Gauges for Combat Flight Simulator
- Thread starter Ivan
- Start date
Thanks for the offer Smilo,
I am actually so far along that I think I will try to program my own version first.
My technicians intend to become a full service shop without any subcontracting.
I am sure that at some point, they may want to experiment with other versions of the same type of gauge though.
By the way, those screws in your screenshot look a little strange.
Do you want my technicians to send over a pack of screws?
All they have is slotted at the moment, but eventually will be have some Phillips screws in inventory.
- Ivan.
I am actually so far along that I think I will try to program my own version first.
My technicians intend to become a full service shop without any subcontracting.
I am sure that at some point, they may want to experiment with other versions of the same type of gauge though.
By the way, those screws in your screenshot look a little strange.
Do you want my technicians to send over a pack of screws?
All they have is slotted at the moment, but eventually will be have some Phillips screws in inventory.
- Ivan.
Stock P-51D Coolant Temperature Gauge
I have been wondering for some time why it appeared that the stock P51D Coolant Temperature Gauge appeared not to move at all. I looked around at other places I had used that gauge and it didn't see to work there either.
I was poking around for other things and came across this thread in the CFS2 Forums.
Note that I was involved in that discussion as well, but apparently I did not recall what KelticHeart has stated in Post #11.
http://www.sim-outhouse.com/sohforums/showthread.php/87065-P-40-Warhawk-panel-V2
- Ivan.
I have been wondering for some time why it appeared that the stock P51D Coolant Temperature Gauge appeared not to move at all. I looked around at other places I had used that gauge and it didn't see to work there either.
I was poking around for other things and came across this thread in the CFS2 Forums.
Note that I was involved in that discussion as well, but apparently I did not recall what KelticHeart has stated in Post #11.
http://www.sim-outhouse.com/sohforums/showthread.php/87065-P-40-Warhawk-panel-V2
- Ivan.
Japanee 400 mm Manifold Pressure Gauge
For the Kawasaki Ki 61-I Project, I have been working on a Manifold Pressure Gauge.
The Gauge background and needle were finished last night and most of the programming (FS98 Gauge) was also done last night.
It was a pretty simple matter of converting the existing code from one of my other Manifold Pressure Gauges to work with the new images.
Attached is a Screenshot from the first test of the gauge running at about 39 inches / +240 mm.
It can be compared to a real gauge from a Ki 46 Dinah.
There are some very slight issues as with anything for which all the programming is done before anything is seen:
1. Note that there is a White Dot in the middle of the Pointer.
This is intended to check the alignment of the Gauge Needle and rotation with the background.
It looks to be no more than one or two pixels off at most which is really finer than can be seen when the gauge is in use.
The dot will be removed which is simple but I want to do some more alignment testing for other reasons.
2. The Pointer alignment with the -40 mark (not seen in this screenshot) appears to be a couple pixels off but I do not know why.
This is the first time I have gone back to program a FS98 Gauge in a while, so I need to check the numbers again because they are not exactly the same as for a FS2000 / CFS Gauge.
3. Note that there is a Sky Blue Ring between the actual gauge face and bezel.
To correct this issue is very easy. The fact that it exists is a bit worrisome because it is not even around the entire circle.
Note that it is wider at the top. This means that there is some asymmetry in the assembly process that I do not know about yet.
Doing a few minor corrections should not be difficult nor should converting this to an equivalent CFS Multi Gauge.
Some folks might be wondering why I am building the first version as a FS98 Gauge instead of a FS2000 / CFS Gauge.
The main reason is that the conversion factor for Manifold Pressure is very well defined for FS98 and not quite so well defined for FS2000.
This gauge will also be modified to compare results between an identical FS98 and FS2000 gauge so that a better conversion factor can be determined experimentally.
(At least that is the current plan. We shall see if it works.)
- Ivan.
For the Kawasaki Ki 61-I Project, I have been working on a Manifold Pressure Gauge.
The Gauge background and needle were finished last night and most of the programming (FS98 Gauge) was also done last night.
It was a pretty simple matter of converting the existing code from one of my other Manifold Pressure Gauges to work with the new images.
Attached is a Screenshot from the first test of the gauge running at about 39 inches / +240 mm.
It can be compared to a real gauge from a Ki 46 Dinah.
There are some very slight issues as with anything for which all the programming is done before anything is seen:
1. Note that there is a White Dot in the middle of the Pointer.
This is intended to check the alignment of the Gauge Needle and rotation with the background.
It looks to be no more than one or two pixels off at most which is really finer than can be seen when the gauge is in use.
The dot will be removed which is simple but I want to do some more alignment testing for other reasons.
2. The Pointer alignment with the -40 mark (not seen in this screenshot) appears to be a couple pixels off but I do not know why.
This is the first time I have gone back to program a FS98 Gauge in a while, so I need to check the numbers again because they are not exactly the same as for a FS2000 / CFS Gauge.
3. Note that there is a Sky Blue Ring between the actual gauge face and bezel.
To correct this issue is very easy. The fact that it exists is a bit worrisome because it is not even around the entire circle.
Note that it is wider at the top. This means that there is some asymmetry in the assembly process that I do not know about yet.
Doing a few minor corrections should not be difficult nor should converting this to an equivalent CFS Multi Gauge.
Some folks might be wondering why I am building the first version as a FS98 Gauge instead of a FS2000 / CFS Gauge.
The main reason is that the conversion factor for Manifold Pressure is very well defined for FS98 and not quite so well defined for FS2000.
This gauge will also be modified to compare results between an identical FS98 and FS2000 gauge so that a better conversion factor can be determined experimentally.
(At least that is the current plan. We shall see if it works.)
- Ivan.
Attachments
Checking for Concentricity
The bleeds in the Gauge Face were pretty easy to remove; Just fill them in with something dark that isn't "Black".
The way that I generally check the centering of the Pointer on the Background and the Center of Rotation of the Pointer itself is to leave a little transparent area at the center of the needle surrounded by a light coloured ring.
The Background also has an odd coloured spot inside a small light coloured "circle".
This makes it more obvious when either part is not centered correctly.
It turns out that I was correct in my guess. The Pointer needed to be shifted one pixel in X and one pixel in Y directions.
The FS98 code also requires one additional parameter: The "Point" of the Pointer that needs to be aligned with various tick marks.
That also needed a slight adjustment because apparently there needs to be a slight separation between the "Point" and the Tick Mark.
I am not entirely certain of this but changing it appeared to improve things.
Filling in the transparent spots and the white ring and a subsequent recompile took just a few seconds.
So now the Gauge is ready to use. I just need a panel to try it on.
- Ivan.
The bleeds in the Gauge Face were pretty easy to remove; Just fill them in with something dark that isn't "Black".
The way that I generally check the centering of the Pointer on the Background and the Center of Rotation of the Pointer itself is to leave a little transparent area at the center of the needle surrounded by a light coloured ring.
The Background also has an odd coloured spot inside a small light coloured "circle".
This makes it more obvious when either part is not centered correctly.
It turns out that I was correct in my guess. The Pointer needed to be shifted one pixel in X and one pixel in Y directions.
The FS98 code also requires one additional parameter: The "Point" of the Pointer that needs to be aligned with various tick marks.
That also needed a slight adjustment because apparently there needs to be a slight separation between the "Point" and the Tick Mark.
I am not entirely certain of this but changing it appeared to improve things.
Filling in the transparent spots and the white ring and a subsequent recompile took just a few seconds.
So now the Gauge is ready to use. I just need a panel to try it on.
- Ivan.
Attachments
aleatorylamp
Charter Member
Hello Ivan,
The new gauge certainly looks very good! It has a different overall look to it fro the usual. Very nice!
Cheers,
Aleatorylamp
The new gauge certainly looks very good! It has a different overall look to it fro the usual. Very nice!
Cheers,
Aleatorylamp
Test Gauges
The next gauge project is actually just a conversion of the Trim Test Gauge (Elevator) from FS98 code format to FS2000 code format.
It SHOULD be a simple project but so far is not working out that way.
The problem with gauge programming is that when things do not work, often there is just a crash of the simulator and there are no error messages.
Time to start over with the FS2000 SDK example because I have certainly missed something though I have no idea what it could be.
- Ivan.
The next gauge project is actually just a conversion of the Trim Test Gauge (Elevator) from FS98 code format to FS2000 code format.
It SHOULD be a simple project but so far is not working out that way.
The problem with gauge programming is that when things do not work, often there is just a crash of the simulator and there are no error messages.
Time to start over with the FS2000 SDK example because I have certainly missed something though I have no idea what it could be.
- Ivan.
Certainty of a Path
Hello Smilo,
I actually have much less certainty that there really is a solution.
So far, the Slider does not work for FS2000 SDK but works just fine for FS98 SDK.
The Digital Gauge does not work for FS98 but works for FS2000.
The Mouse features do not seem to work for the FS2000 SDK either.
Perhaps it is a compiler compatibility problem???
So, all I really know is that I can program Dial Indicator Gauges.
The problem is that where I want to use a slider indicator is on a Token Variable that does not exist in the FS98 SDK.....
This morning I was experimenting with finding the proper conversion factor for Manifold Pressure and believe I have it accurate to about 5 significant digits. I hope my method did not "create" precision where there really isn't any. I need to check my maths to confirm that I did not do anything stupid.
New value is 70.725
Old value was 70.64
- Ivan.
Hello Smilo,
I actually have much less certainty that there really is a solution.
So far, the Slider does not work for FS2000 SDK but works just fine for FS98 SDK.
The Digital Gauge does not work for FS98 but works for FS2000.
The Mouse features do not seem to work for the FS2000 SDK either.
Perhaps it is a compiler compatibility problem???
So, all I really know is that I can program Dial Indicator Gauges.
The problem is that where I want to use a slider indicator is on a Token Variable that does not exist in the FS98 SDK.....
This morning I was experimenting with finding the proper conversion factor for Manifold Pressure and believe I have it accurate to about 5 significant digits. I hope my method did not "create" precision where there really isn't any. I need to check my maths to confirm that I did not do anything stupid.
New value is 70.725
Old value was 70.64
- Ivan.
After a few more experiments, it appears that it probably isn't the Slider that does not work.
Instead, it appears that the Token Variable I am trying to use does not work; it crashes every time the simulator tries to load.
It probably works just fine with FS2000 but does not work for CFS where I need it.
- Ivan.
Instead, it appears that the Token Variable I am trying to use does not work; it crashes every time the simulator tries to load.
It probably works just fine with FS2000 but does not work for CFS where I need it.
- Ivan.
On a Different Note
I needed a 550 Liter Fuel Gauge for my Blohm & Voss BV 141B project.
My original intent was to try to get something working as a FS98 Gauge but that did not work well because this flight model uses the Center1 and Center2 Tanks and Center2 is not accessible to FS98 style Gauges.
After a little experimentation, here is the result. Note that the test "aeroplane" is a 4 Engine Overboosted P-38 Lightning.
(The overboosting was the result of testing Manifold Pressure conversion factor used in the FS2000 SDK.)
Note that with 4 x 1600 HP Engines, 350 Liters of fuel does not last long.
You can literally see the needle drop.
I now need to figure out how to incorporate this new Gauge into a reasonable panel for the BV 141B.
In testing with the BV 141B, I found a few faults I had not noticed up to this point:
1. There is a very small bleed between the Engine and Pod Frame when viewed directly from the Starboard side.
2. The aeroplane is not very stable in Pitch.
Constructing this gauge also cleared up a few things about how CFS handles fuel tank selections because there is no fuel selector on my Gauge Testing Panel.
- Ivan.
I needed a 550 Liter Fuel Gauge for my Blohm & Voss BV 141B project.
My original intent was to try to get something working as a FS98 Gauge but that did not work well because this flight model uses the Center1 and Center2 Tanks and Center2 is not accessible to FS98 style Gauges.
After a little experimentation, here is the result. Note that the test "aeroplane" is a 4 Engine Overboosted P-38 Lightning.
(The overboosting was the result of testing Manifold Pressure conversion factor used in the FS2000 SDK.)
Note that with 4 x 1600 HP Engines, 350 Liters of fuel does not last long.
You can literally see the needle drop.
I now need to figure out how to incorporate this new Gauge into a reasonable panel for the BV 141B.
In testing with the BV 141B, I found a few faults I had not noticed up to this point:
1. There is a very small bleed between the Engine and Pod Frame when viewed directly from the Starboard side.
2. The aeroplane is not very stable in Pitch.
Constructing this gauge also cleared up a few things about how CFS handles fuel tank selections because there is no fuel selector on my Gauge Testing Panel.
- Ivan.
Attachments
Trim Gauges
As it turns out, there probably is no point in converting the FS98 Trim Test Gauge to FS2000 format because there is nothing to be gained except one more level of indirection.
The original idea was to program a set of Trim Gauges for Elevator, Aileron, and Rudder, but it seems that CFS is the same as FS98 in that there is ONLY the Elevator Trim Indicator Token Variable available so a Trim Gauge Set is not really possible.
After programming the Japanese Manifold Pressure Gauge, it seemed to me that it would work pretty well as a Elevator Trim Indicator as well.
Creating the Tick Marks for the scale is usually the hardest part and I figured that rotating the Dial 90 degrees and redoing the labels would be a pretty simple solution for the basis of a gauge that would be precise and not look out of place on the actual control panel instead of just be useful on test panels.
I also decided to go back to the FS98 Gauge format to avoid the extra Multi Gauge indirection of the FS2000 SDK.
The result seems to work pretty well and a Trim Indicator Gauge was absolutely essential for the BV 141B instrument panel as will be explained elsewhere.
- Ivan.
As it turns out, there probably is no point in converting the FS98 Trim Test Gauge to FS2000 format because there is nothing to be gained except one more level of indirection.
The original idea was to program a set of Trim Gauges for Elevator, Aileron, and Rudder, but it seems that CFS is the same as FS98 in that there is ONLY the Elevator Trim Indicator Token Variable available so a Trim Gauge Set is not really possible.
After programming the Japanese Manifold Pressure Gauge, it seemed to me that it would work pretty well as a Elevator Trim Indicator as well.
Creating the Tick Marks for the scale is usually the hardest part and I figured that rotating the Dial 90 degrees and redoing the labels would be a pretty simple solution for the basis of a gauge that would be precise and not look out of place on the actual control panel instead of just be useful on test panels.
I also decided to go back to the FS98 Gauge format to avoid the extra Multi Gauge indirection of the FS2000 SDK.
The result seems to work pretty well and a Trim Indicator Gauge was absolutely essential for the BV 141B instrument panel as will be explained elsewhere.
- Ivan.
Attachments
aleatorylamp
Charter Member
Hello Ivan,
Nice trim gauge!
I have always felt that a kind of circular trim indicator gives a better feel, so it will be much more practical to use.
Cheers,
Aleatorylamp
Nice trim gauge!
I have always felt that a kind of circular trim indicator gives a better feel, so it will be much more practical to use.
Cheers,
Aleatorylamp
i've spent quite a bit of time searching
for multi engine magneto switches.
i've actually found a few, but,
none seem to function as i would like.
so, my question is,
how difficult is it to modify
the stock Hurricane_1!Magneto gauge
to function for engines #2, #3 and #4?
by chance is there a gauge edit tutorial somewhere?
for multi engine magneto switches.
i've actually found a few, but,
none seem to function as i would like.
so, my question is,
how difficult is it to modify
the stock Hurricane_1!Magneto gauge
to function for engines #2, #3 and #4?
by chance is there a gauge edit tutorial somewhere?
Hello Smilo,
Up to this point, I can't get the mouse functions to work with even the SDK example gauges, thus I can't program anything that responds to a mouse click or mouse-over.
I am using MS Visual Studio 2005 and I presume that it can be done. Perhaps it is a compiler flag that I am not using?
I have no idea.
If I could figure out the mouse functions, there would be no issue programming a bunch more gauges, but until then, all I can program is indicators.
My original goal was to program some Fuel Selectors and Engine Controls, but those all require mouse functions.
- Ivan.
Up to this point, I can't get the mouse functions to work with even the SDK example gauges, thus I can't program anything that responds to a mouse click or mouse-over.
I am using MS Visual Studio 2005 and I presume that it can be done. Perhaps it is a compiler flag that I am not using?
I have no idea.
If I could figure out the mouse functions, there would be no issue programming a bunch more gauges, but until then, all I can program is indicators.
My original goal was to program some Fuel Selectors and Engine Controls, but those all require mouse functions.
- Ivan.
thanks for your reply, Kwong.
i'm sorry to hear your having issues with the programing.
i was hoping it would be relatively easy
to copy the single engine hurricane magneto,
then, rename it and change the engine # call.
i saw no need to change the way it works,
just which engine it works on.
i guess nothing is ever easy, is it?
heck, i'd try it myself,
but, haven't a clue how to open a .gau file
and then, what to look for if i could.
by the way, i did find exacly what i was looking for.
the four engine magnetos and starter switches
were built by chuck dome.
the readme says they are for fs2000, cfs2
and cfs air files...okay fine.
if i drop one in a panel and select that aircraft,
cfs shuts down and wants to send an error message.
damn the luck
i'm sorry to hear your having issues with the programing.
i was hoping it would be relatively easy
to copy the single engine hurricane magneto,
then, rename it and change the engine # call.
i saw no need to change the way it works,
just which engine it works on.
i guess nothing is ever easy, is it?
heck, i'd try it myself,
but, haven't a clue how to open a .gau file
and then, what to look for if i could.
by the way, i did find exacly what i was looking for.
the four engine magnetos and starter switches
were built by chuck dome.
the readme says they are for fs2000, cfs2
and cfs air files...okay fine.
if i drop one in a panel and select that aircraft,
cfs shuts down and wants to send an error message.
damn the luck
Hello Smilo,
Actually it isn't issues with the programming.
It is more like issues with the compilers and has been that way nearly from the start.
The process of "Duplicating" gauges isn't quite what you think it is.
It isn't a matter of breaking down a .GAU file because you would really get much more than a few Bitmaps and perhaps a basic framework for the gauge. The "guts" of the gauge simply do not decompile for the most part.
In other words, there isn't much to know about how to open up a .GAU file because it won't really help.
What I do / did with the German gauges that Aleatorylamp is using was to pull the bitmaps from a stock CFS gauge and then program all the workings behind them by using some of the SDK template gauges as a guide.
So while these new gauges look the same, there really is nothing behind the scenes that is from the original other than the bitmaps.
The biggest problem with the mouse issue is that while I am a pretty good C programmer, I usually work in the Unix environment and don't have a background in programming for the Windows environment. The compiler I am using is one that I had from many years back and never used for much more than simple ANSI C programming.
I am still guessing it is something fairly simple such as a matter of compiler flags or libraries but haven't spent the time to figure things out.
With the recent issue with Japanese Manifold Pressure baseline, I will need to go back and do some minor modifications to some gauges pretty soon anyway, so maybe I will take another look at the mouse issue.
- Ivan.
Actually it isn't issues with the programming.
It is more like issues with the compilers and has been that way nearly from the start.
The process of "Duplicating" gauges isn't quite what you think it is.
It isn't a matter of breaking down a .GAU file because you would really get much more than a few Bitmaps and perhaps a basic framework for the gauge. The "guts" of the gauge simply do not decompile for the most part.
In other words, there isn't much to know about how to open up a .GAU file because it won't really help.
What I do / did with the German gauges that Aleatorylamp is using was to pull the bitmaps from a stock CFS gauge and then program all the workings behind them by using some of the SDK template gauges as a guide.
So while these new gauges look the same, there really is nothing behind the scenes that is from the original other than the bitmaps.
The biggest problem with the mouse issue is that while I am a pretty good C programmer, I usually work in the Unix environment and don't have a background in programming for the Windows environment. The compiler I am using is one that I had from many years back and never used for much more than simple ANSI C programming.
I am still guessing it is something fairly simple such as a matter of compiler flags or libraries but haven't spent the time to figure things out.
With the recent issue with Japanese Manifold Pressure baseline, I will need to go back and do some minor modifications to some gauges pretty soon anyway, so maybe I will take another look at the mouse issue.
- Ivan.
Hello Smilo,
Obviously it is possible. Others have already done it. I just got into the Gauge Programming deal about a decade after most other folks quit working on them, thus I don't expect to be getting too much help or have anyone to ask for guidance.
I am interested and am willing to do the programming but haven't found the right development environment to make things work the way I want yet. Perhaps I will live long enough for that to happen. Perhaps I won't.
It took a few years to first find a compiler that works reliably with the FS98 SDK to build a few gauges and then a couple more years to figure out that the FS2000 SDK was more suited to CFS. If others were still working there, those issues could have been resolved in a couple days.....
These days, it is a matter of stumbling around until I bump into something useful and recognize it as useful.
I haven't given up yet, but it also isn't my top priority at the moment.... unless I come across something.
- Ivan.
Obviously it is possible. Others have already done it. I just got into the Gauge Programming deal about a decade after most other folks quit working on them, thus I don't expect to be getting too much help or have anyone to ask for guidance.
I am interested and am willing to do the programming but haven't found the right development environment to make things work the way I want yet. Perhaps I will live long enough for that to happen. Perhaps I won't.
It took a few years to first find a compiler that works reliably with the FS98 SDK to build a few gauges and then a couple more years to figure out that the FS2000 SDK was more suited to CFS. If others were still working there, those issues could have been resolved in a couple days.....
These days, it is a matter of stumbling around until I bump into something useful and recognize it as useful.
I haven't given up yet, but it also isn't my top priority at the moment.... unless I come across something.
- Ivan.