FS9 Only Douglas A20 Havoc Released

Milton Shupe said:
That looks good Mick. Happy that you got something that satisfies the mind. :wavey:
Click to expand...

It was easier than I expected. All I had to do was change the proportions of the gauges. I thought doing that would require some resizing or at least slight movement on the panel, but no, none of that at all.

I made the rudder and elevator trim wheels a little bigger, just from personal preference, but mainly it was just a matter of rounding out the gauges.

I'm very curious to see if anyone else needs this. So far, nobody, but it's early yet. I wonder, though, if MrZippy and I are the only ones left with standard aspect ratio monitors. Maybe we're about to find out!
 
Lycra panel

Noticed this prob as soon as I loaded up the official release of the Havoc. As I had just bought and set up a new monitor I thought it was a result of the change. As the 2D panel acts like a window on my monitor, I merely stretched it by the bottom right corner to fit my screen. Remarkably, the instruments maintained the correct circularity in the new 'stretched' panel. This is the first time I have experienced a 2D panel acting like this. Very commendable to produce a scale changing panel to match any configuration or size.

The above performance is obviously at odds with what others are experiencing, but from my point of view (no pun intended), apart from having to expand the 2D panel the first time I open it, all is excellent.

On the heels of Milton's trials bringing this a/c to our screens, I was hardly going to mention this slight niggle. After all - who really knows how one's work appears on the host of monitors and standards now running good old FS9?

As it appears as an unintended effect to others, I thought best to mention my experiences with it. My current resolution on my AGON monitor is 2560x1440 (native).

Lovely a/c as normal Milt! Many thanks.

Mal
 
2D panel

Mick,
The photo I used is from a site where you can zoom the panel from near to far.
I zoomed it that the point of view was just a little bit bhind of the center of the seat.
There where from my own flying experiance the pilot eyes should be.
When I downloaded the aircraft with the original panel and than used used the vc I had the same impression as if in a car the seat is completly advanced and my teeth will hit the steering wheel.
In the rare cases I use VC's when flying I have to scroll back the view point.
My steam powered pc and monitor lives with a resolution of 1440 X 900.
With that I try that I can read the gauges, even that I'm now 61 and my eyes are realy no longer the best..
Ok that is my personal impression.
Also I have learned not so much looking at the values of a gauge when flying but watching where the needle of a gauge should be depending the flying conditions.
I must say that old Luftwaffe and Marineflieger Had a completely other method of flying.
That remebers me Erich Hartmann when later after war he had to learn to fly on us jets on US methods.
He pested "do you really believe that in a war case we have time to read this damned checklists?"
He never used them as recommanded and was still a good pilot in modern jets.
Allright, as I did say in an other thread for me the chapter is ended. I did not hit what the people wanted or waited for.
So sei es Gott
Ich stehe hier und kann nicht anders (Martin Luther)
Yours
Papi
 
Papi, I wrote a note to you in the other thread so I won't repeat it here. You youngsters have far better screen vision than I do. (Only 61 - how I wish I could still feel [and see!] like I did when I was only 61!) Like you, I pay more attention to the needles than the actual numbers. But when I tried your panel, the instruments were so small that I couldn't even see the needles, and I couldn't tell which instruments were which.

In the olden days, and perhaps still now (I haven't been around real airplanes since the early 1980s) instruments were often mounted on panels at such an angle that the needle pointed straight up when in the middle of the normal range, no matter what angle that put the numbers at. I don't think it's possible to do that in FS; the gauge would have to be designed that way from the start.

Your comments about Bubi Hartmann's remarks reminds me, I once read that the pilots US Air Force Thunderbirds (or was it the Navy's Blue Angels, or both) didn't use checklists, or preflight their planes. They left it to the ground crews to do the preflight and check everything on all the lists, and have the planes set up all ready for the pilots to just get in, start the engines and fly. I don't know if that was true, or if it is still true, but it sounds plausible. It would seem that in service, especially when a unit is on alert for quick response, they must do it that way. Otherwise a "quick reaction" couldn't be very quick, it would seem.
 
vonernsk said:
Noticed this prob as soon as I loaded up the official release of the Havoc. As I had just bought and set up a new monitor I thought it was a result of the change. As the 2D panel acts like a window on my monitor, I merely stretched it by the bottom right corner to fit my screen. Remarkably, the instruments maintained the correct circularity in the new 'stretched' panel. This is the first time I have experienced a 2D panel acting like this. Very commendable to produce a scale changing panel to match any configuration or size...
Click to expand...

Mal, is your panel 6x8 or wide angle?

It sounds like it must be wide angle, or the gauges would distort. Since they don't, your screen must have the same aspect ratio that the panel was made for, wide screen.

I have an idea, and if I'm right, the situation is due to you having such a high screen resolution, and the fix should be simple in concept, even if somewhat tedious in execution.

In the [Window 00} section there is this line: size_mm=1920,1080

Fiddling with those numbers might get the panel to fill your screen. Since the size seems to be expressed in millimeters (not pixels, anyway) and screen resolution is expressed in pixels, it's not just a matter of substituting one figure for another, but some experimentation should get you to where you want to be. Just have your calculator at hand so you can make the changes to both figures proportional. I edited that line in my personal A-20 panel to make the checklist bigger so I could read it easily, so it should work the same way with the main panel.

Before you get to work you might do a quick experiment to see if the same small panel effect happens with other aircraft. If so, my hypothesis must be right. If not, then I'm wrong.
 
Mick,

I took the easy solution and amended the panel.cfg as shown by mrzippy in their last posts. Just hashed out the 'window_size_ratio=' line and inserted my current pixel size as a new last line ie 'pixel_size=2560x1440'. All AOK now and all gauges round.

To answer your question, no I did not have a repeat of the original effect ie start state was a half-size panel which could be expanded to full size with no distortion of the gauges from their original round shapes.

Rgds
Mal
 
FS9 Only Douglas A20 Havoc Released 2D panel

Hallo Mick,
hmm hmm hmm
I understand 100 percent your point of view
now the big question for me : how to get the real feeling to be in the cockpit and not in front of a panel?
The reason also why I prefer to use photos is to reproduce the feeling to be INTO the cockpit with alle the problems of deepness and with that little gauges.
Surely the size of the monitor plays a role mine is a 22' screen running in 1440 X 900 resolution
So it would be interesting for me to know also from the other friends what will be the average monitors and in what resolution do they run.
I will have the same problem on my next cockpit for the OV10 Bronco.
To have the roomy felling the pilot had on the real plane and also with that all the gauges and switches "by the hand" with avoiding these damned pop ups. Or loosing the felling to get better readable gauges
Hmmm I have an idea: what about the main gauges beeing as a transparent overhead line which could be switched on or off, and off course in a good readable size?
Yours
Papi
 
michaelvader said:
Hallo Mick,
hmm hmm hmm
I understand 100 percent your point of view
now the big question for me : how to get the real feeling to be in the cockpit and not in front of a panel?
The reason also why I prefer to use photos is to reproduce the feeling to be INTO the cockpit with alle the problems of deepness and with that little gauges.
Surely the size of the monitor plays a role mine is a 22' screen running in 1440 X 900 resolution
So it would be interesting for me to know also from the other friends what will be the average monitors and in what resolution do they run.
I will have the same problem on my next cockpit for the OV10 Bronco.
To have the roomy felling the pilot had on the real plane and also with that all the gauges and switches "by the hand" with avoiding these damned pop ups. Or loosing the felling to get better readable gauges
Hmmm I have an idea: what about the main gauges being as a transparent overhead line which could be switched on or off, and off course in a good readable size?
Yours
Papi
Click to expand...

Hallo Papi,

I can see why you can read the instruments on your monitor while I can't on mine! Size matters!

I have a 17" screen at 1280x1024, so there's a big difference. I would guess that in the present time, there are more monitors like yours than there are like mine. I bought mine seven or eight years ago and even then I had to really search for a 17" 6x8 screen; already they were almost all larger as well as being mostly wide screen.

As for feeling like being inside the plane, that's what the VC is for. I use it most of the time, and just go to the 2D panel to see the instruments directly without having to alter my eye line in the VC. Of course, not all planes have a good VC, but the ones I fly usually do. If a model lacks a VC, or has one that isn't very good, I spend more time in the 2D panel view. If a plane I like doesn't have a VC at all, I will often make the external model visible in VC view and adjust the eyepoint to make a non-dynamic "pseudo" VC. (Thanks to Norm for teaching me how to do that!)

I must confess - I often fly with that line of flight information at the top of the screen. I know it's "cheating" but I do very little flying, and due to my lack of practice, I need all the help I can get!
 
Hallo Mick,
your problem is now a challenge forme
I said that the chapter will be closed for me - but at this week end I will have a look if I find a pratical solution for you and others who has the same problem. I' m not sure about if I find it.
I will see if my Idea with an overhead gauges line will be a pratical solution
So without changing the panel the primary and engine instruments informations will be visible on an overhead line, but could be switched away if you want
Yours
Papi
 
michaelvader said:
...So without changing the panel the primary and engine instruments informations will be visible on an overhead line, but could be switched away if you want
Yours
Papi
Click to expand...

Hallo Papi,

We already have that in FS9. Just key "Shift+Z" and there is is, easily toggled on or off.
 
ah yes.. the 'cut and paste' um.. paintkit!

Mick said:
Hey, I painted an A-20! My old wood-burning software can't open the paint kit, but I managed it anyway.

It's a little unusual, in that it has American Olive Drab upper surfaces and RAF Sky under surfaces, and aan RAF-style aircraft letter instead of USAAF-style squadron codes. It's from the 15th Bombardment Squadron, the first 8th Air Force unit to enter combat.

I used the base textures supplied with the model and borrowed the sky under surfaces from one of Steve's paints. Steve, I hope that's OK with you. (I don't suppose you'll mind, but I won't upload it until I get your answer.)

You can't see much of the undersides in the screenie, but you get the idea.
Click to expand...

Done this many times myself mate! Grab bits from several paints. modify and tweak the colours... when one wants something different.. and has NO paintkit... one 'adapts'!

I've developed an entire 'style' of repainting from a base all over 'something' (I prefer a light gray scheme) and then copying and pasting layers of this base after tinting and playing with the other tools in photoshop to get the desired colour and intensity. SOMETIMES, it actually looks better than one done with a paintkit.:jump:

And like you, I feel it is only right to get the original artists permission before making my new paint available to all.. and of course.. give credit!

Cheers
 
ag20grefl model for the FS2004 Havoc

Is there any chance of that happening, Milton? Hope this isn't an off-base question.
 
MrZippy said:
Is there any chance of that happening, Milton? Hope this isn't an off-base question.
Click to expand...

Yes, Ill look at it.

EDIT: The original model is already set up to handle reflective textures in FS9. The xxx_T.bmp suffix to all body parts is evidence of that.

I did have to add specular to each of them however.

Attached is the new model and cfg entry.

Now, all you need are paints. :)
 

Attachments

  • FS9 A20G Reflective.zip
    2.1 MB · Views: 0
Last edited:
Milton Shupe said:
Yes, Ill look at it.

EDIT: The original model is already set up to handle reflective textures in FS9. The xxx_T.bmp suffix to all body parts is evidence of that.

I did have to add specular to each of them however.

Attached is the new model and cfg entry.

Now, all you need are paints. :)
Click to expand...


Thanks Milton! Heck we aren't paying you enough! Take a raise outta petty cash!:ernaehrung004: I think it looks rather spiffy!

 
FS9 Only Douglas A20 Havoc Released "K" model

Hallo Milton,

would it be a difficulty or too much work to add a "K" nose to the "G" model.
Or is there a solution via the paint job?
For me the K would be interesting as it will be the last of the A20 in service for long years. The brazilians did put them out of service in late 50 ies if I had seen well.
I can not leave this bird, you have done a really nice bird
Thank you
Yours
Papi
 
michaelvader said:
Hallo Milton,

would it be a difficulty or too much work to add a "K" nose to the "G" model.
Or is there a solution via the paint job?
For me the K would be interesting as it will be the last of the A20 in service for long years. The brazilians did put them out of service in late 50 ies if I had seen well.
I can not leave this bird, you have done a really nice bird
Thank you
Yours
Papi
Click to expand...

Papi,

Yes, it would take a bit of work to get that done. The K was based on the J (which was based on the) G, but had more powerful 1700 HP engines like the H.
So, in addition to a longer nose and roomier bombardier interior, the flight model would not be correct for it, and the paint lit of course would not support it.
Furthermore, the load out selection sheet does not support it so selecting options would be a problem.

There is no way to do all the models; just too many of them, so I tried to select the more popular ones.

The project is closed now and I have moved on to other work, namely finishing out the Marauder and converting aircraft to FSX native.

As much as I wish I could accommodate your request, I am sorry that I cannot.
 
FS9 Only Douglas A20 Havoc Released "K" model

Hallo Milton,

thank you for your answer.
I understand your point of view - there is a moment where some one must say stop enough is enough.
What you gave us is still a masterpiece, and clear that we could not ask for every variant.
I will go search further more for the brazilian A20's I have seen one with the same paintsheme as the one I did but it had a "gun nose" might be a "G".
The bad thing is that the bird had a nose art a sort of red ensign but the photo is too poor to see clearly what it is. I will search to find out what this nose art is and than we can have a brazilian gun bird for our south american friends.
So long
Yours
Papi
 
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