• There seems to be an uptick in Political comments in recent months. Those of us who are long time members of the site know that Political and Religious content has been banned for years. Nothing has changed. Please leave all political and religious comments out of the forums.

    If you recently joined the forums you were not presented with this restriction in the terms of service. This was due to a conversion error when we went from vBulletin to Xenforo. We have updated our terms of service to reflect these corrections.

    Please note any post refering to a politician will be considered political even if it is intended to be humor. Our experience is these topics have a way of dividing the forums and causing deep resentment among members. It is a poison to the community. We appreciate compliance with the rules.

    The Staff of SOH

  • Server side Maintenance is done. We still have an update to the forum software to run but that one will have to wait for a better time.

CFS2 Knowledge needed.

Allen said:
I can confirm it make the stock splash/shockwave effect stronger. The effect is not too much better (or maybe no change at all) with a direct hit on the target. Hitting the ground next to the target make a massive splash/shockwave.
Click to expand...

I wonder if only one records the hit on target. That could explain that. also we are only talking about 1000 points of damage. up it to that of a 2000lb bomb and it would be bigger, I think. I wonder what would happen in a group of targets.

you know we could simulate the the effect of cluster munitions by having small damagable boxes in and around the targets. if the extra gunstations can effect these small targets it would look like a cluster bomb droped.

something to think about.
 
I think found how to fix so that even direct hits have massive splash damage. I think CFS2 only uses gunstation.0 to do damage. So if you add more guns to [guns.0] massive splash damage will be used with direct hits.

[guns.0]
gun.0=1,0,0,0,0,0,1
gun.1=1,-500,0,-500,0,0,0,1
gun.2=1,-500,0,-500,0,0,0,1
gun.3=1,50,0,500,0,0,0,1
gun.4=1,50,0,500,0,0,0,1
 
Allen said:
I think found how to fix so that even direct hits have massive splash damage. I think CFS2 only uses gunstation.0 to do damage. So if you add more guns to [guns.0] massive splash damage will be used with direct hits.

[guns.0]
gun.0=1,0,0,0,0,0,1
gun.1=1,-500,0,-500,0,0,0,1
gun.2=1,-500,0,-500,0,0,0,1
gun.3=1,50,0,500,0,0,0,1
gun.4=1,50,0,500,0,0,0,1
Click to expand...

I'll have to try that. I'm trying to get screen shot but even at the slowest setting i keep missing. I cant get the whole ring.
 
Interesting idea,s , I assume your testing from player aircraft , Are you getting damaged ground objects for the total distance 1000 ft ?
 
Sarg Willy said:
Interesting idea,s , I assume your testing from player aircraft , Are you getting damaged ground objects for the total distance 1000 ft ?
Click to expand...

I haven't done much more with it. Where its not going to work the way I wanted, I kind of put it on the shelf for now.

It is an interesting idea and may work to better simulate the bomb effects. Especially the larger HE type. Could use it to replace the stock 2000lb bombs. Even if you only when a few meters it will give a more defined shockwave. Other then that it won't add extra bomb effects.

If you discover any more let us know.
 
My two bits....

It might be more advantageous to focus on the damage range and hitpoints magnitude in the FX files themselves rather than tweaking the weapon dp's and such.

Small bombs under 250lbs are classed by defo as weapon_type=1 in the MISC_DATA sections of the bomb dp which is linked to the fx_gndexpl_s.fx file on impact. Bombs of 300lbs to 500lbs are generally classed as weapon_type=2, which is linked to the fx_gndexpl_m.fx file. Anything greater than 500lbs are classed as weapon_type=3 and weapon_type=4 and both classes are linked to fx_gndexpl_l.fx. So, if you want to modify the blast effect of a bomb beyond tweaking its damage dice in the dp gunstation section you first change its weapon type class to a higher level to link it to a stronger FX file. If the FX file isn't effective enough to suit your requirements you can modify it by increasing the Hitpoints, Magnitude and Range parameters.

Hitpoints are the total minimums and maximums applied to any object's dp if the object is located within the blast range of the bomb. This range is defined by the numerical code (in feet) of the Range line. The Magnitude code affects the visual appearance (in size) of the blast.

Below are some examples of the headers from my modified FX files. But be advised that any extravagant modifications to bomb FX magnitude and range can sometimes adversely impact subsequent damage effects during the course of the combat action. For example, after a couple of your "big bangs", you may notice that your bullets no longer have any visual or actual damage effect in strafing or air-to-air engagements after the drops, or any further bomb drops might display as wimpy firecracker pops. This is another inherent weakness of the sim engine's outdated FX department. If anything like this should happen, you just have to pack it up and RTB...mission over.

Also, it goes without saying, but any changes made to a ground explosion FX file in behalf of a newly created weapon will also affect any other existing weapon in that same class. When i wrote a new napalm FX package, i linked it to weapon_type=1 and reassigned every existing napalm bomb in my arsenal to this class for the sake of exclusivity to fx_gndexpl_s.fx. I then modified fx_gndexpl_s.fx to generate the new napalm effects alone. I then reassigned all bombs under 250lbs to type 2 to get them out of napalmville and bumped everything between 250 to 500 to type 3...~viola~

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

fx_gndexpl_s.fx

[Library Effect]
Lifetime=5
Version=1.00
Damage=1
Hitpoints=3500.00, 5000.00
Magnitude=4500.00, 5500.00
Time=0.30, 0.30
Range=100.00,160.00
Fire=1
Fire Delay=0.00
Sound=5
Sound Param=34

**************

fx_gndexpl_m.fx

[Library Effect]
Lifetime=5
Version=1.00
Damage=1
Hitpoints=5400.00, 5800.00
Magnitude=20000.00, 28000.00
Time=0.30, 0.50
Range=200.00, 300.00
Sound=5
Sound Param=34
Fire=1
Fire Delay=1.00

************

fx_gndexpl_l.fx

[Library Effect]
Lifetime=5
Version=1.00
Damage=1
Hitpoints=6800.00, 7000.00
Magnitude=35000.00, 40000.00
Time=0.50, 0.50
Range=300.00, 500.00
Sound=5
Sound Param=34
Fire=1
Fire Delay=1.00

***********

fx_gndexpl_l--NUKE.fx

[Library Effect]
Lifetime=5
Version=1.00
Damage=1
Hitpoints=70000000.00, 80000000.00
Magnitude=472500000.00, 693000000.00
Time=3240.00, 3960.00
Range=6150.00, 6850.00
Sound=5
Sound Param=37
 
Last edited:
Awsome info Bearcat.

Some of this I knew. Other bits I didn't. More or less its the enhancement of the shockwave that I noticed. I'm not sure if it increases the damage area. That I have not tested.

So my original intent to have multiple exposions won't happen. From what I've read I kind of knew this already. As far as making an effect to simulate it I dont think that is possible either. Best we could do would be the small hiden box idea when a bomb drops in the right area.
 
Ok, just so i'm clear, are you trying to get a larger, single bang on one drop, or a series of smaller, multiple bangs from a "cluster bomb" drop, each with wide blast zones?
 
bearcat241 said:
Ok, just so i'm clear, are you trying to get a larger, single bang on one drop, or a series of smaller, multiple bangs from a "cluster bomb" drop, each with wide blast zones?
Click to expand...


that was my intent. Here is the DP from the single 4lb incendiary. Large effect small damage.

[BOXES]
box.0=%box_name.0%,-0.021,-0.021,-0.272,0.021,0.021,0.272
[SYSTEMS]
system.0=%system_name.0%,2000,21
[BOXMAPS.0]
; Box = bomb_0
boxmap.0=100,21
[EFFECTS.0]
; System = Bomb
effect.0=10,LIBRARY,fx_fuelleak_s,
effect.1=60,LIBRARY,fx_gastank_m,
effect.2=95,LIBRARY,fx_airexpl_l,
effect.3=99,LIBRARY,fx_napalm,
effect.4=100,BOMB,,
effect.5=30,LIBRARY,fx_fuelleak_s,
effect.6=60,LIBRARY,fx_gastank_l,
effect.7=95,LIBRARY,fx_airexpl_s,
effect.8=99,LIBRARY,fx_napalm,
effect.9=100,BOMB,,
[GUNSTATIONS]
; Bomb
gunstation.0=3,21,8,0,0,0,0,0,0,0,1d1*1000,0,0,0,0,0,0,0,0,0,0,64
[guns.0]
gun.0=1,0,0,0,0,0,0,0

[MISC_DATA]
unit_family=4
category=37
max_weight=2
weapon_type=2

[STRINGS]
"box_name.0"=bomb_0
"system_name.0"=Bomb

Ok that one works fine. But then I wanted a cluster effect. Something to overcome the 24 mount limit. Thats when I started on the other. (SEE OTHER POST FOR DP)

When I started testing it I noticed the larger shockwave. Saddly only the single explosion. Thats why I used the weapon_type=3. I wanted the larger fireball. I still haven't tested the new DP on groups of targets.

I thought about using MDLs but even they will only act the same as the bgls. Even the animations and such. So as I feared going in, the cluster bomb or even cluster packs are not going to work.

So you can see where it was all going. To simulate 236 4lb bombs being dropped.
 
If you want to get a real time, close-up look at how someone else has done something like this in CFS2, go to the Virtual Wings site and download the Dora weapons pack (get the planes too of course). Install the planes and the weaps and make sure you have the ab250 and ab500 cluster bombs in the loadouts of the kites. Fly them in FF and watch the effect of the cluster drops. That should shed more light on the subject. I could break it all down here on how its done, but this download will give you a good hands-on look at the dp setup and the visual outcome: http://www.virtualwings.org/dora/weapons.htm
 
bearcat241 said:
If you want to get a real time, close-up look at how someone else has done something like this in CFS2, go to the Virtual Wings site and download the Dora weapons pack (get the planes too of course). Install the planes and the weaps and make sure you have the ab250 and ab500 cluster bombs in the loadouts of the kites. Fly them in FF and watch the effect of the cluster drops. That should shed more light on the subject. I could break it all down here on how its done, but this download will give you a good hands-on look at the dp setup and the visual outcome: http://www.virtualwings.org/dora/weapons.htm
Click to expand...

Ok so looking at it all, only the Case is modeled, correct. The bomblets have not model. Or am I missing some thing.

That setup works for a single bomb or cluster but for the SBCs on the lancaster I don't think it would work.

Bearcat,

Here is a thought. Tell me what you think,

I could easily model all of the SBCs as one model. That would free up 23 mount points. which I could then add the 4lb packs or the 30lb. that takes 12 slots, so 13 total. which leaves one for the cookie and 10 for effect. so you will have 23 bombs dropping. I could make the 4lb have 2 drops to give a larger effect. that would give an extra 10.

I think that is the best that could be done. Now I just have to model it all. I have an idea for that as well.

Thank you very much Bearcat. Please fill me in on anything I've missed.

Till Later,
John
 
Blood_Hawk23 said:
Ok so looking at it all, only the Case is modeled, correct. The bomblets have not model. Or am I missing some thing.
Click to expand...

That's correct...they have a presence via the weapon's bgl file and dp file but no visual model.

I could easily model all of the SBCs as one model. That would free up 23 mount points. which I could then add the 4lb packs or the 30lb. that takes 12 slots, so 13 total. which leaves one for the cookie and 10 for effect. so you will have 23 bombs dropping. I could make the 4lb have 2 drops to give a larger effect. that would give an extra 10.
Click to expand...

Honestly Blood Hawk, this is where i'm totally blanked. Please pardon my duplicity but i'm probably not the right guy to present this to. I know this sounds like buzz kill, but to my eye, there seems to be too much going on in this proposed setup, too many moving parts as they say. While in real life a Lanc could easily be outfitted with such a sophisticated loadout, within the limitations of virtual sim world this setup may not be practical, subject to some compromises when you're up against in-game handicaps like the hardpoint limitations of CFS2. Putting historical realism aside here, would it be easier to just split the loadouts between two or three dp's to create multiple payload options for the player depending on the mission objectives?

And remember what i said above about overloading the sim's FX engine...you'll lose some damage and visual effects if a wave of bombers saturates the target with all this ordnance in one drop, not to mention the inevitable slideshow effect. The sim just isn't set up to accommodate a large bomber formation with each ship dropping 23 highly destructive bombs plus a cookie all at the same time. The high capacity cookies alone would be show-stoppers. Sprinkle a lot of big bang bomblets into the landscape along with that and you'll end up blowing up somebody's computer as well. :pop4: If you plan to upload this to public domain, you don't want to put too much work into something that the community can't use because of degrading performance issues.

My two bits: just break up the loadouts and go easy...:very_drunk:
 
Last edited:
Good points. That is all info that I need to know. The more the better.

I'll tell you what. I'll make the models for the SBCs and the 4lb incendiary packs. If you want I'll send you a copy to see what you think. there would only be 13 bombs dropping visually. with an extra 10 not showing. I don't think the AI can drop that many. I'll have to test it. If you'd be willing to give it a try then i'll put it together.

I'm actually more worried about the models complexity. I have one done right now with all of the 236 bombs modeled. its over 4800 polys. they are simple 6 sided sticks. i couldn't believe it when i saw that. I have one that is down to around 500 polys. I'll have to do some LODs for it. not to hard to make a box. i might try to get it down to under 500.

Most of the work is finished so I wont have to do any extra. If you interested let me know. Thank you again for your help.

Till Later,
John
 
Back to the lab...

I think I'm going to revisit this. Shessi's Leaflets have given me an idea. Now I just have to model the 4lb IBs so they take up less polys. AI's won't need the SBC's and I can make less detailed models for the Incendiaries. effects models will come later.

I need to see how much space I have to work with inside of the Lancaster.

Rami,

Which Lancaster model would be best for the Player and AI?

What are you using or planning to use for your Chastise missions?
 
Reply...

BloodHawk23,

IHave the set that Allen worked on. I can sent them to you later this afternoon. I need to bring my mom into Boston this morning to have her fistula (dialysis) looked at.
 
The Lancasters I made are edits of the ALPHA Lancaster. I know I sent you the Lancaster B Mk.I with normal bomb bay and top turret as I still have a copy of the "sent" email. If you need it again let me know.
 
Allen said:
The Lancasters I made are edits of the ALPHA Lancaster. I know I sent you the Lancaster B Mk.I with normal bomb bay and top turret as I still have a copy of the "sent" email. If you need it again let me know.
Click to expand...

I must have it then. I 'll just have to look. I messed with one of my installs so I'll have to look in my archive.
 
Got it.

Hey Allen, did you ever make the one for the "Tallboy" and "Grand Slam"?

I have the MKIII special. With the upkeep mine. I don't have the other.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top