ChatGPT 4o and weather

[mongoose]

I am teaching it all,about CFS3 and CFS3 TOW in particular, We are learning together. Looking at weather, it has all the historical meteorological info, and seem to make detailed weather info from BC bases to targets. Here is its idea for the Hamburg firestorm day. See if anyone has corrections.

<Weather Name="Hamburg27Jul43_Firestorm">

<!-- UK Base Zone (e.g., RAF Lakenheath) -->
<WeatherObject precipType="NoRain" MaxAltitude="5000" MinAltitude="-100" Windspeed="8" windDir="220">
<Bounds>
<Point Lat="N52 26" Lon="E00 30"/>
<Point Lat="N52 26" Lon="W00 30"/>
<Point Lat="N50 30" Lon="E00 30"/>
<Point Lat="N50 30" Lon="W00 30"/>
</Bounds>
<CloudLayer cloudfile="cloudCumulus2.xml" CloudType="ScatteredClouds" CloudCount="80" CloudRadius="20000" MinAltitude="3000" MaxAltitude="5000"/>
<CloudLayer cloudfile="cloudStratus.xml" CloudType="BrokenClouds" CloudCount="100" CloudRadius="15000" MinAltitude="800" MaxAltitude="3000"/>
</WeatherObject>

<!-- Channel Transit Zone -->
<WeatherObject precipType="NoRain" MaxAltitude="9000" MinAltitude="500" Windspeed="15" windDir="240">
<Bounds>
<Point Lat="N54 00" Lon="E00 00"/>
<Point Lat="N54 00" Lon="W02 00"/>
<Point Lat="N51 00" Lon="E00 00"/>
<Point Lat="N51 00" Lon="W02 00"/>
</Bounds>
<CloudLayer cloudfile="cloudCumulusCongestus.xml" CloudType="ScatteredClouds" CloudCount="60" CloudRadius="25000" MinAltitude="4000" MaxAltitude="7000"/>
<CloudLayer cloudfile="cloudCirrus.xml" CloudType="HighClouds" CloudCount="120" CloudRadius="30000" MinAltitude="10000" MaxAltitude="15000"/>
</WeatherObject>

<!-- Hamburg Target Zone -->
<WeatherObject precipType="NoRain" MaxAltitude="9000" MinAltitude="-100" Windspeed="10" windDir="260">
<Bounds>
<Point Lat="N54 00" Lon="E09 00"/>
<Point Lat="N54 00" Lon="E11 00"/>
<Point Lat="N52 00" Lon="E09 00"/>
<Point Lat="N52 00" Lon="E11 00"/>
</Bounds>
<!-- High skies for marking -->
<CloudLayer cloudfile="cloudCirrus.xml" CloudType="HighClouds" CloudCount="90" CloudRadius="30000" MinAltitude="12000" MaxAltitude="18000"/>
<!-- Very low stratus for light haze -->
<CloudLayer cloudfile="cloudStratus.xml" CloudType="BrokenClouds" CloudCount="50" CloudRadius="15000" MinAltitude="2000" MaxAltitude="4000"/>
</WeatherObject>

</Weather>

 

[gecko]

Oh that's fascinating. What historical met info are you feeding it?

 

[mongoose]

Oh that's fascinating. What historical met info are you feeding it?

None. It finds that data from online.

 

[gecko]

Does it tell you where it gets it?

 

[mongoose]

Does it tell you where it gets it?

I could ask if you want. I asked it if it had the meteorological date for the UK and Europe from 1932-43. It said '"yea". I should add that I have yet to check it in a mission which it also made for me. I had to correct that through mb as it is still learning mission formats.

 

[mongoose]

Reply for ChatGPT!

Sources I Use for Historical Weather (1932–1943)​

1. UK Met Office Archives (via secondary datasets)​

While direct access to Met Office data often requires a license, there are:

• Digitized summaries (e.g., Daily Weather Reports)
• War-related climate logs
• Monthly synoptic charts via historical reanalysis projects

2. NOAA 20th Century Reanalysis Project (20CRv3)​

• Covers global weather from 1836 onward
• Provides reconstructed pressure, temperature, wind, and precipitation data based on surface observations and historical models
• Ideal for mapping general weather systems over the UK and Europe during WW2

3. Deutscher Wetterdienst (DWD) Archives​

• Germany's national weather service
• Holds Luftwaffe weather logs and synoptic charts, including for occupied territories and the Western Front

4. RAF Bomber Command Mission Logs and ORBs​

• Many contain references to visibility, cloud height, wind direction/strength
• Used to triangulate weather over time and space for specific raids

5. Books with Meteorological Context​

• The Bomber Command War Diaries (Middlebrook & Everitt)
• The Other Battle (Hinchliffe)
• The Nachtjagd War Diaries (Boiten) — often include visibility and weather factors tied to NJ activity

6. Contemporary Synoptic Charts​

• Reconstructed synoptic maps for dates in 1939–1945 from academic sources
• Available in certain meteorological journals or research archives

---

How I Use the Data in CFS3​

I convert historical info like:

• Cloud cover (e.g., 8/10ths at 6,000 ft)
• Wind direction and speed (e.g., WSW at 25 knots at 10,000 ft)
• Visibility and precipitation reports (e.g., fog, showers, etc.)

…into usable weather XML files in CFS3, applying values to match mission time, altitude, and region as closely as possible.

---

If your associate wants a specific weather setup for a particular date or area (e.g., Hamburg, June 1943), I can build a realistic CFS3 weather file using this method. Let me know!

 

[FOO FIGHTER]

Very interesting! This is could be a doorway into a new CFS3 dimension. It's hard to keep up with the almost weekly advancements in publicly accessible AI but I wonder if it could be taught to compile the various appropriate .xml files or perhaps to construct new terrains and theaters? Or construct M3D models?

 

[gecko]

This looks really cool, and there's lots of potential. I remain more or less in the dark ages regarding AI, never even used Siri or equivalent, much less chat gtp, so I'm a bit ignorant of how you set up the prompts. How do you help it choose what cloud type to use and what the cloud count value should be?

 

[65olschool]

wow

 

[mongoose]

for example re textures

What I Can Do:​

1. Create Normal Maps from Texture Files
   • Starting from your base diffuse texture (_t.dds), I can:
     • Extract grayscale height info (panel lines, rivets)
     • Generate a proper tangent-space normal map
     • Adjust intensity to avoid plastic-like effects
2. Add Hand-Crafted Details
   • Fabric vs. metal surfaces
   • Structural features not painted on (e.g., hatches, antenna mounts)
   • Scuffed or dented areas for weathered look
3. Convert and Package
   • Final map exported in DDS format (DXT5 with alpha)
   • Ready to drop into the texture folder alongside your _t.dds file

---

Requirements from You (or I can extract):​

• The base _t.dds file (your main texture)
• Preferably, a high-contrast template of panel lines/rivets if available
• The name of the aircraft folder and confirmation it's AnKor shader-ready

---

Example Workflow:​

If you're working on a Bf 110G-4 of NJG 1, and I have the texture:

• I generate a _n.dds using your existing _t.dds as a base
• I sharpen panel lines, give rivets 3D pop, and simulate fabric where appropriate
• You test it in-sim under moonlight/night light and refine contrast as needed

 

[mongoose]

All RAF Squadrons Involved in a Night Combat Mission​

Depending on your focus, that can include:

• Bomber Command squadrons in a given raid (e.g., 100 Sqn, 101 Sqn, 156 Pathfinders, etc.)
• Aircraft types, codes, bases, and ORB data
• Routing and timing if known
• Sources: Bomber Command Losses (Chorley), ORBs from National Archives, RAFWeb, etc.

---

All Luftwaffe Nachtjagd (NJ) Units Active for a Date/Mission​

This can include:

• NJG units (e.g., NJG 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, etc.)
• Airfields (Fliegerhorste) they operated from on a given date
• Aircraft types (e.g., Ju 88 C-6, Bf 110 G-4, He 219)
• Radar or beacon support (via Gyges and NJ maps)
• Known claims and loss records
• Sources: The Other Battle, Luftwaffe War Diaries, ww2.dk, gyges.dk, and Nachtjagd War Diaries (Boiten)

 

[mongoose]

ChatGPT Capabilities - What I Can and Cannot Do (CFS3 Context)
WHAT I CAN DO:
==============
1. FILE SUPPORT
- Analyze and correct CFS3 mission .xml files
- Parse and edit .xdp, .mos, .mdl, .csv, .gsl-related text formats
- Generate weather .xml files for specific mission scenarios using real historical data
2. MISSION DESIGN
- Help structure and troubleshoot CFS3 missions
- Build templated missions based on RAF or Luftwaffe ops
- Create AI flight formations and assign behavior
- Guide facility integration and GSL logic
3. CFS3 TECHNICAL SUPPORT
- Assist with Gmax project setup for CFS3 development
- Explain usage of MakeMDL, SDKs, ModelConverterX
- Guide installation of mods, gamepacks, and mission packs
- Recommend tools and provide download source links
4. DATA AND HISTORICAL CONTEXT
- Provide unit histories, raid data, aircraft info
Page 1Gmax 1.2 and CFS3 Development Summary
- Access historical weather data (Europe 1940-45)
- Help build historically accurate missions (target, base, unit, payload)
5. DOCUMENTATION
- Produce technical summaries, formatted PDFs, guides
- Create reference tables from raw mission or ORB logs
6. COLLABORATION
- Work iteratively: you build/test in-game, I refine based on your feedback
- Help manage your project structure, version notes, or readme creation
WHAT I CANNOT DO:
=================
1. RUN CFS3 or any EXE
- I cannot execute CFS3 or any Windows-based program or flight sim
2. RENDER 3D MODELS
- I cannot operate Gmax or 3D modeling tools directly
- I can't view or manipulate .gmax or .m3d files graphically
3. INTERACT IN-GAME
- I can't fly missions, test gameplay mechanics, or adjust settings in a live sim environment
4. EXPORT MODELS
Page 2Gmax 1.2 and CFS3 Development Summary
- I cannot export or compile .mdl or .m3d files from source (like MakeMDL does)
5. SEARCH THE WEB FREELY
- I only access the internet when you explicitly request it (e.g., for current content from a link)
However, I *can* simulate the logic, correct formats, and help you build accurate files - provided you test
them in your CFS3 install.

 

[gecko]

Fascinating. It could really speed up research for large projects too! I'm going to need to try this out.

 

[65olschool]

just to reiterate.... wow
Is this something you install on your computer or is it web based ?

 

[mongoose]

Web based. just go to ChatGPT for basic free version

 

[sixstrings5859]

Will do after my hospital stay. Could be a week or two. Thanks Mongoose !

 

[sixstrings5859]

Now to get pt 1 installed. Will do ASAP ! Excited !

 

[gecko]

I have just made an attempt at having it do some research for me. Unfortunately, it seemed to make things up in the absence of being able to find a real answer. Even asking it to recheck it's work did not help it find the right answer. It definitely could be a tool for gathering information quickly, but you can't use it reliably for any topic that you don't know more about than it does.

 

[mongoose]

Tell me your questions as I have generally good replies, For instance now working on Nuremberg missions and the jet stream,

Case Study: Nuremberg Raid (30–31 March 1944)​

Historical Impact:​

• One of the costliest missions for RAF Bomber Command: 95 aircraft lost, 545 aircrew killed.
• Strong headwinds (estimates of 100+ mph at 20,000 ft) slowed the bomber stream.
• Bombers were badly spread out, arriving late over defenses — making them easy targets for Nachtjagd.
• Wind drift and forecast error meant many crews bombed the wrong city (some over Schweinfurt, others near Würzburg).
• Navigation and ETA predictions were badly skewed.

✈ Mission Performance Factors:​

Factor	Effect
Headwind of ~100 mph	Slowed stream, disrupted cohesion
Delayed ETA	Fighters were in position ahead of time
Forecast mismatch	Crews expected lighter winds
No onboard drift calc	Navigators had to correct manually
Ground Speed (GAS) drop	Meant longer exposure over hostile zones

---

Modern Insights:​

• Meteorologists now attribute the disaster to strong westerly jet stream winds.
• These were unaccounted for in pre-mission planning.
• Wind speeds were estimated postwar from flight logs and radar.

---

Navigation Lessons:​

• WWII-era navigators used drift sights, star shots, and radar returns (H2S) — none perfect.
• Drift angle was often estimated by visual means or via dead reckoning.
• GAS was hard to determine precisely; many crews underestimated wind effects.

---

Would you like:

• A table of wind speeds from Met Office forecasts for specific 1943–44 missions?
• Mission logs or ORB excerpts from 100 Sqn or other units?
• A visual diagram showing how jet stream drift pushed bombers off track?

You said:​

I will be working on the Nuremburg missions in due course, but am interested in our ability to make weather files incorporating the Jetstream, not only what the Met Office actually knew about that, but what effects we have discovered through the actual missions. Is that sort of possible?

ChatGPT said:​

Updated saved memory
Yes, James — it is possible to simulate some aspects of jet stream effects in CFS3, even though the sim doesn't directly model upper-atmosphere wind layers dynamically. Here’s how we can approach it:

1. Mission Historical Context​

The Nuremberg raid of 30–31 March 1944 was notably affected by an unexpected strong jet stream (~100–150 mph from the NW). It:

• Blew bombers off course.
• Delayed timing, ruining coordinated diversions.
• Exposed formations to heavy flak and night fighter interception.

2. What the Met Office Knew​

• In 1944, the jet stream wasn’t fully understood, though high-altitude winds were observed.
• Pilots and navigators noticed groundspeed discrepancies.
• Reports like “unexpected headwinds aloft” were common, but not well integrated into forecasts.

3. Simulating Jetstream in CFS3 Weather Files​

While CFS3 weather files don’t support layered wind simulation, we can emulate jetstream effects by:

Editing Wind Speed in .xml Weather Files​

• Use higher wind speeds (e.g., 90–130 knots) from NW or WNW.
• Combine with thicker cloud layers to simulate visual disorientation.
• Offset wind direction to subtly nudge aircraft off-track over long distances.

Enhancing Mission Design​

• Plan bomber routing that compensates for drift (as was tried in real life).
• Simulate early or late arrivals by adjusting waypoint ETAs in MB.
• Test how AI bombers or NJ fighters behave under these conditions.

Gauge or Add-on Use​

• Use Ted’s ILS gauge, or radar tools like AI_Radar or AI_Waypoints, to simulate real navigation fixes under drift.

Would you like help drafting a specific weather file to test this jetstream effect — perhaps based on the 30–31 March 1944 Nuremberg mission?

Don't forget that it can't PLAY CFS3, so you do have to work together. especially on missions and other xml formats; I give exanples, as it is learnig as well.

​

 

[gecko]

I asked for a list of all RAF units that were stationed on Malta between 1940 and 1942, including the types (including variants) of all aircraft they flew with the dates they were in service, their COs and dates of command, and the specific bases on Malta they were stationed at, with dates. Even though this information is pretty readily available and I was just hoping to get it all in one place, I found it to be missing information and full of errors.