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The Staff of SOH
We need this one....Sopwith Strutter
- Thread starter Cowboy1968
- Start date
Blood_Hawk23
Charter Member
as long as we have the correct wing geometry the rest shouldn't be to hard. After doing some reading it seems she had simular flight characteristics as a PUP. maybe a bit more stable and bigger of course. the question will be which engine would you want. The Clerget 9b with 130hp or the 110hp unit.
here are the Specs for the 130hp (from wiki sorry).
General characteristicsType: Nine-cylinder air-cooled rotary engine
Bore: 120 mm (4.72 in)
Stroke: 160 mm (6.30 in)
Displacement: 16.29 L (993.8 cu in)
Dry weight: 175 kg (385 lb)
ComponentsFuel system: Bloctube carburetor
Cooling system: Air-cooled
PerformancePower output: 130 hp (96 kW) at 1,250 rpm
Compression ratio: 4.56:1
i'll have to look for the ones i have for the 110hp. i think either the compression is different or the bore-stroke. i have it somewhere and will have to look.
again the DP from the camel should be a good starting point. this plane was leagues above the LVG so i wouldn't use that one. just my thought. we'll have to add the gunner/observer to the DP along with the lewis gun for the two seaters.
till later,
John
here are the Specs for the 130hp (from wiki sorry).
General characteristicsType: Nine-cylinder air-cooled rotary engine
Bore: 120 mm (4.72 in)
Stroke: 160 mm (6.30 in)
Displacement: 16.29 L (993.8 cu in)
Dry weight: 175 kg (385 lb)
ComponentsFuel system: Bloctube carburetor
Cooling system: Air-cooled
PerformancePower output: 130 hp (96 kW) at 1,250 rpm
Compression ratio: 4.56:1
i'll have to look for the ones i have for the 110hp. i think either the compression is different or the bore-stroke. i have it somewhere and will have to look.
again the DP from the camel should be a good starting point. this plane was leagues above the LVG so i wouldn't use that one. just my thought. we'll have to add the gunner/observer to the DP along with the lewis gun for the two seaters.
till later,
John
I have the data for the 130hp and have it working in CFS2. What Camel are you talking about? I already have made a DP from the Stock Zero. I re-did the boxes to fit the model and added the Vicker and lewis guns (I used the setting that DP EDIT has in the ARMS_WW1.dat)
I need to know how strong/weak the parts need to be. Right now the darn thing is strong as Zero and you can't shoot it donw if you and the AI have the same plane. You (the player) will round out of ammo.
I need to know how strong/weak the parts need to be. Right now the darn thing is strong as Zero and you can't shoot it donw if you and the AI have the same plane. You (the player) will round out of ammo.
Blood_Hawk23
Charter Member
I've mostly been working with the aerocrates aircraft. those seem to be the most consistant. the FS2000/2002 adaptation isn't a very good one. and many of the earlier cfs1 versions are just as bad.
oh on the Clerget 110hp (9A or 9Z) the data is as follow...
note:The 9Z Redesigned with aluminium pistons, tubular connecting rods and revised valve gear.
Horsepower:
110 (82 kw)
R.P.M.:
9A - 1,200
9Z - 1,300
Bore and Stroke:
9A - 4.7 in. (120 mm) x 5.9 in. (150 mm)
9Z -4.72 in (120 mm) x 6.30 in (160 mm)
Displacement:
9A - 931 cu. in. (15.3 liters)
9Z - 994 cid (16.2 liters)
Weight:
9A - 295 lbs. (134 kg)
9Z - 375lb (170kg)
Compression Ration:
9A - 4.3
9Z - 4.3?
Displacement per Cyl:
9A - 103.5 cid
9Z - 110.4 cid
i've guessed at the compression ratio for the 9Z. it would make sense since the 9B and 9Z have the same specs except the 9B has a compression of 4.56 which could give more horsepower. this is purely an educated guess from what i know about automobile engines. I haven't been able to find the exact numbers yet. but seeing how it had aluminum pistions, it only makes sense.
oh on the Clerget 110hp (9A or 9Z) the data is as follow...
note:The 9Z Redesigned with aluminium pistons, tubular connecting rods and revised valve gear.
Horsepower:
110 (82 kw)
R.P.M.:
9A - 1,200
9Z - 1,300
Bore and Stroke:
9A - 4.7 in. (120 mm) x 5.9 in. (150 mm)
9Z -4.72 in (120 mm) x 6.30 in (160 mm)
Displacement:
9A - 931 cu. in. (15.3 liters)
9Z - 994 cid (16.2 liters)
Weight:
9A - 295 lbs. (134 kg)
9Z - 375lb (170kg)
Compression Ration:
9A - 4.3
9Z - 4.3?
Displacement per Cyl:
9A - 103.5 cid
9Z - 110.4 cid
i've guessed at the compression ratio for the 9Z. it would make sense since the 9B and 9Z have the same specs except the 9B has a compression of 4.56 which could give more horsepower. this is purely an educated guess from what i know about automobile engines. I haven't been able to find the exact numbers yet. but seeing how it had aluminum pistions, it only makes sense.
Maybe you guys with a WWI install can tell me if I have things right or not. Drop it in and see how it is. Sound is aliased to A6M2 Zero so you may need to change it first..
View attachment 77106
View attachment 77106
Blood_Hawk23
Charter Member
i haven't tried shooting her down yet but i did make a few tweeks to the files. i'll post them if you'd like. notes on the DPs:
For those with the aerocrates weapons...
[PAYLOAD.1]
; Payload = Bombs Light
mount.3=wep_rl_pylon, 1, -1
mount.2=wep_cop_25lb_gp, 1, 4
mount.5=wep_rl_pylon, 1, -1
mount.4=wep_cop_25lb_gp, 1, -1
[MISC_DATA]
unit_family=1
category=1
allegiance=3
max_group_size=8
min_speed=80
cruise_speed=128
max_speed=161
min_alt=25
cruise_alt=1980
max_alt=4730
entered_service=4/4/16
crew=1
enteries in red are in meters. not sure why but that seems to work best when using these planes in MB. also do you want it listed as a fighter or attack.
she is in dire need of a new skin. the prop detail is off as well.
having said all that she flies rather nice. i'll try shooting her down with my albatros DV and let you know how it goes.
For those with the aerocrates weapons...
[PAYLOAD.1]
; Payload = Bombs Light
mount.3=wep_rl_pylon, 1, -1
mount.2=wep_cop_25lb_gp, 1, 4
mount.5=wep_rl_pylon, 1, -1
mount.4=wep_cop_25lb_gp, 1, -1
[MISC_DATA]
unit_family=1
category=1
allegiance=3
max_group_size=8
min_speed=80
cruise_speed=128
max_speed=161
min_alt=25
cruise_alt=1980
max_alt=4730
entered_service=4/4/16
crew=1
enteries in red are in meters. not sure why but that seems to work best when using these planes in MB. also do you want it listed as a fighter or attack.
she is in dire need of a new skin. the prop detail is off as well.
having said all that she flies rather nice. i'll try shooting her down with my albatros DV and let you know how it goes.
Blood_Hawk23
Charter Member
Ok the "hitpoints" seem to be good to go. she could probly use a little more in the fuse. sections but from what i've read these were abit fragile. so its up to you. i've gone against them atleast a dozen times now and all it takes is a few good bursts from an Alb-DV.
i do think the effects should be looked at. there is a little to much smoke and explosions for a WWI plane. thats just my thoughs.
I'm getting to work on the AI handeling. she rolls alot but is having trouble climbing. i'll work on the MOI values and let you know what i get.
I like her alot and think she'll be a fantastic addition. Awesome job Allen.
thats my take. can't wait to see what the rest think.
i do think the effects should be looked at. there is a little to much smoke and explosions for a WWI plane. thats just my thoughs.
I'm getting to work on the AI handeling. she rolls alot but is having trouble climbing. i'll work on the MOI values and let you know what i get.
I like her alot and think she'll be a fantastic addition. Awesome job Allen.
thats my take. can't wait to see what the rest think.
Cowboy1968
Charter Member
I think we just about have her. She seems to have the right speed, she flies stable, She has that good feel of a nice two seater
I did try to take her in combat, and she does a good job in defending herself, the ai seems to handle her well. that damn tail gun got me couple of times.
I was beat to making her ready for aerocrate weapons.
But I do believe we have her,
Now i hope we can update the single seat model as well
Thank you everyone for your great work....
I did try to take her in combat, and she does a good job in defending herself, the ai seems to handle her well. that damn tail gun got me couple of times.
I was beat to making her ready for aerocrate weapons.
But I do believe we have her,
Now i hope we can update the single seat model as well
Thank you everyone for your great work....
Cowboy1968
Charter Member
Comment on the .dp. The guns on her are bit to acurate for firing over open iron sites, we need to adjust that....
Blood_Hawk23
Charter Member
what was the adjustment for that again?
also did the bombs go on the wings or under the fuselage? i'll do some digging.
i think the heavy bomb load will be best for the single seater.
also did the bombs go on the wings or under the fuselage? i'll do some digging.
i think the heavy bomb load will be best for the single seater.
Cowboy1968
Charter Member
Actually i looked at the .dp with DPED you have that set right for the chance of hit
I guess i was just unlucky in my Albatros D.III
According to Windsock Datafile 34, the two seater was used as a light bomber, recon, and two seat fighter, while the Royal Navy Air Service listed the single seater as a bomber (Windsock datafile 80).
Bruce, J. M. (1992). Sopwith 1 1/2 Strutter (Vol. Windsock Datafile #34). Berkhamsted, Hertfordshire, Great Britian: Albatros Productions Ltd.
Bruce, J. M. (2000). Sopwith 1 1/2 Strutter Volume 2 (Vol. Windsock Datafile #80). Berkamsted, Hertfordshire, Great Britain: Albatros Productions Ltd.
Blood_Hawk23
Charter Member
yeah i changed it to a different value and was shot down rather fast. so its good where its at. did that gun have any downward deflection?
i have bomb loads done with 2x25lb on wings, 4x25lb wings in dual pylons, 4x20lb in quad center pylon, and 6x20lb in 2 single and 1 qaud pylon. not sure of the exact loadouts but your right on the center Oldwheat. I found a pic of a russian strutter with the a quad rack.
Cowboy1968
Charter Member
actually, I don't think i got from a downward deflection. I was coming up from under on the left wing of the Strutter....I was making a climbing attack and I believe he got me as i came up and across his right wing.
I have been looking though the photos in Windsock Datafile 80...and it seems the only photo evidence in that volume is with racks below the center...
But I am sure that they most have had rack to carry light ordinance under the wings.
Cowboy1968
Charter Member
yep, that guy has one hell of an eye...he got me cold when i was coming around from under even when i had made some good hits on the Strutter....
but again, a lot of the best aces were brought down one time or another by a stinger postilion....
And yes on page 17 of Datafile #80, there are drawings that show the virticle storage for the bombs and yes it appears that it is in the area that once was occupied by the observer....
I try to cover every thing...
Not a lot I can do about the skin. Never so good a make my own from scrach. This why I have recycyled from the FS2000 Camel. What prop detail is off?
Fixed DP for exssive smoke/fire and explosions.
Is the rate of roll too high/slow or something else roll related?
Rate of climb is 1292 fpm at 56/57 MPH accorting to AirWrench. Try climing at 56 to 60 MPH and see if that helps.
Now the Front and Back guns are using setting found in aerocrate aircraft. This should help from getting chewed up by the observer.
Put the bombs under the fuselage.
I also gave the aircraft some marking. From what I know it was apart of the 43 Sqn, RFC and was captured by German in undamaged condition in May 1917 after a force landing. I also did a basic a check list.
View attachment 77137View attachment 77136
Not a lot I can do about the skin. Never so good a make my own from scrach. This why I have recycyled from the FS2000 Camel. What prop detail is off?
Fixed DP for exssive smoke/fire and explosions.
Is the rate of roll too high/slow or something else roll related?
Rate of climb is 1292 fpm at 56/57 MPH accorting to AirWrench. Try climing at 56 to 60 MPH and see if that helps.
Now the Front and Back guns are using setting found in aerocrate aircraft. This should help from getting chewed up by the observer.
Put the bombs under the fuselage.
I also gave the aircraft some marking. From what I know it was apart of the 43 Sqn, RFC and was captured by German in undamaged condition in May 1917 after a force landing. I also did a basic a check list.
View attachment 77137View attachment 77136