Should I Switch to VR? August Answers Your Questions!

C:\ProgramData\Microsoft\FSX
C:\Users\{your name}\Documents\Flight Simulator X Files
C:\Users\{your name}\AppData\Local\Microsoft\FSX
C:\Users\{your name}\AppData\Roaming\Microsoft\FSX

I think these are all the locations of the FSX files if I remember correctly
 
Unfortunate news today for fans of the Reverb G2, apparently it is being discontinued and HP is getting out of the VR game.

I figured this was coming when MS laid off most of their VR/XR folks. I hope that Jorg's team is able to keep resources going into VR for MSFS given the company's sad lack of enthusiasm for the technology.

When I was at MS I hoped that Sony's VR push would finally get Phil and his team to embrace VR for the Xbox. Nope, at this point my guess is that MS will sit it out completely until Apple and Meta have a level of success where they feel they really need to play too. But by then, it might be like phones and too late for them.

Really hoping they at least keep a dev or two assigned to WMR maintenance given the amount of hardware out there. I have a big box of "deprecated" MS technology, from Sidewinder Gamevoice to Windows Media Center to Kinect to Zune...
 
Not sure what your problem could be, Jan. If you're getting the menus and stuff to look OK and only having trouble when you start a flight, I'd suspect a graphics setting issue. I assume you've checked the graphics settings and made sure everything looks OK. Be sure NOT to check the "DirectX 10 preview" box. DirectX 9 is a lot more stable and FlyInside requires it anyway.

August
 
The G2 is currently the best *affordable* VR headset for computers.
The Quest2 is behind (and requires a Meta account).
The Pico4 is not really optimized for computer use.
The PSVR2... well it seems Sony is afraid to be successful or to earn too much money, so they want to keep that for the PS5 only.
The other helmets are crazy expensive.
It's not a good time for VR, definitely :/
 
It's true. As the YouTuber I cited said, this leaves a big gap in the market between cheaper, lower quality units that aren't going to earn many VR converts, and much more expensive units that are a stretch for entry level. There is still a real question whether VR is the future or a fad. A couple of years ago I assumed it was the future, it was just too early for me to adopt. Now some pretty savvy companies seem to be placing their bets on it being a fad. And it's just at the time when the tech seems to be making units even better than the G2, at about the same price point, practical. Since there's not a technical dead end, it must be that these companies think VR isn't catching on with users. Like its inherent shortcomings will always make it a niche thing.

August
 
This morning before work I felt like flying something with 2 big engines in VR. The choices were a Mosquito in P3D or the P-38 in MSFS, and I elected to cruise around Istanbul in the P-38. All went well until I got her up to altitude and trimmed, then I got the dreaded "your graphics device has encountered an error" dialog and a CTD. This is the kind of annoyance which makes me often choose a different sim for VR flying.

Nevertheless, I persisted. After reboot I pulled up the graphics options to see what might reduce the GPU memory load, which I'm told is what causes this error. Nothing really came to mind. Then I thought about the "Off-Screen Terrain Pre-Cache" setting, which I had at Low on the theory that it would reduce GPU load. As with almost anything in MSFS settings, if you search this on the MS forum you see every possible advice from "Always set on Ultra unless you have a super low-end system" to "My computer is no potato but I get a slide show if I set to anything above Medium." Anyway, I decided to try Ultra.

The results were really good. Reloading the same P-38 flight out of Istanbul, there was less stuttering when looking around, which is the purpose of the pre-cache. You can see why that would be good for VR (or TrackiR) where you're looking around constantly and almost unconsciously. It did not seem to hurt frame rates at all. And, there was no GPU crash (although to be fair, those don't happen most flights). I had a lovely trip down the coast and greased the landing at Canakkale.

It is obvious from the MS forum that your mileage may vary on this, so this is only a suggestion, but if your pre-cache setting isn't dialed up, give it a try. I haven't seen anyone flat-out say that setting this to High or Ultra actually reduces GPU load and increases stability, but I figure it might; the whole point of it is to let your rig process the local scenery when it has the capacity, rather than force it in real time when you turn to look at it. So it might be a win-win for VR users; better visual experience and less GPU stress.

August
 
C:\ProgramData\Microsoft\FSX
C:\Users\{your name}\Documents\Flight Simulator X Files
C:\Users\{your name}\AppData\Local\Microsoft\FSX
C:\Users\{your name}\AppData\Roaming\Microsoft\FSX

I think these are all the locations of the FSX files if I remember correctly
`

Thanks a lot, DB, very helpfull ! :encouragement:

Have them all but 'Documents', probabely because FSX didn't even start yet.
 
Not sure what your problem could be, Jan. If you're getting the menus and stuff to look OK and only having trouble when you start a flight, I'd suspect a graphics setting issue. I assume you've checked the graphics settings and made sure everything looks OK. Be sure NOT to check the "DirectX 10 preview" box. DirectX 9 is a lot more stable and FlyInside requires it anyway.

August

Thanks, August !

Yes, tried various graphic settings, no change, just the black screen with white cursor arrow no matter what i try/do. Ctrl/Alt/Delete won't even work. Have to shut computer down with the on/off knob ( that didn't have to happen for a looooong time..)

About DirectX, currently i am on DX12, Dxdiag says so... What does that mean when i eventually want to try FlyInside ? (i'm no 'DirectXpert' whatsoever...;-)

Btw, DirectX 10 Preview box is unchecked in the FSX menu.

Thanks again my VR friend. :)
 
It's true. As the YouTuber I cited said, this leaves a big gap in the market between cheaper, lower quality units that aren't going to earn many VR converts, and much more expensive units that are a stretch for entry level. There is still a real question whether VR is the future or a fad. A couple of years ago I assumed it was the future, it was just too early for me to adopt. Now some pretty savvy companies seem to be placing their bets on it being a fad. And it's just at the time when the tech seems to be making units even better than the G2, at about the same price point, practical. Since there's not a technical dead end, it must be that these companies think VR isn't catching on with users. Like its inherent shortcomings will always make it a niche thing.

August

Boy! am i glad i followed your advice and bought that G2 just recently ! ;)

I heard in a video about this unfortunate topic that HP will still cover the G2 for atleast 3 years. That's not too bad, is it ?

I think the 'harsh&sharp' unescapable wall between 'the real world' and VR is the main problem for VR not to catch on like it maybe is suppose to do ?... At the same time that's just what makes it so special, isn't it. The immersion is just not comparable with anything else but the real aircraft. Either you're in the real world OR you are in VR. Can't have both....

I was thinking what about VR on our monitor ??... Ok, not really VR but atleast 3D ! Possibly by wearing glasses much more sophisticated than the ol' carton red en green ones from the past. We'd probabely have the same awesome 3D experience as we have now with our G2 but we can still see out peripherals and easily work with them. Cut back in immersion will be quite a lot but it's only the sun that comes up every morning for free..

For years and years we have been flightsimulating happily (ok, more or less..;-) with FSX and P3D, who could've ever expected something like MSFS would be there around the corner ??.. Let's all think positive and it might just happen again ! :)

Btw, thanks much for your "Off-Screen Terrain Pre-Cache" setting tip, certainly going to give that a try ! (atm mine is indeed at Low..)
 
More ideas for your FSX issues.

As long as you haven't checked the DirectX 10 preview button, you should be fine. Your PC can handle that even though you have up to DX12 installed.

Be sure the resolution in your graphics settings screen is set to the same as your actual maximum screen resolution. The oversized mouse cursor makes me think maybe it's not.

Here are two things people have tried to fix this black screen problem:

(1) Delete the file fsx.cfg in the AppData\Roaming folder identified by DennyA. Just to make sure, if there's one in the AppData\Local folder, delete that as well. FSX will rebuild the file the next time it runs. You may have to redo your graphics settings after this, but it will not erase your controls setup.

(2) Rename or delete the file logbook.bin in the Documents\Flight Simulator X Files folder. Again, FSX will build a new one.

August
 
I was thinking what about VR on our monitor ??... Ok, not really VR but atleast 3D ! Possibly by wearing glasses much more sophisticated than the ol' carton red en green ones from the past.

Don't think it would work. You'd have to keep your face locked forward looking at the screen for the glasses to work. Any movement would upset the 3D alignment. Even if you could do it, you'd lose the natural head tracking feature, and you'd have to go back to the hat switch to look around, like before TrackIR. Just speaking for myself, I'm done with that! I could just about stand to watch a 3D video on my screen that way, but not to play a sim.

Speaking of 3D videos, one thing that strikes me as problematic about VR is that it doesn't marry up well with sharing your experience. Even taking screenshots when playing in VR is a chore, or even impossible in some sims that can't switch between VR and pancake mode. Sharing a video is pretty much impossible. I'm aware that there are some YouTubers and Twitch streamers who stream their experiences in VR, but they aren't streaming the VR feed, they're streaming the 2D feed, which their monster gaming rigs somehow have the capacity to both render and capture at the same time as they play in VR. Even if your box can do that, what you're sharing is not the VR experience. Your idea about the glasses might be good for those creators, who could then post a video that someone could experience in 3D. Maybe that would make the experience more accessible and enticing for viewers who have not yet taken the plunge. You can do this now on YouTube with a few split-screen videos like this, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zBa-bCxsZDk, although this one works the "wrong" way, it requires you to cross your eyes so that your left eye is looking at the right half and vice versa.

Or, maybe this is not worthwhile, maybe without the head tracking and 360 view illusion, the viewer will still not "get it" even with 3D. Last weekend when I persuaded my spouse to try my G2, she thought the 3D was great but initially she was holding her head perfectly still. I said, "Look around." She said, "I am looking around." I said, "Not just with your eyes, turn your head." She did - and THEN it really clicked for her what VR is.

To your comment about isolation from the outside world, have you tried the voice command "flashlight on" and "flashlight off" when using your G2? It opens a low-res. b&w portal to see the real world (actually uses the built-in camera that tracks the hand controllers) within your VR screen. It's not great, but at least you can use it for a few seconds to locate your keyboard or your whiskey glass without bailing out of VR. Apparently this is a standard Windows Mixed Reality voice command, and the G2 supports all of the commands described at this link, https://support.microsoft.com/en-us...-reality-af24e0a9-7e17-b542-3720-203e278e588e. I have been meaning to test whether any of the others do anything useful when in MSFS.

August
 
No FSX for me for the time being, August. I have hung down my head Tom Dooley and i have cried. Done just about anything but throw my rig out the window, all i get is this godforsaking black screen and cursor. Not only deleted everything from the folders DB suggested, i also found an abundage of files still in the Steamapps/common/FSX folder. In any case, deleted everything i could find, reboot and re-install FSX, beautiful black screen only result. :banghead: (btw, that BIG cursor arrow happend indeed *before* i changed the graphics settings..;-)

Still have the original FSX Deluxe box, maybe i'll try that later. Du moment i am sick of it as you can imagine. The ol' B-25 and F-86 in VR will have to wait until eventually i find a solution.

Btw, i am certainly not unfamiliar with black screens. A very annoying problem has returned for quite some time already on my (relatively) new system: every now and then my monitor screen turns black for a second. Used to have that as well with 2 of my former systems a few years ago. Difference was that the black screen then was accompanied by a warning message saying something like "your display driver stopped responding and has recovered". Now it just turns black with no warning.

Surely it proved i was not the only one with this irritating problem. Also many solutions turned up of which i tried just about all without zero success. Talk about irritating annoyances ! The thought did cross my mind what if FSX not wanting to start has something to do with this black screen problem.

Btw, great tip about the G2 voicecommand "flaslight on/off" ! I'll certainly give that a go ! I bet much better than putting that headset on my forehead !! Hehe..

Thanks again, August! :encouragement:
 
hung down my head Tom Dooley

Disappointing! I expected this weekend you would say you had FSX running and needed a couple days to rebuild your favorite scenery, then we could wrestle with FlyInside and compare notes on the 3D FSX experience.

Normally I would say to try to stick with Steam Ed and try to make it work; at least that version has received a modicum of support to make it work with more recent OSs. But if you are at a dead end there, maybe the box is worth a try.

You probably logged a lot more hours on these old FSs back in the day than me, so I can't presume to teach you anything. The FSX download from Steam has worked well for me on my last 3 or 4 Win 9/10/11 boxes. That momentary black screen does sound familiar, I think I experienced it on my previous computer before this one.

Currently on MSFS, about a third of my sessions end with a little dialog box saying my graphics card has encountered an error and CTD. The AMD Adrenalin utility is no help, even in the screen devoted to MSFS it just tells me everything is peachy and asks am I sure I don't want to try overclocking? Nice error trapping there AMD.

I will let you know if I find or think of any more possible solutions.

Back to MSFS for a moment. Today I decided to try reactivating the GAIST ship traffic mod which I had turned off for the sake of VR performance. The oceans and Great Lakes were just looking too barren. Pleased to report that GAIST has no impact on frame rates that I can discern, and the ships still look good. I have my AI ship traffic set to 6. All other AI planes and vehicles are still off for now.

August
 
BTW Jan, when you launch FSX, you are running it as Administrator, correct? I have had all kinds of problems when I forget to do that, so I've set the properties of the exe to always run as admin.

August
 
BINGO !!

Proved i was only one click away all the time, August : check DX10 Preview ! How about that, huh.. ;)

Thought i'd give it one last try for now and search for black screen at the Steam FSX forum (not sure why i forgat about that. I use these Steam forums a lot be it for a few other games i play. Workshops are particularly amazing). Somebody mentioned that MS stopped support for DX9 recently and that it may well cause a black screen on new installations of FSXSE. Adviced to try DX10 Preview mode. Et voila !!

This gentlemen furthermore adviced to patch FSX DX10 mode by installing Steve's latest shaders mods. I remember that from when FSX was still our one and only playground and sky.

Actually very much enjoyed my first glance at FSX again (started up in 2 seconds. Wow!!...;-) First thing i did was hit that 'Fly-By' camera mode. Boy! do i miss that in MSFS !!

Kinda pretty late now or better pretty early.... so i'll get some sleep first then i am going to very much enjoy playing around with FSX the whole day ! Hehe

Vey happy it finally works ! :encouragement:
 
Well ... that's good, but before we break out the champagne, I have to tell you that FlyInside won't work in DX10 and will force your FSX back to DX9 mode. Steve's shaders mod will also go to waste, I'm afraid.

My advice now that you have FSX working is to go download the free trial of FlyInside-FSX and see if it works. The free trial is full featured and works forever, but only for 15 minutes per session. Since FlyInside is still being marketed and supported for FSX-SE, maybe the package includes whatever DLLs are required to patch your FSX so that it still works in DX9, or at least the installer might look for them and offer a link to go get them. If not, I have found the support guys to be responsive and helpful so far.

When you go to run FlyInside, make sure that it, too, is being run in Administrator mode. When you use FlyInside you'll be launching FSX from a batch file rather than directly or from Steam. Set that batch file to run as Admin. This is not mentioned in the documentation and it cost me a couple of hours to figure out when I first tried it.

August
 
This thread may help you get FSX-SE running in DX9 mode -- or it may not.

https://steamcommunity.com/app/314160/discussions/0/494632506577902933/

I checked my own install, from April 2020, and the indicated files/paths are not present in my FSX install. However, I did find them in:

E:\Steam\steamapps\common\Steamworks Shared\_CommonRedist\DirectX\Jun2010

Mine might have already been in my common Steam folder because I was already playing some ancient game from Steam, like Half-Life 1 or something.

So search your entire Steam folder tree for either Jun2010_d3dx9_43_x64.cab or dxsetup.exe and hopefully you should find it.

If not, I think this is just the same as the legacy DX package that I referenced earlier in this thread.

August
 
I think August is right, your missing the DirectX End-User Runtimes.

I wouldn't even bother searching through your Steam folder for it, just download it direct from Microsoft using the link he gave earlier.
Even if it turns out that it isn't the problem installing it wont have any negative effects on your system.
 
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