) !
Code: 
htail_pos_lon           = -52.7                 //Feet, longitudinal distance from reference point, negative going aft
htail_pos_vert          = -52.7                 //Feet, vertical distance from reference point, positive going up

The exact same lines have been ported to various sorts of DC 3 : C117, Basler BT67, C47-V2

I wonder what's are the value in the DC3 MAAM (I don't have it) or the FS2004 DC3...

Gérard
 
Fs9 DC3:

htail_pos_lon = -52.7
htail_pos_vert = -52.7

MAAM sim DC3 and C47:

htail_pos_lon=-41.666667
htail_pos_vert=0.000000

FSX default DC3:

htail_pos_lon = -52.7
htail_pos_vert = -52.7

My question remains, does this make any difference to the way that the model looks or performs?
A second question, what can this possibly have to do with VC textures or 2D panels?
 
Hi ncoop and gaab,
Appreciate the replies. Hard to know where to start here. This C-47 is is right at the top of the finest offerings I've seen for FSX. I don't know how many of the unique features work and am hesitant to make any substantive changes in fear of screwing something up. Whenever I get a new plane I tailor it to my liking and correct any deficiencies I come across. That's what I'm up to.
The FSX DC-3 which was ported over from FS9 had many problems such as controls that did not work properly, flaws in the new internal VC and cfg entries that were not in accordance with the FSX SDK. The inability to properly select the fuel tanks was the final straw for me, so I simply used the FS9 version and made my own changes. As a general rule I replace any pop up windows with cameras that vary as little as possible from what the pilot would see in the actual aircraft.
I'll try to respond to your posts.
My concerns about where to post were based on not knowing if this was a thread for general questions/observations about the C-47 and not just the latest update. Unless I'm advised otherwise I'll post here regardless.
Due to the dynamic nature of the checklist and monitor windows I wasn't sure if they could be renumbered without causing problems. In all of my aircraft I have Window 00 configured to display the Airport Chart. I use Apchart to show info about an airport I intend to land at such as elevation, frequencies and layout on something that looks like a tablet without having to pause the sim by going to the map screen.
I saw the info about different overhead views and will look into that further. Still not sure what is keyed on when making the selection.
And finally I haven't made any changes to the htail values so I don't know what effect on performance it would have. I was mainly seeking input if anyone had any additional info on this. I do not expect to find anything in the aircraft.cfg that would have any impact on the VC textures or 2D panels as the same panel folder is selected for both versions. I didn't mean to cause confusion and just mentioned it as part of my general plan.
And please, don't under estimate my ignorance and post anything you think I might find helpful. I won't be offended.
Jim F.
 
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