Does anyone fly the Alpha RA-5C Vigilante?

Hi Tim

Really looking forward to release of your RA-5C package. As I am greedy like my namesake would it be possible to add the differential tailerons for roll control? I see the Alphasim has the slot through the wing for roll control but no "wagging" tailerons like on the Kazunori Ito A5-A.

Thanks

Mike
 
The wagging tail on Ito's A-5A and on Missimo's RA-5C are incorrect. Neither aircraft used the tail planes for roll control. The tail planes did have a minor amount of assymetrical movement for roll trim....but not enough to be used for roll control. The following was copied from:

http://www.joebaugher.com/usattack/newa5_1.html

[SIZE=+1] The horizontal tailplanes were of the all-flying variety and were hinged at a single pivot on each side of the extreme rear fuselage. The horizontal tail could perform a limited amount of asymmetrical deflection for roll trim, but could not actually provide roll control, which was the responsibility of the wing spoilers. [/SIZE]
 
Thanks for that information Tim. It seemws to be a common misconception about the A-5 roll control, I have read other articles on line which do state the tailplanes aided roll control. I also thought that a in magazine article by a Vigilante pilot had said that on approach the engine note was constantly altering as the auto throttle did its job and the tail surfaces were moving seperately to keep a good line up. Still looking forward to release of your package.

Mike
 
This upload will include: Tweaked MDL file with added specular shine, full panel configuration (2D and VC, lots of useful pop up windows) and gauges, nice effects that are gauge controlled (engine glow, after burner, wing vortex thingies), new paints and possibly a sound package.
Click to expand...

OBIO, just wanted to say hats off to you for another one of your great rework-updates - it's this kind of thing that makes FS fun, a real hobby and not just a game - you are one of the most value-adding contributors here and the enjoyment you bring all of us through your dedication is very much apperciated.

Can't wait to fly your overhauled, kick-ass Vig!

expat
 
Nice to see the old girl geting more air time.

Two things worry me, one, the need to add specular shine, the orignal should already have it, two, the dark polys from mesh smooth, with respect I dont ever have any of these on a finished model, never ever, I hate them and hunt them with a passion, I'd like to see a screen shot of these polys if possible, my gut feeling is they'll be around the intake areas, if I recall correctly this was a real bear and a limitation at source. I think I still have the orginal Gmax source files somewhere, and being as the model is now freeware I cannot see any reason why the source files cannot go to the community if any one wants to mess with them and improve them. In fact I may already have uploaded them in the last big clean out I did, they were all posted here at SoH at one time.

The only proviso is that its not used as a serious up grade for FSx, that would under mine current projects to say the least :).

Just checked the source files, there were three revisions, one to fix the landing light cones and one to add specular shine and the last to fix the nose wheel steering, the *.mdl stamp should be 4th Mar 2005
 
Michael

The version I downloaded from the Alphasim freeware page was dated 2005, so it is the most updated version. The model was totally void of specular shine. When I opened the file in Martin Wright's MDLmat, the material used for the exterior of the plane (which was white) had specular settings of 0, 0, 0...meaning no shine at all. I changed that to 90, 90, 90....slightly less than halfway through the specular range (255, 255, 255 being max specular shine).

Will grab some screen shots of the plane from various angles to illustrate the dark areas....the most prominent being about 1/2 was back along the top of the engine bays, right where the engine bays meet the wings.

I wish I knew how to use Gmax or FSDS.....I have the source code for the F-4 E and N models and the F-8 C model I do believe and one of the A-4 models. Would love to be able to upgrade these models a bit...especially for CFS2 by making them multi-LOD. There is a Vietnam War project underway and the one big snag is the lack of multi-LOD Vietnam era aircraft. I pulled the F-4 source into FSDS and spent 3 days staring at it...hoping that I would suddenly develop paranormal mental powers and could use brain waves to get the all the parts renamed, reanimated, multi-LODed, shined and exported. I did manage to export the plane with shine, but not with mental powers....just sheer dumb luck.

Tim
 
OBIO said:
Michael

The version I downloaded from the Alphasim freeware page was dated 2005, so it is the most updated version. The model was totally void of specular shine. When I opened the file in Martin Wright's MDLmat, the material used for the exterior of the plane (which was white) had specular settings of 0, 0, 0...meaning no shine at all. I changed that to 90, 90, 90....slightly less than halfway through the specular range (255, 255, 255 being max specular shine).

Will grab some screen shots of the plane from various angles to illustrate the dark areas....the most prominent being about 1/2 was back along the top of the engine bays, right where the engine bays meet the wings.

I wish I knew how to use Gmax or FSDS.....I have the source code for the F-4 E and N models and the F-8 C model I do believe and one of the A-4 models. Would love to be able to upgrade these models a bit...especially for CFS2 by making them multi-LOD. There is a Vietnam War project underway and the one big snag is the lack of multi-LOD Vietnam era aircraft. I pulled the F-4 source into FSDS and spent 3 days staring at it...hoping that I would suddenly develop paranormal mental powers and could use brain waves to get the all the parts renamed, reanimated, multi-LODed, shined and exported. I did manage to export the plane with shine, but not with mental powers....just sheer dumb luck.

Tim
Click to expand...


Hmm interesting, if you have to add shine you have an old model, just check to see if you have landing light cones on the ground and that the nose wheel steers ?.

The correct RGB for Gull grey is 181, 182, 176 Insignia white isn't pure white its 255, 253, 250

Polys, ahh yes I know the area, its where the wing blends with the engine casing, didn't know it shew up in the sim, didn't show up here, I can only apologise for that remission. (note to self....pay more attention next time !!)

Hope that helps
 
Michael

The model I have does have the landing light cone and the nose gear does swivel during turns.

Tim
 
OK I think I've taken this as far as I can. There is still the fact that the pitch axis seems to be behind the tail (air file?). I don't know what limits or effects this places on just CFG alterations. I couldn't do much about the initial tendency to climb on first load and take off but once trimmed at cruise speed there is not much trimming beyond that. To achieve Mach 2, very low power settings needed for subsonic or pattern flying. If this is too far off the mark let me know but my hands may be too tied to go much further.

//5:53 PM 3/9/2005 Version 2.1 for FS9
[fltsim.0]
title=ALPHA RA-5C Vigilante
sim=RA-5C
model=
panel=
sound=
texture=
KB_checklists=vigilante_check
kb_reference=
ui_manufacturer=North American
ui_type=RA-5C Vigilante
ui_variation=USS Ranger
atc_id_color=0x00000000
visual_damage=1
atc_parking_types=MIL_COMBAT
description=© ALPHA Simulations 2005\n\nNorth American RA-5C Vigilante\n\nPlanned in late 1950's as a successor to the AJ-1 Savage, the Vigilante prototype first flew in 1958 and was decades ahead of its time, with many 'firsts' such as a digital computer, INS, slab tail and variable inlets and much more. Although conceived as a bomber, the USAF soon adopted the nuclear strike role which meant the A-5 was used solely for the recon role. The RA-5C was used in Vietnam (18 were lost) and continued in service until 1980.
atc_heavy=0
atc_id=
atc_airline=
atc_flight_number=
atc_id_font=Verdana,-11,1,600,0

[General]
performance=Model: M Davies\nPanel: P Perrott\nTextures: M Davies\nFlight Model: J McDaniel\n\nLength: 76 ft 0 in\nSpan: 53 ft 0.4 in\nWing area: 754 sq ft\nWeight: Empty: 43,608 lbs\s loaded, 68,088 lbs.\nPower: (2) GE J79-GE-10 Turbojet, 17,860 lbs thrust with afterburners\nRange: 3,000 miles\nMax Speed: Mach 2.1 @ 36,000 ft\nService Ceiling: 48,400 ft.\nArmament: None
editable=1
atc_type=
atc_model=

[weight_and_balance]
max_gross_weight = 68088.00
empty_weight = 43608.00
reference_datum_position = 0.00, 0.00, 0.00
empty_weight_CG_position = 0.00, 0.00, 0.00
empty_weight_pitch_MOI = 282817.00
empty_weight_roll_MOI = 207250.00
empty_weight_yaw_MOI = 145928.00
empty_weight_coupled_MOI = 1000.00
CG_forward_limit = 0.00
CG_aft_limit = 1.00
max_number_of_stations = 2
station_load.0 =200.00, 0.00, 0.00, 0.81, Station 1
station_load.1 =200.00, 0.00, 0.00, 1.52, Station 2

[smokesystem]
smoke.0 = -0.70, -30.00,-3.00, fx_smoke_f6
smoke.1 = -0.70, -30.00, 3.00, fx_smoke_f6


[GeneralEngineData]
//0=Piston, 1=Jet, 2=None, 3=Helo-Turbine, 4=Rocket, 5=Turboprop
engine_type = 1
fuel_flow_scalar = 0.60
min_throttle_limit = 0.00
engine.0 = -23.30, -3.10, 0.15
engine.1 = -23.30, 3.10, 0.15

[TurbineEngineData]
fuel_flow_gain= 0.002
inlet_area= 13.40
rated_N2_rpm= 29920.00
static_thrust= 27260.00
afterburner_available= 1
reverser_available= 1.00

[Reference Speeds]
flaps_up_stall_speed= 123.00
full_flaps_stall_speed= 93.00
cruise_speed= 800.00
max_indicated_speed=1600.00
max_mach=2.50

[effects]
windshield_rain_effect_available = 1

[fuel]
//Longitudinal (feet), Lateral (feet), Vertical (feet), Usable(gallons), Unusable (gallons)
fuel_type = 2
number_of_tank_selectors = 1
electric_pump = 0
//Simple flight model
Center1 = 0.00, 0.00, 0.00, 460.00, 0.00
Center2 = 0.00, 0.00, 0.00, 500.00, 0.00
Center3 = 0.00, 0.00, 0.00, 130.00, 0.00
LeftMain = 0.00,-9.00, 0.00, 830.00, 0.00
RightMain = 0.00, 9.00, 0.00, 830.00, 0.00
RightAux = 0.00, 0.00, 0.00, 295.00, 0.00
//External1 = 0.00, 0.00, 0.00, 295.00, 0.00
//External2 = 0.00, 0.00, 0.00, 295.00, 0.00

[contact_points]
//0 Class
//1 Longitudinal Position (feet)
//2 Lateral Position (feet)
//3 Vertical Position (feet)
//4 Impact Damage Threshold (Feet Per Minute)
//5 Brake Map (0=None, 1=Left, 2=Right)
//6 Wheel Radius (feet)
//7 Steer Angle (degrees)
//8 Static Compression (feet) (0 if rigid,higher=free bounce)
//9 Max/Static Compression Ratio
//10 Damping Ratio (0=Undamped, 1=Critically Damped)
//11 Extension Time (seconds)
//12 Retraction Time (seconds)
//13 Sound Type

static_pitch = 1.220
static_cg_height = 7.620
tailwheel_lock = 0
gear_system_type = 1

point.0 = 1, 17.20, 0.00, -8.40, 2000.00, 0.00, 1.10, 38.00, 0.40, 2.00, 0.73, 5.00, 5.00, 0.00, 300.00, 325.00

point.1 = 1, -3.00, -5.90, -7.78, 3000.00, 1.00, 1.50, 0.00, 0.60, 2.50, 0.70, 5.00, 5.00, 2.00, 300.00, 325.00

point.2 = 1, -3.00, 5.90, -7.78, 3000.00, 2.00, 1.50, 0.00, 0.60, 2.50, 0.70, 5.00, 5.00, 3.00, 300.00, 325.00

point.3 = 2, -11.80, -26.520, 1.220, 1500.00, 0.00, 0.00, 0.00, 0.00, 0.00, 0.00, 0.00, 0.00, 5.00, 0.00, 0.00
point.4 = 2, -11.80, 26.520, 1.220, 1500.00, 0.00, 0.00, 0.00, 0.00, 0.00, 0.00, 0.00, 0.00, 6.00, 0.00, 0.00
point.5 = 2, -26.584, 0.00, -2.497, 1500.00, 0.00, 0.00, 0.00, 0.00, 0.00, 0.00, 0.00, 0.00, 9.00, 0.00, 0.00
point.6 = 2, 40.439, 0.00, -2.069, 1500.00, 0.00, 0.00, 0.00, 0.00, 0.00, 0.00, 0.00, 0.00, 4.00, 0.00, 0.00

[lights]
//Types: 1=beacon, 2=strobe, 3=navigation, 4=cockpit, 5=landing
light.0 = 4, 29.60, 0, 1.28, fx_vclight
light.1= 4, 23.42, 0, 2.09, fx_vclight
light.2= 1, -9.5, 0, 2.20, fx_beaconh
light.3= 1, -7.70, 0, -3.80, fx_beaconh
//afterburner effects
light.11= 6, -24.7, -3.0, -1.30, fx_F14_Burn1 , // Eng1 Afterburner Burn1
light.12= 6, -24.7, -3.0, -1.30, fx_F14_Burn2 , // Eng1 Afterburner Burn2
light.13= 6, -28.3, -3.0, -0.70, fx_F14_Burnerflame , // Eng1 Afterburner Flame
light.14= 7, -24.7, 3.0, -1.30, fx_F14_Burn1 , // Eng2 Afterburner Burn1
light.15= 7, -24.7, 3.0, -1.30, fx_F14_Burn2 , // Eng2 Afterburner Burn2
light.16= 7, -28.3, 3.0, -0.70, fx_F14_Burnerflame , // Eng2 Afterburner Flame
light.17= 6, -25.0, -3.0, -0.70, fx_F14_Blueflame , // Eng1 Blueflame,
light.18= 7, -25.0, 3.0, -0.70, fx_F14_Blueflame , // Eng2 Blueflame,


[keyboard_response]
elevator = 150.00, 250.00
aileron = 150.00, 250.00
rudder = 150.00, 250.00

[forcefeedback]
gear_bump_nose_magnitude = 1000
gear_bump_nose_direction = 18000
gear_bump_nose_duration = 250000
gear_bump_left_magnitude = 2000
gear_bump_left_direction = 35500
gear_bump_left_duration = 250000
gear_bump_right_magnitude = 2000
gear_bump_right_direction = 500
gear_bump_right_duration = 250000
ground_bumps_magnitude1 = 1250
ground_bumps_angle1 = 8900
ground_bumps_intercept1 = 5
ground_bumps_slope1 = 0.48
ground_bumps_magnitude2 = 450
ground_bumps_angle2 = 9100
ground_bumps_intercept2 = 0.075
ground_bumps_slope2 = 1
crash_magnitude1 = 2000
crash_direction1 = 1000
crash_magnitude2 = 2000
crash_direction2 = 9000
crash_period2 = 7500
crash_duration2 = 2500000
stick_shaker_magnitude = 2000
stick_shaker_direction = 0
stick_shaker_period = 111111

[airplane_geometry]
wing_area = 754.00
wing_span = 50.210
wing_root_chord = 1.40
wing_dihedral = 2.00
wing_incidence = 0.00
wing_twist = 0.00
oswald_efficiency_factor = 0.880
wing_winglets_flag = 0
wing_sweep = 43.00
wing_pos_apex_lon = 10.00
wing_pos_apex_vert = 1.50
htail_area = 116.00
htail_span = 32.20
htail_pos_lon = -12.70
htail_pos_vert = -0.30
htail_incidence = -0.50
htail_sweep = 50.00
vtail_area = 50.00
vtail_span = 13.20
vtail_sweep = 50.00
vtail_pos_lon = -13.40
vtail_pos_vert = 1.50
elevator_area = 77.00
aileron_area = 25.00
rudder_area = 40.00
elevator_up_limit = 16.00
elevator_down_limit = 11.00
aileron_up_limit = 15.00
aileron_down_limit = 15.00
rudder_limit = 8.00
elevator_trim_limit = 18.00
spoiler_limit = 16.00
aileron_to_spoileron_gain = 0.00
spoiler_handle_available = 1
min_ailerons_for_spoilerons = 0.00
min_flaps_for_spoilerons = 0.00
spoilerons_available = 0

[electrical]
max_battery_voltage = 24
generator_alternator_voltage = 28
max_generator_alternator_amps = 300
engine_generator_map = 1,1
electric_always_available = 1

[TailHook]
tailhook_length=6.5
tailhook_position=-18.35, 0.0, -1.0
cable_force_adjust=1.0

[folding_wings]
wing_fold_system_type=4
fold_rates=0.12,0.11

[exits]
number_of_exits=1
exit_rate.0=0.7

[Views]
eyepoint=29.5,0.0,2.2

[autopilot]
autopilot_available=1
flight_director_available=1
default_vertical_speed=1800.00
autothrottle_available=1
autothrottle_arming_required=0
autothrottle_takeoff_ga=0
autothrottle_max_rpm=125.00
pitch_takeoff_ga=8.00
max_pitch=10.00
max_pitch_acceleration=2.00
max_pitch_velocity_lo_alt=1.00
max_pitch_velocity_hi_alt=1.50
max_pitch_velocity_lo_alt_breakpoint=20000.00
max_pitch_velocity_hi_alt_breakpoint=28000.00
max_bank=25.00
max_bank_acceleration=1.80
max_bank_velocity=3.00
max_throttle_rate=0.10
nav_proportional_control=9.00
nav_integrator_control=0.250
nav_derivative_control=0.00
nav_integrator_boundary=2.50
nav_derivative_boundary=0.00
gs_proportional_control=9.520
gs_integrator_control=0.260
gs_derivative_control=0.00
gs_integrator_boundary=0.70
gs_derivative_boundary=0.00
yaw_damper_gain=0.00
[direction_indicators]
direction_indicator.0=3,0

[brakes]
toe_brakes_scale=0.80031
parking_brake=1

[gear_warning_system]
gear_warning_available=1
pct_throttle_limit=1
flap_limit_power=25
flap_limit_idle=5

[hydraulic_system]
electric_pumps=1
engine_map=1,1,0,0
normal_pressure=3000.00

[stall_warning]
type=1

[attitude_indicators]
attitude_indicator.0=1
[turn_indicators]
turn_indicator.0=1,0

[General]
atc_type=
atc_model=
performance=
editable=1

[jet_engine]
thrust_scalar=0.700

[flight_tuning]
cruise_lift_scalar=0.71
pitch_stability=1.35
roll_stability=1.10
yaw_stability=1.00
parasite_drag_scalar=1.13
induced_drag_scalar=1.11
elevator_effectiveness=0.42
aileron_effectiveness=0.30
rudder_effectiveness=0.75
elevator_trim_effectiveness=1.00
aileron_trim_effectiveness=1.00
rudder_trim_effectiveness=1.00

[Flaps.0]
type= 1
span-outboard= 0.650
extending-time= 7.00
system_type= 1
damaging-speed= 230.00
blowout-speed= 250.00
lift_scalar= 1.20
drag_scalar= 0.40
pitch_scalar= 0.00
flaps-position.0= 0.00, 0.00
flaps-position.1= 20.00, 0.00
flaps-position.2= 40.00, 0.00
flaps-position.3= 60.00, 0.00
flaps-position.4= 70.00, 0.00
flaps-position.5= 80.00, 0.00

[Flaps.1]
type= 2
span-outboard= 0.650
extending-time= 7.00
system_type= 1
damaging-speed= 230.00
blowout-speed= 250.00
lift_scalar= 0.30
drag_scalar= 0.90
pitch_scalar= 4.00
flaps-position.0= 0.00, 0.00
flaps-position.1= 1.00, 0.00
flaps-position.2= 15.00, 0.00
flaps-position.3= 30.00, 0.00
flaps-position.4= 50.00, 0.00
flaps-position.5= 80.00, 0.00
 
The 5th skin is in the bag. I need to make some adjustments here and there to color and lettering...nothing major...to each of the skins. Maybe an hour worth of tweaking and saving. This project is just about ready to zip up and upload. Will also upload a copy of my paint template for the RA-5C for those who want to take their crayons and markers to the bird.

Right now, got to get going...have to pick up a couple of prescriptions, pay the cable bill and take the Brutus, our Chihuahua/Jack Russell mix to the vet for his annual boosters and wellness check up (good bye 80 bucks!).

OBIO
 
Had the pleasure of treating a gent last week who, in the course of conversation, I learned was in the Navy. "What part?", I asked. "I was a pilot", he said. "What did you fly?". "A5". "Oh, the Vigalante". His eyes lost the dullness of persistent fatigue and illness as he lifted his head to stare at me. Then he showed me the coolest grin/smile with a twinkle in the eyes that at once conveyed surprise that I knew the aircraft, and that he was a hot-shot Navy aviator and damn proud of it. I think I made his day. He sure made mine.
 
I love testing my mettle in the Vigi. Between it and the F7U Cutlass, AS have made two of the hardest naval a/c to land!

WH
 
The RA-5C Restoration package is now in the download library. 5 new skins, well developed 2D and VC panels with plenty of pop up windows, gauge driven effects.

OBIO
 
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